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If you have the capacity to tremble with indignation every time that an injustice is committed in the world, then we are comrades. – Che.

Archived Discussions

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For you

El C, contrary to your edit summary- I noticed you were gone, and missed seeing you on recent changes. You are one of my favourite editors. This is for you. Regards, dvdrw 04:34, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Yay! Many chipthanks for the kind words. Greatly appreciated. Best, El_C 06:49, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

Well I noticed and missed you! (Official circular here). Novickas (talk) 12:40, 30 September 2008 (UTC) Thought of you while uploading this picture ... for all of your work. Novickas (talk) 17:35, 14 October 2008 (UTC)

Many thanks! El_C 11:27, 3 November 2008 (UTC)

I'm sort of in a hole and am having difficulties submerging. Speaking of holes/that chippie, I got to do some visiting in its burro recently...

You look really good in your purple hat! Bishonen | talk 00:19, 4 November 2008 (UTC).

Free hat! Today, while cheekadeepetting, this lady who saw us from a far, came over and said: "Can I tell you something...? You're an angel of God."(!) To which I of course replied: "All hail Atheismo!" I took an especially neat cheekadeepetting photograph today: it remained visible between my thumb and index as it flew away, giving the illusion it was bee-sized! What an unexpected, and sweet, effect! El_C 02:48, 5 November 2008 (UTC)

Wow, Capitano, where do you get a large enough sweater for a person with that hand? Bishonen | talk 20:18, 5 November 2008 (UTC).

And then there's Skunky! El_C 14:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Oooo. Purdy!

Combine obvious love of animals with photography results in photographic win! — Coren  15:09, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! Great to learn that peoples (plural!) like! Chickadee says hi! El_C 14:00, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Seasons Greetings

Hello. Thanks, SqueakBox 23:14, 24 December 2008 (UTC)

Thx, everyone! Happy 2009! El_C 12:55, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Happy Groundhog Day

Happy day! Jehochman 19:52, 2 February 2009 (UTC)

Chippies

El C, I've been meaning to ask for ages. What is the link between revolutionary socialism and chimpunks? Did I miss that bit in Animal Farm? Is it something to do with resting the means of damn making from beavers? --Joopercoopers (talk) 11:39, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

No link; but are you referring to Groundhog? (see left) There is a Groundhog-Chippie connection, which I was trying to further cultivate (see right). El_C 11:48, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

"Love is in the air ....dooooo .....dooo.dooo ......doooo ......dooo.doooo ." --Joopercoopers (talk) 11:55, 3 August 2009 (UTC)

Well, I'm envious. You get to pet ALL the fuzzeh creatures!  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  01:40, 9 November 2019 (UTC)

Book?

Let me know when it is out, and you will up your sales by one. :-) KillerChihuahua 09:22, 10 September 2012 (UTC)

4Tality Fractal

Rev-dels

Just for information at the moment: are you able to do revision deletions? Thanks. - BilCat (talk) 19:47, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

Affirmative. El_C 20:46, 16 May 2019 (UTC)

OK, thanks. There are a couple of admins I usually contact when I see something that needs to deleted, but unfortunately they let real life interfere with their admin duties. You are online a lot at the same times I am, so it's good to have another person to contact if needed. I generally only ask personally if it's both serious and urgent. - BilCat (talk) 02:29, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Yes, by all means. If I'm around, please don't hesitate. El_C 02:30, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Thanks very much. I realize.my wording above presumes you'd be willing, and that I didn't actually ask, so thanks. :) - BilCat (talk) 04:01, 17 May 2019 (UTC)

Romania

I can live with your highly arbitrary closing summary of the RfC on the Talk page, so I do not want to persuade you to change it. However, you closed other on-going debates as well. Could you open the other debates? Thank you. Borsoka (talk) 05:57, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

Ah, the thanks I get! El_C 05:58, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

And all I got was a ^^^

• Talk:And Then There Were None#RfC: And Then There Were None and racial language
• Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Politics#Request for comments on the 'political position' parameter of the political party infobox
• Talk:Romania#RfC
• Misplaced Pages:Reliable sources/Noticeboard#RfC: HispanTV
• Misplaced Pages talk:Requests for adminship#Is RfX a vote, or a consensus discussion? (RfC)
• Talk:Civil Rights Act of 1968#Merger of Fair Housing Act and Indian Civil Rights Act of 1968 into this article
• Talk:WikiLeaks#RFC: Murder Of Seth Rich content dispute
• Talk:Athens News#Request for comment
• Talk:SNC-Lavalin affair#RfC: LavScam
• Talk:Christchurch mosque shootings#RfC: Change "white supremacist" to "white nationalist"

El_C 06:06, 19 May 2019 (UTC)

Precious anniversary

Precious

Three years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:11, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Nice. Thanks, Gerda! El_C 08:24, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. Good day, see? Take music and flowers to your liking ;) - It's great to see your name so often on my watchlist. One area where I often wait for admin action - not now - is WP:ITNN, where we nominate for recent deaths to be shown on th Main page, and often the time between an article found and then is seems long to still call it recent. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:32, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Ah, good ol' ITNC —where I got no credit for being the first to have  Posted the Corona virus outbreak, but upon (admittedly, perhaps somewhat prematurely) doing the same for the Kirk Douglas RD got a what-the-fuck-barbeque— it's a magical place! El_C 11:28, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

I see, sorry for touching some wound ;) - Same for me: last year, I nominated a great pianist for RD, after I first had create an article which took time, and then carried away to also make it decent, - and by then her death was so long ago that she wasn't mentioned at all. The more woman, and the more foreign, that danger seems imminent, and if I may bother you in case I seee it coming again, that would be great. At present, it's a man, listed 20 Feb (although who knows if that was the day?), and nobody even commented yet, so nothing to be concerned about right now. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:27, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Hey, by all means, if you feel Peter Dreher is , let me know so I could do the honours. El_C 12:53, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

I nominated him, so am not the most independent to judge ;) - and I'm already busy with the next, a woman, but mostly not foreign. - I really think we have some unintended bias there: the most prominent figures (white U.S. males) get speedy attention, and appear soon at the top position, while the female foreigners - often reported late to start with - take so long to even be noticed that they get only a place towards the end, finally, - as long as we go by date of death and not "in at the top". Result: those who are promminent already get preferred showing, more in front, and longer. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:04, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

Indeed, countering systemic bias is a treacherous mistress — though in the case of Kirk Douglas, I have to admit my own affinity for his admirable work countering the Hollywood blacklist... Anyway, +Peter Dreher to RD. El_C 13:16, 23 February 2020 (UTC)

February flowers

Alte Liebe

Thank you, love-ly! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:42, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

I nominated the poet for ITNN. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:36, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

At the ! El_C 14:48, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

and posted ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:28, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

That was quick! I helped? El_C 17:33, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

think so ;) - today's Alte Liebe became especially meaningful after yesterday's funeral. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:21, 28 February 2020 (UTC)

Next foreign women RD: Odile Pierre. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:12, 2 March 2020 (UTC)

@Gerda Arendt: sorry for the belated response — I overlooked your last message. Apologies for not being able to assist with that one. Please don't hesitate to list more. I'll try to be more cognizant of this thread next time, I promise. El_C 03:28, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Gerda's corner

To help me better remember! El_C 05:10, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Gerda’s corner is lovely. When I have more time in my life and can do things beyond blocking socks, I plan to spend time there getting some of the Holy Thursday hymns on the main page. Gerda, if it’s not too late to find one, let me know. The Pange Lingua is always a first choice, but if there are any others you can think of, I’m open. TonyBallioni (talk) 05:26, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Also, El C’s talk page is lovely, especially for his hosting my musing about music he likely doesn’t care about one iota! TonyBallioni (talk) 05:28, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Actually, I like all kinds of music, including of the eclectic and esoteric variaty — lately I've been Dimashing it up (special thanks goes to Jasmin Ariane!). El_C 05:32, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Lovely corner, thank you! Today is The day of music, two choirs singing. I'd like Beati improved - but it's in the evensong, perhaps I'll get to a few more lines. On IWD, I should also get Elinor Ross in better shape ... - but singing comes first. Listen to Beati by voces8, another article needing improvement. Singing comes first ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:41, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

On the ITNN page, 6 Mar, Carsten Bresch. We will possibly never know when he died, but should use 6 - when the world was informed - as the day by which we go. I may be alone with that view ;) - Lovely lively colours! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:24, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Expect the sky to fall at ITNC — posted with Mar 0? (!). El_C 13:34, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for posting, and I added "Posted", but don't want to pass credits. DYK you know that it is as easy as clicking on the words "credit" in the nom? Nice progress on the soprano, but out for singing (alto), second round. A good source for her death would be a nice addition, anyone. this is all Spanish to me, and the English one is a blog. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:04, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

nom done, and the credits were done by someone else - bedtime --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:19, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

Sleep tight. El_C 23:27, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

done also, and she's there - today's topic seem to be errors (3) in the OTD section of the Main page. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:28, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

Amakuru took care of that! - What should I do about this decline? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:58, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

If you're confident it's good, I would move it to main namespace nonetheless. El_C 10:07, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

How about you? - I asked the decliner for reasoning, but got no answer. I think it might be better if it's not a personal thing between them and me, so an independent pair of eyes might help. - I don't go via AfC, nor does my friend LouisAlain, but last year many of his translations were sent to draft space, for lack of refs, just because de and fr have different ideas about referencing. I try to rescue, that's all. Then get a ridiculous template on my talk recommending the Teahouse, and still see the ridiculous decline template recommending to seek help from an experienced editor, - the things we do to voluntary contributors ... --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:31, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

 Done. Mainspacified. And I didn't even visit the Teahouse! El_C 13:37, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

pacified ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:26, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for tagging me, El_C! Concerning Dimash: Oh wow, I really didn't expect that! But I'm happy you enjoy it! It's funny, it's not even a genre I usually listen to. But the first time I heard him 2 years ago, I immediately loved his music. I love his voice, his emotional interpretation; and his vocal skill, range and versatility are just enormous. And he seems to be a very nice and humble guy, which makes it even easier to like him. PS: "eclectic and esoteric variety"? Wow, that sounds interesting. Jasmin Ariane (talk) 21:55, 9 March 2020 (UTC)

♫ Welcome to the corner, Jasmin! Yes, I love Dimash's Sinful Passion, New Wave, SOS d'un terrien en détresse, Ogni Pietra (Olimpico), Opera 2, and more. Indeed, music-wise, I'm all over the place. Yesterday, I was listening to the Mahavishnu Orchestra, I'm listening to Charlie Byrd right now (because I love bossa nova, above all else), and I'm listening to the China Philharmonic Orchestra in the car currently. So, yeah, all over the place. Welcome, again! ♫ El_C 16:47, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

Gerda's February corner

Hellebore

Want a drink in darkness? - Schloss Freudenberg --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:38, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Somehow, I don't really see that concept spreading to other bars... Back to out previous conversation, somewhat, a different kind of Green: "MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE - A Randy Rainbow Song Parody" (just released). El_C 14:51, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

I missed Mathsci for two years. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:14, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Criss-crossing paths... El_C 15:16, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

BWV 1, concertante violin 1 --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:19, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

That's right, I remember seeing that. El_C 15:24, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Did you ever click on Reformation on my user page, first occurence? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:02, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Yes, I have clicked on all of the (longstanding) links on your userpage. El_C 16:08, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

I am impressed. ... and follow to what the first 2 had discussed, and used, and then one of them needed it, and probably had known that all the time? ... which was my user page lead until 2021 when I decided people hovering over my name should see a pic I took. The last time I used it was for Cassianto, 24 May 2020. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:51, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Sure, but otherwise, your userpage isn't easy to parse, due to the fact that you actually use it. I edit mine like once a decade. El_C 18:00, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

I copied that from BarkingMoon including the top icon - a bird on the Main page today --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:07, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Love it when the Main page gets that much colour. I noticed that article yesterday and thought: wow, those birds are almost as iridescent as Hummingbirds , which are... well, kinda the best! El_C 18:18, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

yes --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:25, 3 February 2021 (UTC)

Opa is now on the Main page, Wilhelm Knabe, who stood up for future with the striking school children when he was in his 90s, - a model, - see here. - Further down on the page, there are conversations about the current arb case request - I feel I have to stay away - in a nutshell: "... will not improve kindness, nor any article". - Yesterday, I made sure on a hike that the flowers are actually blooming ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:13, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Yay for Green Opa! This made my day! El_C 16:24, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Today, we have Doris Stockhausen on her 97th birthday ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:34, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Till 120! El_C 15:39, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Birds of a feather

External videos
Bitter-sweet groove (translation unavailable on request!)

Spiel nicht mit den Schmuddelkindern ... anticipated protest --- and listen, not to me, but the music (in the article) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:49, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

... and after the music, please listen to User talk:Nikkimaria --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:39, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

I don't understand. There's a YouTube video at the bottom of the page, but it's just some people talking in German (which I don't-Opa-understand) alongside some German folk music (not my cup of tea). Then, you link to Nikkimaria's talk page as an ill with numbers and stuff, but it still only links to their main user talk page. Quite confusing. El_C 13:48, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

entirely my fault, I thought I had the video in the article, but no, only on the talk of Martinevans123, and when I'm absent-minded, I confuse ill and diff, Nikkimaria. But hurray, I just expanded the soprano, sufficiently I hope. Need fresh air now. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:49, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't really like that song. Didn't dislike it either. Was just kinda meh. Personally, I prefer the Israeli children songs I grew up on, like הילדה הכי יפה בגן, for example. El_C 16:08, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Mr. Degenhardt would have been delighted! Not a song to be liked, - did you read the quote which I translated (improving on Deeple) per the talk request. Song talk about unpleasant smells, ending with a crime and a corpse swimming ... while the surviving grubby children keep singing that you better don't play with them. - Thanks for yours. Did you read my advice for M? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:33, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

I did not. Quoted where? Also, after Opa, I'm afraid to ask, but what's a "Deeple"? Yes, I saw it. Sound advise, but I'm still concerned that further cognizance will nonetheless be needed in order to avoid utter disaster in the future. El_C 16:45, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

my next mistake, DeepL - as you know everything about me you'll know that I am an infobox warrior who had to be restricted by arbcom to prevent utter disaster in the future. For 2 years I was too proud to appeal. I should have known SBHB's advice in the case, but then we might not have gotten to Beethoven ;) - RfC for Ian Fleming, and I stay away, I stay away, I don't play that game any more - please, be never afraid to ask! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:03, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Matti Caspi laments about how many songs can even be created, but does so in a song he created (כמה שירים אפשר להמציא בכלל), so there you go. Take that, eternity! El_C 17:13, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Gerda doesn't lament but enjoys the support by Brian, continued when others called her guilty, - always trying to mediate. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:56, 8 February 2021 (UTC)

Tis the season for bitter-sweet...? Also, trying something (top of section — EEng uncredited mention). El_C 18:45, 8 February 2021 (UTC)

look --Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:34, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

did you? - interesting bitter-sweet today --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:35, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

I did in passing, but I just am not in the headspace for riddles today, I'm afraid. But I did like File:Idstein,_Unytsjerke._Oersjoch_ynterieur.jpg. Almost-but-not-quite grand; warm but-not-quite gaudy. Sorry, I haven't heard of that translator before. Did you know her, personally? El_C 23:01, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. The church pic - as you will have seen - is in my user infobox for 2021. I don't know the singer personally, but she sang for us several times, Bach's great works (all explained if you follow the link, also (below there) that some like to receive my thanks and appreciation), and she sang recently in cantata services that I pictured (her page). On all these pictures, she is too small for "about her", and my lead is smaller "about me", of course. - I knew nothing about the translator, but she was a red link on Deaths in 2021. The bitter-sweetness is between her and her ex-husband, a novelist with an article who wrote her obit. (They had four children when they were divorced, and now he has ten.) - The delegate called me to task for the Bach cantata, so I will have to not follow spontaneous impulses for a few days, - hope no one dies whose article has to be written. In the cantata, BWV 1, I have a problem. The article was all built on one source (and all other Bach cantatas at the time also, btw) which one user denies reliability. I wanted to keep it, supporting it for all facts - only recordings, anyway - by a second source, trying to be faithful to the article history and to retain what editors did before me. He removed it. Quite generally, I have a problem with expansions which ignore what former editors achieved, see BWV 53 and Ian Fleming for recently mentioned examples. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:42, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Ah, just read that at: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/feb/08/dr-vera-wulfing-leckie-obituary — I see what you mean. Right, I knew it (the church) looked familiar. Hope you're able to resolve your BWV 1 problem. I'd offer to help, but I'd probably just mess it up, anyway. El_C 16:55, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

You will not mess anything up if you look at the old ref and tell me if it looks despicable to you, just for curiosity. The article was like this when I began "taking over". - Did you see this trying to revert a takeover? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:36, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

It does not look "despicable" to me, but I am far from an authority. This is not an area with which I am familiar. El_C 18:08, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Thank you, helped. I just found this (having searched for Thomanerchor) and look what is bolded, and praised. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:08, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Helleborus orientalis

happy Valentine's! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:14, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, for you, too. Did an English translation of a song at User_talk:El_C#Us, btw, and am about to submit another ("US," itself), so check it out! El_C 16:23, 14 February 2021 (UTC)

adding today's featured picture of February 17 - a nice match to my wild one --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:23, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Lovely, lovely! El_C 23:24, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Request to put 2021 storming of the United States Capitol under WP:1RR

@El C: @Octoberwoodland: Continuing this discussion, I'd like to request that 2021 storming of the United States Capitol be put under WP:1RR (I guess that would be Template:American politics AE?). How do I make such a request? Post to WP:AN? Or can an admin (i.e. you :-)) do that without a formal request? — Chrisahn (talk) 23:59, 9 February 2021 (UTC)

Chrisahn, right, you ask me, here, like so. But can you show that there is a lot of protracted edit warring going on? Because I'm wary of throttling a page that sees that much activity. Not sure why you pinged Octoberwoodland here. They are not an admin, so they do not have the authority to grant your request. El_C 00:09, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

No, there hasn't been much edit warring. Just like Octoberwoodland, I thought the page was already under 1RR, and I thought it would be useful. But if you'd rather not do it yet, that's fine with me as well. If problems do arise, I'll come back here. But I hope it won't be necessary. :-) (The ping was just because Octoberwoodland started the discussion at Alalch Emis's talk page and might want to chime in here.) — Chrisahn (talk) 00:21, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Just understood that moments ago (the ping). Anyway, in general, restrictions are added by need only. The general consensus among admins is to wait and see, and only if needed add 1RR. And if that isn't enough, only then move on to additional enhancements, like Consensus required (i.e. gradual escalation). Regards, El_C 00:28, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation! These processes are more fine-grained than I thought. Probably a good thing. Although I'm afraid I won't remember the difference between {{ds/editnotice}} and {{ds/talk notice}} a week from now. :-) — Chrisahn (talk) 00:54, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

I just type T:DSA (all listed at the bottom), otherwise, who can remember! El_C 00:56, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

It is time I knew more about do's and don'ts applicable to infoboxes. Could you let me have the link to any WP that applies to Infoboxes as such? Qexigator (talk) 17:52, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I'm far from an authority on infoboxes, Qexigator, so short of pointing you to the MOS:INFOBOX-obvious, I would just advise you to avoid WP:ARBINFOBOX2 at all cost! Regards, El_C 18:13, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Some users get hot about infoboxes, while for others it's the normal thing to have. Before adding an infobox to an article without one, check for warnings in edit mode, and for discussions on the talk page. Recent example Ian Fleming, nonono. Those who made the article as nice as it is today don't like it. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 18:23, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Haha! See what I mean, Qexigator? *Pokes Gerda* El_C 18:25, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the link to MOS:INFOBOX. This comfirms my experience when I have been looking at or editing other well-established articles on impottant topics: the infobox is 'to summarize (and not supplant) key facts that appear in the article (an article should remain complete with its summary infobox ignored,,,The less information it contains, the more effectively it serves that purpose, allowing readers to identify key facts at a glance,' If well done, they can be very helpful when needed.' Qexigator (talk) 18:44, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

My favourite is Beethoven. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:05, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

The unquestionable elegance of less is more. El_C 19:08, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

I am so proud of that ;) - Did you know that I designed it in the workshop of Teh Case ("Actually, I believe almost every article would profit from a placement like that in history and geography.")? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:01, 10 February 2021 (UTC)

Us

User:El C/Songs from the homeland (YouTube links to individual performances are at the top of the subpage, in boldface)

"You See Far, You See Clear"

"Us"

"I Want Us To Be Realized"

"Didn't Know You'd Walk Away From Me"

"You Put My Hand In Yours"

"A Place Of Worry"

What Is Love?

"How Is It That A Star"

"A Love Song (Like A Wheel)"

"Sitting On The Fence"

"Fragile"

"In Praise Of Samba"

"Where Are You?"

"Poogy Tales"

"Tell Me"

"There Were Nights"

"It Happens"

"Drawing"

"Yes, It Has No Chance, But Between Myself And I Everything Is Allowed"

Last updated: El_C 09:05, 28 February 2021 (UTC)

Gerda loves subsections!

Thanks for sharing! Reminds me of my one and only contrib to the Hebrew Misplaced Pages. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:17, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

I would have liked to add the pic to context, but can't tell ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:46, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Are you referring to he:קובץ:Ubud_Cremation_4.jpg, because that is one scary dragon! El_C 08:51, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

yes ;) - that pic was taken by my much-missed friend who made the good version for Ian Fleming, and my illustration for the infobox wars (see the link to the workshop, and in my 2020 talk archive). - On the other topic, Bach, we have now another ANI, by Smerus, Nikkimaria is fighting, I shake my head and try to look away, and Mathsci is still blocked. How many more editors in good standing are going to be burnt? - I like the singers music, but the images best when I see him, not graphics. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:54, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Haha! All roads lead to Ian Fleming, it seems. Also, you're making me sound like the grim reaper, but I just want to pet a chipmunk! El_C 11:03, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

"making you sound"? I just tremble with indignation - out for the day --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:07, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

That's the second time today where I've had Che quoted back at me — looks like it's gonna be one of those days... Enjoy your outing! El_C 11:13, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Innisfree Garden

Back from sun and snow: sorry if that landed wrong. I was a bit in a rush, and reacted to "all roads lead to IF". I don't care about IF, at all, the number of my edits to his article is zero, the number of my edits to the talk page is zero. I had not thought of him in years until the ongoing RfC, and my edits will remain zero. I use his name as an example, because - with the RfC going - I can mention it, otherwise if I mentioned a name from the group someone would come and cry "canvassing".

I thought about the animosity, and what I can trace back (because I really don't understand it), and looked at what I wrote about Ian Fleming on the page deleted as a call to battle. I made a note of the name, that it was infobox person (red background indicating that it was lost) and the above-mentioned diff of a good version from 2012 piped to the date. That's all. I had forgotten until I looked it up now that my friend had made the good version. When we lost him (later that year) I spread the image all over the Wikipedias, even Hebrew (with some help from a friend from Jerusalem). My first reaction had been to leave, but then I didn't want to do his enemies that favour ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:30, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Ooh, that is some lovley greenery. So nice. Also, you can CANVASS me any day, Gerda, but should probably note my propensity to call (!)voter fraud whenever things don't go my way (diff). Anyway, trying to take it easy today, with the occasional bouts of critical drinking. El_C 19:28, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Fine, easy today, will explain "canvass" some other day, also why I think the animosity is inherited, because the listing described really doesn't explain it, - although I can see (now) that the red background - about as red as your top image - could be seen as inflammatory. But a reason to leave Misplaced Pages? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:17, 11 February 2021 (UTC)

Easier today, with progress on BWV 1. Back to the beginning, Hebrew: we miss Yoninah, terribly, and one of the many things she would have done for me is adding the text of a psalm to the article, compare Psalm 45 and Psalm 43. The text can be found at the bottom, in External links. I could probably manage but would feel safer if someone did it who could actually read it. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:44, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

 Done. Oh, good, glad to hear it. Yup, I well know Yoninah for her top-tier contributions. I wouldn't count our losses yet, though. She's only been gone less than a month. Hopefully, she'll return soon. *Sending positive vibes* El_C 11:01, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Haha! Dangerous terrain (diff), who would have thunk it? (Seriously, I didn't.) El_C 11:07, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Hmm. I confess to being puzzled (diff). Anyway, pinged you to User_talk:Veverve#Psalm_43_query. Hopefully, my confusion can be assuaged. El_C 11:32, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

did it? (I had an edit conflict there) - thank you for a new word, "assuaged" --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:37, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

See the trouble you get me into? Now to ameliorate! El_C 11:39, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

going out again, sun and snow, will think about amelioration when walking --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:03, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Obligatory Here Comes Sunshine spam! El_C 12:27, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

refreshed: spam for spam (subject of my first article, which was supposed to be the only one, but it had this red link ...) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:36, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Very nice, but I still think I'm owed some Psalms-related comforting! El_C 20:38, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

"no good thing will he withhold from them that walk uprightly" --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:48, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, I like that a lot! El_C 20:49, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Sadly: more work for you, in her memory. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:02, 17 March 2021 (UTC)

Guess what, BWV 1 and BWV 159 make progress. You mentioned AE. I was there, last 2015. It was so awful that I dropped all pride (and it felt like giving up walking uprightly - watch out for Psalm 110 there) and appealed (and even successfully so). Starlight on top of that archive ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:01, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

I'll take some startlight — been flying too close to the sun lately, truth be told. El_C 18:34, 16 February 2021 (UTC)

You are welcome! I made a hook, also for you.

One this day nine years ago, I told Voceditenore that she is a voice of opera and reason. In 2018, she said: "And, no, there haven't been infobox squabbles in ages. I personally use them all the time now for biographies and operas. There are a few diehards left, but the general attitude from both perspectives seems to have settled on live and let live." So why is it that some still can't settle on live and let live? - The next cookbook author is scheluded to appear as TFA (with a nice infobox btw, as the last), and I will keep the usual thanks to the creator for myself as insistent, but I don't understand. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:54, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Love the artwork of Arik Brauer — nicely done! Ah, the vicissitudes of infoboxen, its ebbs and and flow. What a peculiar thing it is. El_C 14:55, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

No, it doesn't. It could just ebb. In 2018, it was no concern. Why is it now? Why can't we just edit the little boxes as other content: someone adds, and if someone reverts, consensus needs to be established. Instead, someone adding, or requesting, or just asking where it went, is considered a warrior. The question where it went often goes like this: when a certain group of editors expanded an article, they collapsed it (thinking that was a compromise, but making life harder for those having physical trouble to click the "show" button). That caused a little edit-war, which was "resolved" by taking it away completely, with a discussion like this on the talk following. Ever since, we have been reminded that there was this consensus not to have one, and we are supposed to believe that. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:10, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

For sure, I am like-minded with you in that interpretation. WP:ONUS should generally be observed, like elsewhere. Indeed, there really isn't an excuse for not doing so. In theory, per WP:ARBINFOBOX2, WP:ACDS allows admins to just straight-up make it (ONUS) a requirement by adding Consensus required to intractable infobox disputes. My sense is that most admins just do not want to touch these because it usually ends up amounting to a zero-sum game, at best — myself, I don't really engage infobox disputes in an AE capacity, because the history and politics AE topic areas keep me busy enough (diff). El_C 16:19, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

There are almost no "intractable infobox disputes", really, so DS serves no purpose. The problem is that a newcomer who has no idea of a minefield is treated as a warrior. - I love your translations. We should have more us. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:36, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

Ah, understood. Admittedly, I do not have a firm grasp of what's happening on the infobox front. RE: translations. Many thanks! I appreciate your praise very much. Also Val's. Strange how it took me hours and hours to do the first one, an hour to do the second one, and 30 minutes to do the third one. But I think I'm now finally satisfied with the final form of all three translations, so at least I'm done with the constant tinkering (though not to jinx it!). El_C 16:57, 17 February 2021 (UTC)

For more understanding: imagine - if you can, it takes courage - for a moment that back in 2012, the infobox had been kept as it had been for years then already. Imagine. - Certainly thanks to presentation here, Arik Brauer made it to the stats, DYK? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:48, 18 February 2021 (UTC)

Play Bach

How do you like this? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:46, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Enjoy the music, and make it last. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:18, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

(As) I always do, Gerda! Yours always, El_C 12:00, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Great music offer! - What do you think of the start of Reception, - the little prince never gives up a question. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:14, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Not usually a fan of princes, but here's one that really did music-it-up! El_C 12:17, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Agree about Johann Ernst! The Little Prince never gives up a question, "the prince has golden hair, a lovable laugh, and will repeat questions until they are answered". How do you like the beginning of reception? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:50, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

One of my favourite books growing up... Reception looks great to me. I think he did a fine job. Top tier musicology. El_C 16:54, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

I agree, but who is "he"? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:56, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

"You know, that guy — who always wore a shirt." Oh, sorry, did you write that, with him just having merged it? It's a low attention span -day today, so brace yourself! El_C 17:04, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Nonono, I could never write such a thing (+ I'm not a "he" as the writer is, and yes, the obvious "he" just merged it). Two ways to the answer: you follow the links in the edit summary (better the second), or you look at the new article's talk page. Unless you just guess why I come to you of all people with this question, and may guess right. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:17, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

A riddle — noo! There better not be a math and science test at the end of this! El_C 17:21, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

test? first question in this thread has one (!) link, leading to the initial entry of a new article, with two (but I said better second) links, with the second leading to where an estimated 95% of the content came from. - a fine job, indeed, not my style, but fine. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:51, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Hoping for a D-. That would be about right. El_C 17:57, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

An unblock would do. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 19:55, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Gerda, for reasons which are my own, attending to this dispute, in any administrative capacity, just isn't something I wish to engage at this time. Sorry. El_C 20:42, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Understand. Appreciation of outstanding work is better. You can tell other admins where the clue is - my lead image until 2021 came, remember? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:06, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Of course, happy to pass on genuine positive impressions, always. Yes, I do. Breathtaking, primordial. El_C 22:26, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

"at times heavy to carry" (quoting myself still from the same page which also has the model for Precious, did you see? - the cabal of the outcast, - I told Bus stop four years ago, feel like Cassandre) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:06, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

And that's very much okay to express. Also, we can be in diametric opposition about whatever from time to time. That is also okay. El_C 23:20, 19 February 2021 (UTC)

Album title of the day

Stop sniggering at the back! Narky Blert (talk) 20:15, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

Songspammed! El_C 12:04, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

I wonder if he'd been listening to Debussy, e.g. Poissons d'or? Narky Blert (talk) 12:17, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Indeed. BTW, I've recently songspammed Debussy as well. My edit summary read: +Gymnopédies → Arabesque No. 1 — Claude Debussy + Erik Satie = 1888 BFFs. Ah, 1888, that brings me back. El_C 12:33, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

A non-hit wonder

The Only Ones - "Another Girl, Another Planet" - video - Peel session (not a carbon copy). It turned up in Peel's Festive Fifty (listener-voted) 1978-1982 and 2000, but commercially sank without trace.

The band reformed in the 2000s, but the singer's voice was totally shot. Narky Blert (talk) 21:03, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Nice, that's a surprisingly decent guitar solo for a punk song. They usually have no guitar solos at all, and their vocals seem almost purposely aimed at an un-melodic discord (which this track otherwise does too). Kind of like Eastern music, but less complex and layered musically. Which I suppose fits the rebellious streak, which of course I'm all for. But generally the music — Oy. El_C 00:33, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Page protection

Hello, can you please protect this page Islamic State – Khorasan Province because if you look at the page history you will see anonymous users keep removing huge content from the page and this has caused an edit War. 197.52.28.131 (talk) 10:40, 10 November 2021 (UTC)

Already protected by administrator Drmies. El_C 00:34, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Oddly moving

Gavin Bryars - Jesus' Blood Never Failed Me Yet - link.

Bonus #1 - link. I'd love to know who scripted that, and whose idea it was - I suspect they asked TW on, and he improvised most of it.

Bonus #2 - Tom Waits - "Downtown Train" - link. Narky Blert (talk) 21:58, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

🎼 Fantastic! 🎼 El_C 13:02, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

IP with disruptive editing

Greetings El C due to continuous disruptive editing recently the Vuk Karadžić page was protected but it did not stopped with vandalism. This "new" IP Special:Contributions/93.138.19.195 started their edit warring on that page with the same behaviour on Mate Parlov page. Can something be done. Thank you. User:Theonewithreason (talk) 13. November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, Theonewithreason, I'm not really available to enforce MOS:ETHNICITY disputes at this time. Also, the contested edits in question do not seem to be vandalism (see what vandalism is not). Perhaps it's disruptive editing of which vandalism is one subset of. Not sure right now. In any case, maybe take it to WP:ANI...? If you do, please ensure that the subject of the complaint is properly notified. Good luck. El_C 13:34, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. User:Theonewithreason (talk) 13. November 2021 (UTC)

I just wrote the truth, that someone doesn’t like it, it’s his thing. 93.138.19.195 (talk) 13:41, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

I am being followed (wp:following) again this time by User:49.228.19.151

Hi User:El_C in relation your block on User:49.180.171.190 (background information: and ) can you take a look at user 49.228.19.151’s edits (Special:Contributions/49.228.19.151) and see if they might be related? Both ip users have

1) made their first series of edits on the encyclopedia by tracking my previous edits across multiple articles (49.180.171.190 followed by edits on Wilson Sporting Goods, Concerns over Chinese involvement in 5G wireless networks, Meng Wanzhou, Extradition case of Meng Wanzhou ; 49.228.19.151 followed my edits on Chen Shih-chung and the United States )

2) made baseless allegations against me (49.180.171.190 has accused me vandalism & ; 49.228.19.151 has accused me of canvassing

3) showed intricate knowledge of editing policies of the encyclopedia despite being “new” editors (49.180.171.190’s third edit on the encyclopedia makes reference to wp:blp ; 49.228.19.151 second edit makes reference to wp:canvassing )

4) addresses which geolocate to the same region (both start with 49) which suggests the same person is editing on both accounts using a proxy server.

I also do recall encountering an editor who used the exact term “gish galloping” on another China related article but cannot at this moment recall which one specifically at this moment.

I’m sorry to bother you again but (once again) your help here would be most welcome Estnot (talk) 12:41, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

49.228.19.151 Blocked – for a period of 3 months. Estnot, I won't be around as much in the next little while, so if you see these IPs again, just report em to WP:AIV or WP:ANI, referencing this discussion. Drmies, looks like blocking the /16 didn't work. Would it be feasible to expand the range? I don't think protection can help that much, since it looks like they're just going to whichever pages Estnot happens to be frequenting at any given time. Also, who is the master? Is there an SPI? Thanks as always. El_C 14:45, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks El C--I don't know but I'll look into it later. Estnot, I'm sorry for the abuse--it's sad. Drmies (talk) 15:23, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

thank you all for the help Estnot (talk) 15:35, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

OK El C--this is going to get complicated soon. Checks were done in relation to a number of SPIs, but I'm going to stay on the safe side and ask Maxim and NinjaRobotPirate if there is anything they see or that they can do. Increasing the range block is not possible. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 16:58, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

It looks like someone on a VPN. That's becoming more common now, but there are bots that automatically detect and block VPNs, proxies, etc. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 01:18, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Speedrun! El_C 02:14, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Just because I like it

Richard Thompson - "Turning of the Tide". Narky Blert (talk) 18:11, 15 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, that was nice. El_C 02:20, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Block this IP address

Please I request you to block this 182.56.210.144 ip address. Doing unsourced edits. Sush150 (talk) 07:19, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

The ip address is doing repeated unsource edits in Badhaai Do, Atrangi Re, Bachchan Pandey, Raksha Bandhan, Jug Jugg Jeeyo, Thank God, Radhe Shyam and Rocky Aur Rani Ki Prem Kahani film articles. Sush150 (talk) 07:25, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Sush150, such block requests are submitted to WP:AIV or WP:ANI. El_C 11:00, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. Sush150 (talk) 11:13, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Sweet Home

You've got one of this great man's best-known songs in your spamlist; here's a little-known one, from the end of his career. (The second-last verse was prophetic.)

For balance, here's one by his great rival. (The sleeve credits Johnny Winter for "miscellaneous screaming".) Narky Blert (talk) 12:39, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Nice. Was listening to Second Winter the other day. So crisp. Full album. El_C 09:12, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Fun album, I didn't know it. UK and US styles were diverging again in the 70s, and I don't think JW really crossed The Pond. (We decided a couple of years ago that he's the answer to the trivia question, Name a blind White bluesman - legally blind, from his albinism.)

I'm a sucker for Dylan covers; but instead I'll post Mississippi Fred McDowell - "61 Highway".

In the late 80s/early 90s, a colleague (vocals, rhythm guitar, harp) fronted a local blues-based fourpiece. He'd been dropping hints all week about a new number they'd been working on, and I'd been failing miserably to guess it. At their next gig, the SOB dedicated it to me ("When I was a young boy / At the age of five / I met the gypsy woman / And I spat in her eye / Now I'm a frog / All slimy and green", then launching into one of the maddest fast harp-driven breaks I've ever had the pleasure of hearing). Of course Martin was pointing and laughing, while I was shaking my fist and hurling imprecations at him.

Lead guitar was Roddy Radiation, which is part of how I can claim the unusual double of having drunk wine with a Nobel Laureate and beer with someone who'd had a #1 single. Narky Blert (talk) 21:26, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Martin, I totally know who that is. I like how this is entering some Gerda-level find-the-ciphertext music-mystery. Awareness is overrated. El_C 09:51, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Question

Hey there, it’s been a second, I hope you are fine and In good health, quick one here, In hindsight you always called diffs in mobile format your weakness, needless to say you sure as hell don’t like mobile format diffs & you have (positively?) corrupted me and I try to de-mobilize every diff I make. Recently I used a diff in mobile format see here & @Ritchie333 converted it to desktop format, and user the word “conventional” which I thought was quite funny & made me laugh, I might have asked you before(I’m not so sure) but my question is what is the fundamental difference between the both? R333 please I’d be happy to hear from you as well. Celestina007 (talk) 12:45, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Celestina007, I think the fundamental difference is that Misplaced Pages on mobile is very, very poorly optimized compared to desktop. Sorry, I don't really know that much about the lore for why it is like this (still). Best, El_C 12:53, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Ah, that much is true, I can only imaging that(arbitrary speaking) less than 10% of editors here use mobile devices. Celestina007 (talk) 13:45, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Contributions/202.142.177.7

Greetings,

I got curious with long list of warning messages to the IP over the years Special:Contributions/202.142.177.7. It is relatively minor spam cases once in a while but consistently over the years. Seem to be a static IP.

Usually I don't feel like recomonding blocking IPs and Users, so I did not report directly @ notice board. May be you can look into it with your experience better .

Thanks

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 17:57, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Bookku, even if static, probably too slow moving to bother doing anything about beyond reverting their once or thrice a year nonsense. El_C 20:16, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks, that what I thought.

Bookku, 'Encyclopedias = expanding information & knowledge' (talk) 00:29, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

re Supermann block

Wow, that was really not excellent. In indefinitely blocking a 15-year editor, you cited WP:BLUDGEON, which is not only an essay, but a largely stupid essay which says, among other things, "Typically, the person replies to almost every '!vote' or comment, arguing against that particular person's point of view. The person attempts to pick apart each argument with the goal of getting each person to change their '!vote'". This is presented as bad behavior (!), and I guess it's bad enough to get kicked off the project (!!). What the heck is AfD supposed to be for if it's not to present facts and arguments to persuade.

But wait. The blocked editor's (supposedly horrible, blockable) efforts were at a Deletion Review advocating for the overturn of a deletion, where the deletion was indeed overturned and supporting an article at an AfD where the article is going to be kept. (It looks like, tho maybe not cos you've, I don't know, kicked out a key editor addressing objections to the article, altho you could have waited.) So it's not like he was wrong. That matters.

I haven't looked at your WP:NPA allegation in detail, but its for sure that Supermann was goaded quite a bit (including by a sock at one point). I do think he rose to the bait and got more testy (and arch) at times then you'd like to see. Other editors were worse, I think... and goading is not a good look. Sorting all this out fairly and correctly would take scores of man-hours which is why I recommended leaving it alone since there was a fair amount of bad acting all around, tempers got a little bit inflamed as happens, but no serious violations of any rules were made (essays aren't rules), and nothing that couldn't be handled locally and it's not going to be a running sore cos the AfD is going to be closed soon.

But you think different I guess, and your call. Wrong call, but I understand; I know the admin corps is super overworked and all, and of course you're going to make rash, poorly considered actions when you're tired and stressed. But I mean if you didn't have the time to do it right, you didn't have to do anything. So I mean if you want to reflect on that, that'd be great IMO, but up to you. Herostratus (talk) 19:42, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Herostratus, I'm sorry, but your complaint feels unfocused and fragmented, and riddled with assumptions and misrepresentations. There's nothing preventing me from linking to an essay, though the block notice read (in part): You have been blocked indefinitely from editing for disruptive editing. Specifically, WP:BATTLEGROUND conduct (at times testing the boundaries of WP:NPA, if not exceeding it outright) and WP:BLUDGEON to excess. In any case, I've reopened that ANI thread, so you're welcome to bring your concerns for wider review. El_C 20:06, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Aright, great. Sorry if my argument was poorly presented, thanks for considering it anyway. Yes you did cite mainly mention battleground and personal attacks, and that would be sufficient, but also bludgeoning, which caught my eye, and it was in the indictment. I had not even heard of this before, and now I'm seeing it swung around a lot, almost like some kind of... some kind of truncheon, or something... which is providing more heat than light. So that. Herostratus (talk) 20:29, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Personally, I sort of see it as a somewhat mechanical and repetitive form of WP:TE (added: and WP:IDHT). But not all behavioural conventions are written as policy. Conventions that aren't expressed as formally could still be invoked, providing their application to a given case still aligns with fundamental policy. For example, WP:BEANS is often cited in serious matters, even though it's a humor piece (though recently, I tried to highlight its more serious counterpart, an essay). Also, it is not an indictment and the block need not be permanent. The avenues to getting it lifted are not insurmountable and are not merely for show. El_C 20:43, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

potential sockpuppet

Hi User:El_C in relation to your block of User:Supermann and also User:Lolitart , it appears that they are sockpuppet accounts. Both accounts:

a) consistently use the 2017 wikitext editor function

b) format many of their tags in the same idiosyncratic way:

example #1 Tags: 2017 wikitext editor Disambiguation links added — Supermann and Lolitart

example #2 Tags: Reply Source — Supermann and Lolitart

example #3 Tags: Source New topic — Supermann and Lolitart

c) regularly leave the same edit summaries (example Reply)

d) share interests in certain topics or topic areas (example Shanghai related articles)

e) share the same pro PRC bias

f) demonstrate a lack of competency in many of the same areas (wp:competence)

Can you look into this issue in a bit more detail? Estnot (talk) 04:45, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

(talk page stalker) FYI, Estnot, the tags are automatically applied. "Reply" is a very common edit summary, and it's the default for everyone using the new-ish Reply Tool, now enabled by default for all editors. No comment on the rest of your evidence. Firefangledfeathers 06:11, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't make that connection, Estnot, I just username soft-blocked Lolitart for the Loli, per WP:CHILDPROTECT. Anyway, not sure there's much to do about it now, but if someone else that appears to be them appears on the scene, you can add them to the WP:SPI, where perhaps a CU could shed light. El_C 11:08, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

can you expand a little bit further what you meant when you said there’s not much you could do about the situation now?To a non administrator such as myself this explanation strikes me as a bit confusing and not making a lot of sense because the way I see it you can simply change the reason for your block of User:Lolitart for sockpuopetry based on the evidence I have provided. That would seem to be a much simpler way to resolve what appears to be a case of sockpuppetry. Or does confirmation of every case of sockpuopetry have to go through the SPI process? Estnot (talk) 06:24, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

What I mean is that your evidence isn't good enough as confirmation to alter the block. In fact, at a glance, it seems rather circumstantial. But there's nothing to do right now because both are indeffed anyway. About SPI: A CU there might be able to help in determining whose's who, but, again, as both both are indeffed, there's no one of concern to SPI right now. El_C 11:32, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

The reason I keep bringing up my sockpuppet suspicions is because supermann has made a number of edits which I think require removal. (Wp:sockstrike) Not all but some. But without confirmation of sockpuopetry this does not appear to be possible because wp:3rrno appears to apply only to “ banned users in violation of a ban, and sockpuppets or meatpuppets of banned or blocked users” and not those who have been indefinitely blocked. What am I supposed to do in this situation? Am I allowed to remove those edits by Supermann without confirmation of sockpuppetry? Estnot (talk) 20:16, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Old

I'm feeling old. My PC is acting old (mofoboard problem I suspect). While I'm trying to sort that issue out, Monteverdi's "Toccata" (1607) just doesn't get old. Narky Blert (talk) 22:14, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

But what about Martin? Heh, my GPU cost more than the rest of my entire computer combined, which I guess is the new normal. Thanks for fucking it up for the rest of us (and fucking up the planet), Dink Doink. El_C 13:28, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm not surprised, the GPU cost a lot.

Some stories ought to be true.

Using this m/c is like reading a newspaper through a letterbox by candlelight in a strong draught. I'm relying on my shoppers to buy me something that works. (The empirical GSMASS rule, All new computers cost £1200, worked for almost 25 years starting in the late 70s, but is now hopelessly obsolete.) Narky Blert (talk) 18:10, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

In Soviet Russia, GPU Dink Doinks you (you, specifically, Narky Blert!). El_C 10:31, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Section headings on AN/ pages

Hi El C could you advise why you asked that I not alter a title? My understanding from WP:SECTIONHEADINGOWN is that “It is generally acceptable to change headings when a better heading is appropriate, e.g., one more accurately describing the content of the discussion or the issue discussed”

The only reason the title was not set this way originally was my human error. My thread open starts with This is a behavioral issue from two editors so it seemed appropriate to correct my error to make it clear to whom it refers. Is there a reason we shouldn’t adjust headings on AN/ noticeboards generally? Thanks Cambial — foliar❧ 19:40, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Cambial Yellowing, you waited too long to amend the header (Nov 16), so doing so now comes across as misleading at best and deceptive at worst, making it appear as if it was like that this entire time. But it wasn't. El_C 22:32, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

Ok, fair enough. I will try to remember to check my title editing earlier (preferably before posting) in future. Cambial — foliar❧ 22:37, 19 November 2021 (UTC)

McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom II

Hi El C, you protected McDonnell Douglas F-4 Phantom II back in October from an IP user that refused to discuss their changes. The user has returned to make the same edits as before. See Special:Contributions/210.185.97.52, which locates to the same city as Special:Contributions/203.221.79.237 and the others. Thanks. — Preceding unsigned comment added by BilCat (talk • contribs)

Sure thing, BillCat. Semi-protected for a period of 3 weeks, after which the page will be automatically unprotected. El_C 09:51, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Gerda's November corner

November songs

In November, I can offer some reading, - three feast days in a row, reformation followed by All Saints' and All Souls. On All Saints, we sang in choir in a mass - a 2021 first - and rehearsed (with the other group) for the next such thing next Sunday. All Souls is the birthday of the subject of my first article who will play a major concert on 14 November. Today we "celebrate" the first DYK for which LouisAlain laid the base in a German sandbox, - needlessly complicated but working. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:48, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

Nice. Super Gothic (image attached). El_C 10:07, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Thank you. The 19th century probably thought they were superior to the real Gothic ;) - Did you know that the first attempt to build that church collapsed? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:14, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

The duck ponds have had their revenge! I'm currently reading (slowly) Matthew Kneale's Rome: A History in Seven Sackings (2017), so let's just say that the Goths (Visi and Ostro), well, they make an appearance... El_C 10:20, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, "duck ponds" tells me nothing. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:26, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Saturday Night at the Duckpond. Narky Blert (talk) 18:47, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

The collapse was due to the foundation being laid where there were once ponds... El_C 10:33, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

I see ;) - I read "duck" here so often not meaning ducks that I was mislead. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:35, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

update --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:17, 11 November 2021 (UTC)

Library hijinks:

Me: I have a book that's due tomorrow, can I get an extension? I'm at chapter 7 of 7.

Librarian: Sure, one sec.

Me: Nazis!

Librarian: ???

Me: Before that, French!

Librarian: ???

Me: Before that, Spaniards!

Librarian: *Looks at book, realizes it's Rome: A History in Seven Sackings. Laughs.*

//And... scene. How am I not finished this book yet? I gotta stop being Busi-ness Man and start being Reading Man again. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ El_C 00:41, 12 November 2021 (UTC)

Good idea. Reading suggestions, on a friend's concert day, 3 DYK, Brahms depicted + sadly Aga Mikolaj (listen!). May the roads that we travel make us meet again! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:12, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

🎼 Ear magic! Also, Santa's really into the piano (me-relatable). El_C 15:21, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

thank you, and he's really into the piano, hands crossed. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:12, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Your food is so exotic. Rump steak, ooh la la! El_C 09:17, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

BTW, finally finished Rome: A History in Seven Sackings last week. New book: Matt Taibbi's Hate Inc. (2019). El_C 13:51, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

good news - I managed to begin the translation of Zeitmaße into the composer's native tongue, stress on "begin", with a nod to its author Jerome Kohl - hope for a psalm next week --Gerda Arendt (talk) 13:54, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Cool, good luck with the translation! I'm at the Psalms ready. El_C 14:06, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Protecting 2001–2002 India–Pakistan standoff

Hey, I noticed you applied full protection to the article. I requested indefinite pending changes protection because the article (like other India-Pakistan topics) is prone to vandalism like this. The content dispute in question has died down and consensus has been reached (and one of the parties has been taken to ARE), so a whole week of full protection seems a bit too extreme. Cipher21 (talk) 13:12, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Cipher21, the latest edits feature edit warring among registered users, of which you are one (diff), hence the full protection. Semiprotection would have no effect, since you're all confirmed users or higher. I briefly considered protecting higher at WP:ECP, but opted against doing that since it would have unfairly locked you out but not your opponent (who unlike you, currently enjoys the extended confirmed user right). Applying pending changes to the page wouldn't be worthwhile regardless of any of that, because it is simply too active atm to be of benefit. HTH. El_C 13:22, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

True, but both of us had decided to stop editing a few days ago and the area of the infobox in dispute has been removed entirely (by a third editor). After an extensive discussion on the talk page, it seems that consensus has been reached on a certain revision (but I indicated I wouldn't restore it until I received confirmation). I just wanted indef PC protection so that IPs wouldn't vandalise the casualties by adding or removing a few 0s. Cipher21 (talk) 13:52, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh, if the latest editing disputes are done (at least reverts-wise), then I'll lift the protection. But how sure are you that they are (done)? Also, your request to have the page protected against IPs isn't really connecting for me. Most of the activity I'm seeing is coming from registered users. I see an IP making an edit 4 days ago, and the IP edit before that was over a month ago. So not a lot. Also, IPs are able to edit a page when it's under pending changes (WP:PC). Are you sure you understand what it does? El_C 14:01, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

I'm sure the dispute in question is over - I just received said confirmation as well. As for protection, that's precisely why I wanted PC. There isn't enough IP/new account vandalism to warrant semi protection, but PC prevents a situation where one guy quietly slips in a few 0s, and no one notices for a while, during which hundreds to thousands of people could be mislead. With PC this sort of vandalism will be reverted before it is visible to (unregistered) readers. Cipher21 (talk) 15:14, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

That's only one person, though. About pc: again, the page is too active atm for it to be of benefit, in two ways: first, no edits seem to fall under the radar, as everything looks like it gets noticed pretty much the same day. And secondly, the page is active enough that chasing a cascade of revisions could hinder editorial flow. It isn't what pc is meant for. El_C 15:22, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Alright, your call if you believe PC isn't needed. I don't propose chasing a cascade of revisions, just copy pasting the "casualties" section from the said revision back into the current page to avoid messing anything else up. I don't want to bore you with the details of the dispute but those are official figures from India, and the opposing argument consisted of misrepresenting sources (and refusing to listen when said misrepresentation was pointed out), so doesn't WP:SNOW apply? Cipher21 (talk) 16:15, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Apply to what? I'm not seeing a WP:DRR discussion that requires a WP:CLOSE, SNOW or otherwise. El_C 16:35, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

In the sense that it's WP:RS versus WP:OR and WP:SYNTH, so it's common sense that the former should be accepted instead of prolonging the already unnecessarily long talk page discussion. Cipher21 (talk) 17:01, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

That's not how SNOW is used, which is to expedite closures of structured discussions, like for an WP:RFC or WP:RM or WP:AFD (etc.). All there is on the talk page right now is a normal (unstructured) discussion, which at a glance, doesn't look that easy to follow. El_C 17:13, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Well yeah, that's the reason I condensed it into a single sentence. The whole thing really should've been resolved with a single edit summary but was bloated into this mess because one editor outright refused to listen to others and kept POV pushing. You can go through the ARE page if you want a rough idea of how it went. Cipher21 (talk) 17:34, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

I don't know what you mean by ARE page. Anyway, maybe get some outside input into the content dispute, like a WP:3O or WP:RSN. I'm sorry, but I'm not really available to help with that myself at this time. El_C 17:54, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

ARE page. A third opinion was requested but turned down because more than two editors were already involved. I understand that you're not available to help with the content dispute, but could you reduce the protection, perhaps by a few days or completely? The dispute has been resolved, the opposing party has been topic banned and the discussion has been closed. Cipher21 (talk) 04:52, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Then start an WP:RFC, I dunno. But a content opponent of yours in this dispute, Suthasianhistorian8, has not been banned at WP:AE. I'm not going to modify the protection right now. Why are you expending so much energy on that? It hasn't even been a day. El_C 05:35, 21 November 2021

That's another dispute on a different topic altogether. Suthasianhistorian8 is also convinced that I requested full protection to stop them from editing. Anyway, since you want to keep the protection, I'll make an edit request to restore the content from the agreed upon revision if you're not available to do so. Cipher21 (talk) 06:27, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Well, I'm unable to follow much of it regardless right now. If you want to request unprotection at WP:RFPP/D, you may note in that request that as the protecting admin I can already be considered notified and that any admin should feel free to adjust the protection in any way they see fit (including by lifting it outright). El_C 06:32, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Islam in Albania

Someone, firstly as an IP editor and then with an account created for the purpose of continuing reverts, is changing sourced content. Three editors, including me, have asked them to not change sourced content and provide reliable sources for their own claim. However, they have persisted, and maybe a short semi protection is needed. Ktrimi991 (talk) 13:02, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

How did you manage that whitespace, Ktrimi991? El_C 13:08, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

With whitespace, do you mean the horizontal space rows between this section and the one above ? I use the Enter key of the keyboard for that. Ktrimi991 (talk) 13:21, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Next question: why? El_C 13:23, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

It might partly be instinctive, actually. With no real logical reason. Also, because I am writing on the phone, having more space between sections is of help. Ktrimi991 (talk) 13:44, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

It's not allowed! El_C 14:08, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Opps! Is this a rule for all Misplaced Pages talk pages, or is a thing you want to not be done on your talk page? If it is the former I will not use the phone to edit Misplaced Pages again; if it is the latter I will not use the phone to edit your talk page again - or to create new sections . Ktrimi991 (talk) 14:52, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

NEVER USE THE PHONE AGAIN! El_C 15:01, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

The poor phone, it is the time for retirement only after a few "tasks" on Wiki here or there. Unemployment for a phone is such a sad thing. Haha :P Ktrimi991 (talk) 15:06, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

I hate computers

Welcome to your new computer! Please confirm that you own your primary email acct by entering the security code we have sent to your secondary email acct. Welcome to your new computer! Please confirm that you own your secondary email acct by entering the security code we have sent to your primary email acct. I think that's one for tomorrow. Meanwhile, I'm setting up everything I like under a pseudonym, whose DoB may or may not be correct but which allows me to access adult content. J'ai changé cent fois de nom. All I need now is a spurious cellphone number to confirm my identity.

Meanwhile, I've been listening to:

• The Termites - "Tell Me", a rather sloppy cover of the best song on The Stones' first album.
• The Waterboys - "Old England Is Dying".
• Big Country - "Fields of Fire".
• Arab Strap - "The First Big Weekend. Narky Blert (talk) 21:38, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

Old England (Remastered version) has an interesting time signature and good lyrics (sax seems out of place, though). Couldn't understand what the guy in the kilt is saying in Arab Strap (I presume it's profound), but I like it. El_C 13:48, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Unsurprisingly, The Termites were eaten by The Aardvarks or something, and vanished without trace. The only unusual feature of that track is that I must have heard it once 66 years ago and remembered it.

The Waterboys also did a lot of quiet reflective stuff, which you might want to look out for.

I rather thought that Arab Strap might be most to your taste. I don't need subtitles, but reading the lyrics helps get into the mood. Basically, nothing happens. It's one of those numbers which music-loving radio DJs dig out occasionally. Narky Blert (talk) 20:45, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Narky, it was to my taste. Sorry, one week -belated. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ El_C 13:55, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

Don't know how to de-escalate PAs

Hi! As you're probably aware you banned me earlier in the month from ANI for CIR (justifiably so). I have recently been the target of personal attacks at an AfD I started here, by Roxy the dog. I wish to de-escalate the situation but I don't reallly know how. I don't have any bad will against them and recently buried the hatchet with them. I asked a few times to see if the other user would apologize and stay on-topic to the discussion but they have not, and don't know what else to do without escalation (especially since this might be affecting other users as well). Santacruz ⁂ Please tag me! 16:34, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

I'd start by no longer replying to them. Either of the people in the AfD. You're not going to change either of their minds, and other people looking at the AfD won't read all that shit. Just disengage. You could even go so far as removing the AfD and article from your watchlist and let the process sort itself out. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:48, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

But the personal attacks were unprovoken, and happen to other editors as well. They've personally attacked me multiple times this month and have 7 bans for edit warring and personal attacks. There is no guarantee that if I disengage and then make any discussion in skeptic topics that I won't get insulted by them again, and while I don't want to escalate it I don't know what else to do. Last time I thought that burying the hatched would be enough but it didn't seem so. My issue is not with the AfD itself (Alexbrn has made some great points there and I'm looking forward to how that discussion is added upon by other editors) but with Roxy's pattern of attacks. Santacruz ⁂ Please tag me! 17:05, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

You asked how to deescalate. If you're seeking action that would be an escalation. If you disengage and ignore then the situation is deescalated. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:25, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

I meant like, long-term. Santacruz ⁂ Please tag me! 17:44, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry for jumping in, but harassment on WP is something that I'm always concerned about. I think what you have been doing - pointing out that you view comments as a personal attack - is the right thing to do. Currently, I don't think that the comments have reached a point where they are actionable, as the community provides a fair bit of leeway. However, ongoing harassment will reach a point where it will be acted on. So one of two things will happen - they'll get the point and pull back, or it will be clear to the community that they won't, and the community will act.

I'm very uncomfortable with ignoring harassment completely. Often when a long-term editor is indef blocked it is clear from their history that they had an ongoing problem, and that every time people would ignore or defend their comments, until finally they could ignore or defend them no more. - Bilby (talk) 00:22, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

I came here because of who made the last edit and the topic title. The ping didn't work for some reason. I cannot believe the OP read my talk page and then typed the above. -Roxy the dog. wooF 00:39, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

The ping didn't work because it wasn't intended to work — {{no ping|Roxy the dog}}. El_C 12:05, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Hi everyone. Sorry, but some stuff came up, so I'm a bit pressed for time for the next little while — it's quite possible I overlooked something important. Still, a couple of notes, FWIW. A._C._Santacruz, I'm not seeing personal attacks in that AfD (Nov 23), and certainly not harassment, Bilby (again, maybe I missed it). Granted, Roxy the dog's criticism of your , uh, content focus (?) isn't particularly gentle. But is gentle always better? When you asked Roxy for an WP:APOLOGY (Nov 6), that read awkwardly to me. I'm sorry to say, but it comes across as misdirected at best and a provocation at worst (which I'm sure wasn't your intent). In general, I'm of the view that forced/requested apologies are rarefy if ever a good idea. I'd probably respond in the negative to such a request had it been directed to me, tbh.

Still, admittedly, I am not entirely unbiased here as I've always been firmly on the camp of the pro-science editors (regulars at WP:FTN, etc.). Like, with the section you've linked to (User_talk:Roxy_the_dog#Questions) that seems to be about Roxy resisting attempts to remove the pseudoscience descriptor from the Astrology page, even though the WP:ARBPS talk page notice {{Ds/talk notice|topic=ps}} is at the top of its talk page. Anyway, I think ScottishFinnishRadish advise about de-escalation was pretty good, at least for now.

Sorry, that's all the time I can really expend to this right now. Other admins' mileage may vary. @Wugapodes: maybe help out with this one, too...? If you do, I'm willing to illegally campaign for your ArbCom candidacy. I already have a good slogan: Opabinia regalis has failed the cat community — a vote for Wugapodes is a vote for kittens! El_C 12:05, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

A list of disrespectful/ridiculing/sometimes PA edits by Roxy in both the ANI thread and the AfD: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. And the diffs for the Apaugasma interaction I referenced above: 1, 2. Calling people silly, apes, asking them to "take a long walk off a short pier" (urban dictionary), how is this not harassing me and other users from editing within pseudoscience/skepticism articles? I don't see the point in mentioning that they're pro-science as if that makes their words ok. Having the 'right POV' is not an excuse for insults and belittling others. As an atheist mathematics nerd that grew up in a homeopathic, astrologic, auspicious, highly catholic household I am as anti-pseudoscience as Roxy. But the way they're interacting is just not constructive. Santacruz ⁂ Please tag me! 13:41, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

A._C._Santacruz, nothing in those diffs stands out to me as being particularly egregious. Sorry, I'm generally not interested in tone policing, so I'm the wrong admin to ask to act no that. I'll act on WP:HARASS and WP:NPA, but I rarely do WP:CIVILITY enforcement, because I don't like doing that. And he didn't call you an ape — he said went ape at ANI over it. That's just normal slang to 'going overboard', excess, etc. In fact, I'm reading Hate Inc. right now and Taibbi uses that exact phrase in a way that, to me, comes across as relatively inoffensive (I'll see if I can find the quote, since it was just a few pages ago). Anyway, I'm not sure what you want me to do.

More broadly, there are several veteran editors (I'm talking years) who are, to put it bluntly, chronically uncivil, which is something the community has generally been unable to remedy in a decisive way (i.e. beyond occasional blocks). I'd rank Roxy somewhere at the average of that continuum between annoying (definitely me) and seriously insulting. Again, mileage, vary, etc. El_C 14:06, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Being pinged here I just want to say this: in real life I'm an atheist, a skeptic, and heavily pro-science, and the worst part of being targeted by anti-pseudoscience editors around here is really being branded as pro-fringe just for disagreeing with them. I find that extremely insulting, especially because other WP editors pick this up and also start to regard me that way. Otherwise, yes: disengage, unblockables, varying mileage, etc. ☿ Apaugasma (talk ☉) 14:27, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Point taken, Apaugasma. I freely admit that there are probably nuances here which I'm not fully cognizant of. El_C 14:33, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Just an example of being targeted by anti-pseudoscience editors around here is really being branded as pro-fringe just for disagreeing with them here, I just noticed that ScottishFinnishRadish is not only at war with GSoW, but is actively supporting Fringe. They removed pertinent criticism info from the BLP of "medium" Thomas John Flanagan, including the summary of his felony conviction from the lead. That was because I removed clear BLPvio here and here. I don't know if that is harassment, but it's certainly WP:BATTLEGROUND and uncivil. Also, that article could probably do with some revdel. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 14:47, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

I mean, it's an WP:ASPERSION (and probably BATTLEGROUND, too), but I wouldn't call it harassment. El_C 15:08, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

And I didn't, and wouldn't, seek any sanctions or the like. I didn't even report anything when they restored the BLP violation to the lead. It's mostly just an example of the behavior around the topic. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 15:12, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Oh, I see. Sure, some venting is allowed here. And, yeah, I sort of gathered, as much as I understood what was happening in that ANI thread (read: not a lot). But at least I was able to (not?) learn that Valereee likes websites, so silver lining. El_C 15:19, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

By the way, just because we're having a civil conversation doesn't mean I forgot. I'll never forget! ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 15:29, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

That list needs expansion... El_C 15:39, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

@A. C. Santacruz: I read through the thread and some of the diffs, and I agree with El C that nothing I've seen looks like it needs admin tools to resolve just yet, but I will say that the battleground developing does concern me. At this point the best advice I have for you is to simply disengage. Conflict tends towards a cycle of escalating back and forth, so to de-escalate, break the cycle instead of feeding it. It's hard and takes a lot of personal strength, but if de-escalation were easy we'd have a lot less conflict on here. For my part, I'll try talking to Roxy and see if we can all take a step back before walking off a cliff. — Wug·a·po·des​ 19:41, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

EL , I think it is really hard for someone to determine if a statement is offensive or not. The way I generally tackle it is if someone clearly states that they are offended, and the other editor continues to make the same coments, then it doesn't matter if I would be offended or not, as repeating the comment after they express how they feel becomes harassment. Sometimes it is simpler - physical threats, repeatedly saying that someone is incompetent by accusing them of WP:CIR, blatant insults - but I can't always recognise what someone finds offensive, yet this doesn't mean that it isn't, so I encourage people to be clear about when they are offended. Most editors will respect that, editors who deliberatly want to cause offense won't. That doesn't mean that all potentially offensive statemnts should be actionable, but I think repeated deliberate offense becomes such. - Bilby (talk) 22:48, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for looking into this, Wugapodes. Appreciated. BTW, I think I might have found a good Nexpo-esque creepypasta (still reviewing — it's like 2 hours long).

Bilby, absolutely. And it is partly this excess of grey area for subjective interpretation that discourages me from enforcing WP:CIVIL, at least as decisively as I would WP:HARASS and WP:NPA. And, again, in general, I'm just not a fan of tone policing. But, indeed, if someone is being unrelentingly unpleasant to folks (which I don't think Roxy is, though he's no angel, either), then I'd be more inclined to support action or even act myself. El_C 11:46, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Film clip of the day

Paul Robeson - "Ol' Man River" - link.

It is a cause for enduring regret that Robeson only recorded one of Dvořák's ten Biblical Songs - "By the Waters of Babylon" (in the original Czech, yet).

Am I right in thinking this may be to your taste, or is that pie in the sky?

{added) a historical document by Harry K. McClintock. Narky Blert (talk) 22:51, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Like. Wow, great post, Narky! On this talk page, you get bonus credits just for linking to Paul Robeson. And you get extra-Gerda hymn credits for linking to The Preacher and the Slave. BTW, I like In the Sweet By-and-By (and I like J.P. Webster), a lot, I find it really beautiful. El_C 11:30, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

yes, rich post, like all of it (writing in Berlin) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:01, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Randomly: well, if you have schnitzel — take pics! El_C 14:44, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

The Berlin specialties are liver, Eisbein and Currywurst. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:49, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Well, okay, when next in Vienna, then. Now I feel like liver and onions. El_C 15:16, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

which I had --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:04, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Pics or it didn't happen. El_C 16:24, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

pics taken but no time to upload yet, - and off for a chamber music concert in the Pierre Boulez Hall where I took a pic earlier (years ago) but never uploaded --Gerda Arendt (|talk) 16:30, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

@Gerda Arendt: Did Stefan George write nouns with lowercase initial letters, or are the transcriptions in String Quartets (Schoenberg)#Text faulty?

George wrote lower case. You are a fast reader, - did you get it from my talk or looked up the program? - I didn't upload my pics of the hall because taking pictures is verboten, but they are better than what we have here ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 20:57, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the info! I googled Pierre-Boulez-Saal for the programme and looked at our Schoenberg article to refresh my memory of the poems (and played the Haydn). Narky Blert (talk) 11:50, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Thanksgiving music - click on November songs for the food delivery. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:04, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

That Showboat clip is remarkable for 1936. Even years later (to at least Hellzapoppin', 1941), Hollywood films would include a toe-curling musical interlude in which a group of darkies would discover a piano on the set and hold an impromptu dance party.

Neither the hymn nor the parody is well-known in UK; but "pie in the sky" is long-established idiom (from at least the 1950s to my knowledge). I'd make a small wager that "The P and the S" had been brought over by a labo(u)r activist, and that those Scottish miners knew both the song and who Joe Hill was.

The most unexpected articles can get serious numbers of views. When I wrote C. Austin Miles, I never expected 20 views/day; nor anywhere near 17 for the Dvořák cycle. Narky Blert (talk) 20:49, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Gerda, apples? No! I wouldn't touch a Waldorf Salad even if it would be served by Basil himself. Yuck. El_C 11:25, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Narky, Sorry, is that a lot of page views? I don't really have a metric. I just checked and it looks like my talk page gets about 100 a day, so C. Austin Miles — C Deez Nuts! Needless to say, I like Richard Griffiths (RIP). Thanks as always for the education on the history of British workers and their struggle. El_C 11:25, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Be in the news, even in a minor way, and you can get a thousand plus; be obscure, and 1 (background noise) is typical. If you're a prolific editor, you can get 400-700 for your Home Page. Narky Blert (talk) 12:08, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

"juxtaposition of the sublime and the trivial" didn't interest many but me ;) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:29, 28 November 2021 (UTC)

View count or it didn't happen! (See what I did there, Narky?) El_C 14:03, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Filippo was a youngbloodyfool. Charging an armoured car with hand grenades? ptui! (Isn't that a super photo? I was very pleased to find it.) The Gold Medal was often posthumous, and IMO as an award is right up there with the VC and MoH.

There's an undocumented story we can only guess at. Italy was in something of disarray between 1943 and 1945, with 20-odd years of fascism to dismantle; but someone saw fit to collect the details of that incident and send them upwards towards the Quirinale; where clearly someone took notice. I like to imagine that one day a shiny limousine glided into a Neapolitan slum to the admiration of all, a man wearing a tricolor sash heaved himself out, knocked on a door, and proceeded to read that document aloud. Narky Blert (talk) 00:54, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

I got a decent sense of that overall context in the last chapter of the last book I read (chapter 7 of 7, "Nazis," in Rome: A History in Seven Sackings — see here). It's an unbelievable bio of a brief life, to be sure, from what little that is known. El_C 13:45, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Obtaining consensus is a blockable offense?

I've been told obtaining consensus is a blockable offence, and in the same discussion asked by the same person and another editor they tagged to do the opposite. Now I'm confused. Cipher21 (talk) 18:30, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Yeah, I'm not following that blocked/banned for disruption, either (by TrangaBellam). I presume it's due to... reasons. And I wouldn't worry about that Filing an edit request to reinstate deleted content is cheeky. If it gets reported to admins they will take a dim view of it (by Kautilya3). I just presume you didn't know that this isn't what edit requests are for. Also, I set the protection to WP:FULL, not to WP:ECP, so you made a mistake there as only admins can edit the page currently (protection expires in 2 days though, anyway).—oops, wrong page

Anyway, as Kautilya3 mentions, run an WP:RfC and/or consult WP:RSN about the strength of those sources in making these claims (about allies). Maybe they'll be deemed good enough; maybe they'll need to be qualified (like in parenthesis, claimed by x); or maybe they're no good. The editorial process will determine which is which. So you're free to explore that avenue.

That said, wrt my own recollection of my interaction with you, I observed that: 1. you're still pretty low on the wiki learning curve, but are not that cognizant that you are (i.e. of those limitations, a bit of a Dunning–Kruger thing, tbh). And 2. You tend to WP:BLUDGEON discussions in that confused state. Take that as you will. Good luck. El_C 20:37, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I hadn't read TrangaBellam's comment carefully. Consensus-seeking is not problematic. But, Cipher21, you need to discuss it with the people that objected to the content. You can't randomly issue an edit request for it to be reinstated. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 23:55, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

From the perspective of someone who answers hundreds of edit requests, a request for someone to revert someone else's edits is pretty much an automatic "seek consensus" template reply. Of the article is protected there's generally a reason, and asking someone to edit war on your behalf through protection is generally not good. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 00:05, 26 November 2021 (UTC)

Just because I like it

Godley & Creme - "Under Your Thumb". One of the very few ghost stories in popular song. Narky Blert (talk) 00:36, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Nice, Narky. I was unaware, so definitely an Under My Thumb misdirect for me! Interesting you mention g-g-g-ghosts and ghostings, because I've been watching a lot of scary content lately (Nexpo, etc.), which as I was recently telling Wugapodes (also a fan) I find a bit difficult to define as a creepypasta'ish genre, though I've heard Pyrocynical call it "Transmedia storytelling," which is a pretty good albeit partial term for it. (See #Boo! for more spooky details and #HSGS for even more of the lore.) El_C 13:58, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

It hadn't occurred to me before - but I wonder if G&C were consciously or unconsciously writing a reply song to "UMT", which is exceptionally misogynistic even by early Stones standards. Narky Blert (talk) 21:22, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Edit war

Hi El C! I'd like to ask for your help with an edit war at Talk:Ali#problematic_edits. Thanks! Albertatiran (talk) 08:16, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Albertatiran, I'm sorry but I'm not available to assist you with this at this time. Enforcement for edit warring can be sought at WP:AN3. Good luck. El_C 14:00, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

No worries, thanks for letting me know. Albertatiran (talk) 15:13, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Omicron

• Omicron (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Temporary semi-protection: persistent IP vandalism due to emergence of SARS-CoV-2 Omicron variant after expiry of protection has resumed. Already asked at WP:RfPP yesterday, but seems fo lks are busy. Thanks 2402:3A80:6C1:96A:9464:D5D3:4371:B576 (talk) 04:04, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Already protected by administrator Johnuniq. El_C 13:46, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Just because I like it

Steve Winwood - "Arc of a Diver" - link

He was so disgustingly talented that he had a UK #1 at age 15 with "Keep on Running" - link. (I prefer the cover to the original, but only just.)

(Another Steve scored a US #1 at age 13 - link.)

Bonus track, because I'm feeling generous today. (This is the song being parodied.) Narky Blert (talk) 23:23, 2 December 2021 (UTC)

Like. I'll have me some Steve Winwood (and friends) any day! And now I want biscuit, but not the weird English kind — the good kind. El_C 02:04, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

That's not a biscuit! that's a bun or a bread roll (or in my bit of England, a batch, and in other parts, a bap or a butty; you can starve to death trying to get a food order right; for some reason, all the synonyms seem to begin with 'b').

I've never been a big SW fan, I find his harp sound grating, but the man has class. Once asked if his blindness was a handicap to his career, he replied, "It could have been worse, I might have been born Black".

Skiffle was a sort of English proto-punk - all you needed was enthusiasm, a washboard, a tea-chest bass, a crappy guitar, a beat-up drumkit, and some imported 78s. Lonnie Donegan isn't on anyone's list of superstars, but look at his list of singles - getting Lead Belly and Woody numbers into the UK charts in the 1950s says something about his ears. The bands of the British Invasion grew up listening to him. Narky Blert (talk) 21:25, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Destiny

See also: User:El C/Songs from new lands, User:El C/Songs from the homeland

A blast from the past! (circa 2002). El_C 08:40, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

Spinning over simple things. El_C 08:17, 26 February 2021 (UTC)

Oceanic feeling

River Man. El_C 00:05, 13 March 2021 (UTC)

Memories of Spain

Tomatito & Michel Camilo (2000)

Chick and Hiromi my 2p. regards. -Roxy the sycamore. wooF 16:20, 27 March 2021 (UTC)

Resting: a compilation

Flite — El_C 10:06, 29 March 2021 (UTC)

On Sight — El_C 10:06, 6 April 2021 (UTC)

The return of Remix surfing

Be Honest — El_C 22:47, 12 June 2021 (UTC)

Close Your Eyes — El_C 18:13, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Shut Up 'n Play Yer Guitar

Whipping Post→Mountain Jam — El_C 23:02, 22 July 2021 (UTC)

Dope-A-Licious — El_C 00:09, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

Air

Unveiled — El_C 15:36, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

Prism #1 — El_C 11:41, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Water

Deep down → Secret Blue — El_C 18:19, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

Jack-A-Roe — El_C 11:16, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

Fall songspam

All Along the Watchtower — El_C 04:10, 6 September 2021 (UTC)

Oh My God! — El_C 00:25, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

Poetry — El_C 12:05, 7 September 2021 (UTC)

Paroles, paroles ("Words, words") — El_C 02:02, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

Ebatule — El_C 14:25, 8 September 2021 (UTC)

Europa (Earth's Cry Heaven's Smile) — El_C 00:34, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Booty Step — El_C 11:17, 9 September 2021 (UTC)

Gymnopédie No. 1 → Arabesque No. 1 — El_C 10:31, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Raat Ne Main Baandhi Chhe — El_C 15:34, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Reza, Meu Bem — El_C 23:13, 10 September 2021 (UTC)

Because — El_C 12:30, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Noite Longa — El_C 18:03, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Voce Me Apereceu — El_C 05:27, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

Lodger → It Starts When We Disappear — El_C 15:50, 12 September 2021 (UTC)

One More Day — El_C 00:17, 13 September 2021 (UTC)

Sing Song Kitty → Bonaparte's Retreat — El_C 11:33, 13 September 2021 (UTC)

Girls Love Kehlani → Table El_C 01:46, 14 September 2021 (UTC)

Kkwy — El_C 01:11, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Convoy — El_C 15:43, 15 September 2021 (UTC)

Black Water (studio) → Live (1974) — El_C 08:53, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Summertime → The House of the Rising Sun — El_C 13:40, 16 September 2021 (UTC)

Bossa Esfera — El_C 13:06, 17 September 2021 (UTC)

Down Man — El_C 13:36, 18 September 2021 (UTC)

The High Road — El_C 02:42, 19 September 2021 (UTC)

Found You — El_C 14:16, 20 September 2021 (UTC)

Quero ver — El_C 01:22, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

Raag Gawati (Dhan Dhan Bhag Hamare) — El_C 17:11, 21 September 2021 (UTC)

I Adore You — El_C 13:55, 22 September 2021 (UTC)

Angola Anthem — El_C 18:40, 23 September 2021 (UTC)

Dopesnotfunkae — El_C 21:26, 24 September 2021 (UTC)

Descarga for Tito — El_C 18:28, 26 September 2021 (UTC)

Positive Notions — El_C 02:10, 28 September 2021 (UTC)

One — El_C 14:06, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Secret Sun — El_C 21:58, 30 September 2021 (UTC)

Back Where It All Begins — El_C 14:08, 7 October 2021 (UTC)

Riflessività — El_C 03:25, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

Title 1 → 2 → 3 → 4 — El_C 16:39, 10 October 2021 (UTC)

Tudo Que Você Podia Ser — El_C 13:54, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Necessary Discrepancy — El_C 13:21, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Way Star — El_C 09:09, 16 October 2021 (UTC)

Lament — El_C 15:09, 17 October 2021 (UTC)

Lovely Day — El_C 14:00, 18 October 2021 (UTC)

Alter Ego — El_C 11:48, 20 October 2021 (UTC)

עמוד האש — El_C 13:24, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Won't Pray Adagio → Angel's Serenade — El_C 20:25, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

The Distance — El_C 18:10, 22 October 2021 (UTC)

Toxic — El_C 12:58, 23 October 2021 (UTC)

I'm the Man Who Loves You → Poor Places — El_C 07:09, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

Money Trees (original) → Sembari Edit → DJ Dahi & DJ Rahki: Sample masters — El_C 20:19, 24 October 2021 (UTC)

Creation & Destruction — El_C 14:50, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Fuck the System — El_C 22:56, 25 October 2021 (UTC)

Esperar Pra Ver — El_C 10:13, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

New Coat Of Paint — El_C 12:04, 27 October 2021 (UTC)

The Ecstasy of Gold — El_C 13:25, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

One Way — El_C 13:52, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

A Little Less Conversation — El_C 15:16, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

Power in the Darkness — El_C 18:01, 29 October 2021 (UTC)

תמונה → Guitar — El_C 15:12, 30 October 2021 (UTC)

Smokestack Lightning — El_C 11:42, 31 October 2021 (UTC)

Ann River, Mn → Bibio Remix — El_C 10:43, 4 November 2021 (UTC)

Mirror Temple — El_C 01:37, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Zoiks — El_C 15:24, 5 November 2021 (UTC)

Tuyo — El_C 14:56, 6 November 2021 (UTC)

Exogenesis: Symphony Pt. 1 (Overture) — El_C 13:54, 8 November 2021 (UTC)

Lotus Land → A Lotus On Irish Streams — El_C 12:02, 9 November 2021 (UTC)

Romance del Diablo — El_C 13:23, 13 November 2021 (UTC)

Enemy → (Worlds 2021 version → Radio edit → Orchestral/instrumental) → Guns for Hire → Goodbye — El_C 10:39, 14 November 2021 (UTC)

Floral Fury — El_C 18:40, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

Waking Up → VIP Extended Mix — El_C 10:00, 18 November 2021 (UTC)

Solução Edit — El_C 13:30, 20 November 2021 (UTC)

אפילו דקה → Trem das Onze — El_C 14:13, 21 November 2021 (UTC)

Knives Out — El_C 16:23, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Child in Time — El_C 01:16, 23 November 2021 (UTC)

Free Bird (extended studio) — El_C 12:09, 24 November 2021 (UTC)

Nobody Speak → Nobody Move — El_C 11:53, 25 November 2021 (UTC)

Be Alright (Live at One Love Manchester) — El_C 11:39, 27 November 2021 (UTC)

Victory Theme (SHADOWFOX2 Remix) → Funk Fiction Remix — El_C 14:15, 1 December 2021 (UTC)

Everywhere at the End of Time (Nexpo 4-min summary) → Full album (6.5 hours) — El_C 02:14, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Chris Hedges: "The Meaning of Christmas" (December 27, 2020). El_C 23:50, 21 February 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, everyone, with very few exceptions, I will not be accepting any new requests for administrative intervention on my talk page for the foreseeable future. In the meantime, enjoy the music! El_C 18:33, 16 February 2021 (UTC)

Now also introducing Buck Flower, security guard (challenging times ahead!). El_C 12:46, 24 February 2021 (UTC)

Gerda's December corner

December songs

Today: sharing symphonic music - happy listening! - I asked the arb cands if they'd listen, which is an art. - Listen to what de:Jerome Kohl wrote about Zeitmaße, premiered by Pierre Boulez. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:30, 3 December 2021 (UTC)

Notification

I will be appealing my topic ban at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard SecretName101 (talk) 00:03, 4 December 2021 (UTC)