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::As well as military campaigns..as far as I know the statement is inaccurate ] (]) 22:19, 5 November 2023 (UTC) ::As well as military campaigns..as far as I know the statement is inaccurate ] (]) 22:19, 5 November 2023 (UTC)
:You're absolutely right! In The Apology, Plato writes that Socrates visited the Oracle at Delphi - which is certainly NOT Athens. I concur that the article, at a minimum, should states this, or remove the line altogether that says he never left Athens. ] (]) 06:47, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

:Good catch. After double checking the source that was quoted, I've removed the line that states Socrates "never traveled outside of Athens, except for his military campaigns" for the following reasons:
== Lede ==
:1) According to Plato. Socrates did at least travel to Delphi (which is outside of Athens).

:2) The source that was cited doesn't even say that as a fact anyway. The citation was Page 10 of the book "Socrates: A guide for the perplexed", and for good measure I read pages 8-12. The source is an opinion piece, which paraphrases Section 230D of Plato's Phaedrus, saying that a young man named Phaedrus *accused* Socrates of never having left the city walls. Obviously, a mere accusation of someone should not be presented as a factual statement, as that line did.
The opening sentence - the reference is National Geographic. Surely for a philosopher of this stature and notability a number of ] sources could be provided? It is not as if he is little-known. ] (]) 10:24, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
:3) Even the source used in the book of 230D in Plato's Phaedrus is wrong! Or, at the very least it's taken WAY out of context. If you go read starting with 230C, Phaedrus says about Socrates "You are an amazing and most remarkable person. For you really do seem exactly like a stranger who is being guided about, and not like a native. You don't go away from the city out over the border, and it seems to me you don't go outside the walls at all."
:I agree..there should be at least one other source to support for the first sentence of the article ] (]) 00:11, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
:It was a compliment, not an accusation, and the next line further shows it was a friendly and affectionate conversation when Socrates responds in 230E: "Forgive me, my dear friend. You see, I am fond of learning. Now the country places and the trees won't teach me anything, and the people in the city do. But you seem to have found the charm to bring me out. For as people lead hungry animals by shaking in front of them a branch of leaves or some fruit, just so, I think, you, by holding before me discourses in books, will lead me all over Attica and wherever else you please." (https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0174%3Atext%3DPhaedrus%3Asection%3D230d) ] (]) 07:20, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
::Per ], the lead should be a summary of the rest of the article, if the claims in the lead are justified elsewhere in the article with secondary sources, it's not necessary to also cite them in the lead. Do you dispute the claim that {{tq|Socrates was a Greek philosopher from Athens who is credited as the founder of Western philosophy and among the first moral philosophers of the ethical tradition of thought}}, or think that others are likely to challenge it? It certainly seems accurate enough to me. ] (]) 00:27, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
:::I removed the reference. . No citation is needed at the lead. ]] 09:07, 10 September 2023 (UTC)


== Political climate == == Political climate ==
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:hi @]. Apologies for the delay. I 'll try to reply as soon as I have some spare time. ]] 08:41, 9 November 2023 (UTC) :hi @]. Apologies for the delay. I 'll try to reply as soon as I have some spare time. ]] 08:41, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
::Hi @], Apologies for the late reply. The political climate is pivotal for grasping the trial of Socrates. A prevalent theory suggests that the trial was politically motivated, as elaborated within the section. It's crucial to provide readers with contextual information regarding the political climate of the time to fully comprehend the political argument presented in the article.]] 07:34, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

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Delphi

The article states he never left Athens although the general historical consensus is he visited Delphi at least once 91.140.15.141 (talk) 17:59, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Maybe not the historical consensus but that’s what I was taught in school and what I’ve read regarding Socrates 2A01:CB05:62E:7300:D0B1:F080:DDB4:E7A9 (talk) 16:32, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
As well as military campaigns..as far as I know the statement is inaccurate Anonymous8206 (talk) 22:19, 5 November 2023 (UTC)
You're absolutely right! In The Apology, Plato writes that Socrates visited the Oracle at Delphi - which is certainly NOT Athens. I concur that the article, at a minimum, should states this, or remove the line altogether that says he never left Athens. Wealthistime (talk) 06:47, 1 March 2024 (UTC)
Good catch. After double checking the source that was quoted, I've removed the line that states Socrates "never traveled outside of Athens, except for his military campaigns" for the following reasons:
1) According to Plato. Socrates did at least travel to Delphi (which is outside of Athens).
2) The source that was cited doesn't even say that as a fact anyway. The citation was Page 10 of the book "Socrates: A guide for the perplexed", and for good measure I read pages 8-12. The source is an opinion piece, which paraphrases Section 230D of Plato's Phaedrus, saying that a young man named Phaedrus *accused* Socrates of never having left the city walls. Obviously, a mere accusation of someone should not be presented as a factual statement, as that line did.
3) Even the source used in the book of 230D in Plato's Phaedrus is wrong! Or, at the very least it's taken WAY out of context. If you go read starting with 230C, Phaedrus says about Socrates "You are an amazing and most remarkable person. For you really do seem exactly like a stranger who is being guided about, and not like a native. You don't go away from the city out over the border, and it seems to me you don't go outside the walls at all."
It was a compliment, not an accusation, and the next line further shows it was a friendly and affectionate conversation when Socrates responds in 230E: "Forgive me, my dear friend. You see, I am fond of learning. Now the country places and the trees won't teach me anything, and the people in the city do. But you seem to have found the charm to bring me out. For as people lead hungry animals by shaking in front of them a branch of leaves or some fruit, just so, I think, you, by holding before me discourses in books, will lead me all over Attica and wherever else you please." (https://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0174%3Atext%3DPhaedrus%3Asection%3D230d) Wealthistime (talk) 07:20, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

Political climate

@Cinadon36: please explain how the political climate is relevant here. I don't think the paragraph that I removed does this. Thanks, Willbb234 13:05, 6 November 2023 (UTC)

hi @Willbb234. Apologies for the delay. I 'll try to reply as soon as I have some spare time. Cinadon36 08:41, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
Hi @Willbb234, Apologies for the late reply. The political climate is pivotal for grasping the trial of Socrates. A prevalent theory suggests that the trial was politically motivated, as elaborated within the section. It's crucial to provide readers with contextual information regarding the political climate of the time to fully comprehend the political argument presented in the article.Cinadon36 07:34, 11 November 2023 (UTC)
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