Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 15:56, 24 June 2010

Wildhartlivie is suffering from physical health issues. This may affect their ability to work on Misplaced Pages. Consequently, they may not be able to respond to talk-page messages or e-mails in a timely manner. Your patience is greatly appreciated.

Template:Archive box collapsible

Referencing

{{refstart}} or link to WP:REFB.

Thanks

Thanks for your patience (I know it's probably growing thin by now, LOL) with Fragma08. I wonder if perhaps we're dealing with a Scientologist. Not making any accusation, mind you, just curious at this point, especially with his/her visceral reaction to my suggesting adding a section dealing with Scientology and his/her claims not to know about the whole Scientology connection to CCHR. I do agree that English is probably not his/her original language and may inadvertently be adding to the problems here. It looks like an Admin is watching now and making some sensible edits, so hopefully the fracas will die down. 173.50.247.46 (talk) 16:30, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

I think Fragma08 might be relatively new to the wild and wooly ways of Misplaced Pages and therefore not used to the--"spirited"--discussions that often take place here.  :) I actually don't want to register an account for the very reason this "talk" reveals--the defensiveness and hair trigger tempers (not you). If you look at the edit history, it looks like a Wyss (which now redirects to Gwen Gale) made the most edits, and she (?) seems to be an Admin, too, so you might want to ask her to keep an eye on the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.50.247.46 (talk) 16:44, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

what are we? 5 years old? Watch it with the personal attacks, please. You don't want to join Fragma in the penalty box, do you? --SarekOfVulcan (talk) 17:40, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi, again, hope I'm not pestering you and sorry I forgot to sign my post above--I learned everything I know about Misplaced Pages from looking at other people's posts in the "Edit" function so I make a lot of mistakes, which is why I don't want to edit yet. I was perusing the edit history of the Farmer article and noticed you had reverted an edit about her age in 1945. I actually think the editor who did that was correct--if Frances was born in September 1913 then she would indeed have only been 31 (not 32) in May 1945. Minor, I know, but I thought I'd mention it.  :) 173.50.247.46 (talk) 16:10, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

RfC

Moonriddengirl has set up this page for putting together the RfC on the color question: Comments are welcome. Thanks. Malke2010 21:34, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Joplin photo orphan

Rossrs feels that if we can identify the copyright or any details about the photo, it might be acceptable. Can you check if you have any more album details? Thanks. --Wikiwatcher1 (talk) 22:18, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Editing milestones

Howdy. I noticed you have an editing milestone table on your user page. Unfortunately it seems like that tool you link to is currently out of commission. Do you know of any replacement tools that do something similar?--Rockfang (talk) 23:30, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

Is this subject for deletion

Natalie Wood Still1.jpg

I noticed the license only allows for photos taken between 1923 and 1963.

This should be checked into, because I am certain that photo is either from 1964 or 1965. There is another shot WikiWatcher uploaded that was taken about ten years earlier. However, WikiWatcher wrote the date as "circa 1960". This user is not entirely credible, as they also wrote that Wood and Beatty never had a romantic relationship, which I reverted and provided a source that said otherwise.Kbucket (talk) 01:43, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Is this subject for deletion

File: Natalie Wood Still1.jpg

I noticed the license only allows for photos taken between 1923 and 1963.

This should be checked into, because I am certain that photo is either from 1964 or 1965. There is another shot WikiWatcher uploaded that was taken about ten years earlier. However, WikiWatcher wrote the date as "circa 1960". This user is not entirely credible, as they also wrote that Wood and Beatty never had a romantic relationship, which I reverted and provided a source that said otherwise.Kbucket (talk) 01:43, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Bette Davis

I understand what you have just explained. But you must correct a few things. "The Corn Is Green" was a major hit garnering 2.2 million dollars at the Box Office and was well received by critics. The only failure was that Bette failed to get nominated for an Academy Award. "A Stolen Life" did indeed received poor reviews but both her performances from this film were hailed by the critics. You find all this information on Spada's "Bette Davis: More Than a Woman" (1993)released by Warner Books pages 320-321 (Corn), and 333-334 (Stolen). All the awards that I added to Bette's palmares were listed in her "This'n That" autobiography and on www.imdb.com. I see you are a Bette Davis fan. So am I. Maybe with your help we'll make this great article even greater.--Mircea romania (talk) 15:03, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi to you both. This probably should be discussed at Talk:Bette Davis unless we can get this sorted out quickly. I agree substantially with Wildhartlivie and her reasons for reverting these edits. Particularly I don't think the apartment information was correctly placed or relevant - she lived in several houses/apartments during her lifetime. If any of her homes are to be mentioned, her home in Maine is the one she seemed fondest of and spoke about at length in her autobiographical writing. I've got the Spada book but obviously a different edition as the page numbers don't match.

The Corn is Green - Spada p. 229: "The film posted a profit of $2.2 million, and critics praised Bette's performance in it." Whitney Stine in Mother Goddam wrote "opened... to excellent reviews. After three smash months, the film went into general release." Three "smash" months is a rather lengthy showing for a film of that era. I think the success of the film is pretty well proven, and Mircea romania is correct on that point.

A Stolen Life - Spada p. 238: "The reviews for A Stolen Life were generally poor, but audiences flocked to it, and the picture became Bette's biggest hit, netting a $2.5 million profit at the box office. The overriding reason for its success has to be Bette. She had been off the screen for a year, and in A Stolen Life audiences could see her play both the characters she had always been best at...." This does not address critical reviews of Davis's performance in this film, but only the audience response and attributes it more to Davis herself than her performance. Whitney Stine notes that in 1947 the U.S. Treasury noted that Davis was the highest paid woman in the U.S. and Stine bases this largely on the financial success of A Stolen Life which Davis produced. So the success is clearly there. Stine quotes two reviews, one negative and one that comments positively upon Davis. Davis, in her response to the positive review, expresses appreciation that the reviewer recognises the subtlety of her performance. It could be interpreted that her comment is because she was more used to seeing unfavourable reviews about herself in this film, but for us to draw a conclusion or assume anything, is not appropriate. It would be better to stick with what can be cited. The Films of Bette Davis by Gene Ringgold cites one review and it's negative of both the film and Davis. We always depend on what reviews are available to draw from when writing on films or actors. The danger is that the sources we depend on often cherry-pick their reviews, and then we as editors further cherry-pick. It's difficult. So, the main points about A Stolen Life, in my opinion are : 1. The film was a financial success, and Davis as producer benefited from its success. 2. The film was generally received poorly by critics. 3. We need not address how Davis herself was perceived unless other sources be found.

As for the lifetime awards, I don't think its necessary to provide an exhaustive list as the awards vary in importance and relevance. ie it's very relevant that she was the first female recipient of the AFI Lifetime Achievement Award, but some of the other awards are not especially notable. We do not list every performance given because we need to remain concise and focussed and not every performance is crucial to a general understanding of Davis. Likewise not every award adds to our overall knowledge of her. If we list every award we edge closer to a problem of WP:UNDUE weight being given to these awards, at the expense of other points about Davis's life or achievements that may be equally interesting. It's a matter of drawing the line somewhere, and I'm not entirely sure where the line should be drawn, so by all means, let's discuss that point further.

Again, I think moving this to Talk:Bette Davis may be useful, and I've only commented here because up until now this has been a comment between two editors. Wildhartlivie, it's up to you whether you want to continue this here or at the article talk page. Rossrs (talk) 21:53, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

It's fine to move it to the article talk page. I bow to anything Rossrs has to say about this. He's the Davis scholar here. Wildhartlivie (talk) 11:52, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, how about we leave it here if User talk:Mircea romania believes this has been resolved and it ends here, or move it to the talk page if it requires further discussion? Rossrs (talk) 13:44, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

That works for me. I didn't think the changes were all that helpful, for one thing. Notice I got followed to Natalie Wood? Wildhartlivie (talk) 13:46, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

For the most part, no I didn't think so either but the bit about The Corn is Green was wrong, so that was a good call on Mircea romania's part. I hadn't noticed the other, but it was nearly a full day later. The images are a concern though. I don't know what to think, but if they were put to the test a lot of people would not allow them, especially on Commons where there is much less room for negotiation than we have here. I'm not sure about the date either. The teenage one looks like it fits into the Rebel Without a Cause era - she is very young in that one, and her hair style looks much the same. The other one isn't a very flattering image in my opinion, but even so, based on her hairstyle I'd put it around the Sex and the Single Girl era, which is 1964. That would make her 26 in the photo although I think she looks older. She was such a beautiful woman and I didn't think she could take a bad photo, but oops, I guess I was wrong about that. Rossrs (talk) 14:08, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Back to Bette. I've updated it. I think I've given that section a bit more depth, but mainly I wanted to correct the point about The Corn is Green. I think that point as made by Mircea romania is now resolved. Rossrs (talk) 13:47, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Photograph date

IMDb lists the date for as April 1960.

My guess is that File:Natalie Wood.jpg was taken between 1955 and 1957, and File:Natalie Wood Still1.jpg was taken between 1964 and 1966, but definately not 1960.

The license for the second photo only allows for photos taken between 1923 and 1963 - it was taken after 1963. The first photo is a studio shot, and the tag says it is from a book.

The same user uploaded a photo taken two weeks before her death in November 1981, but it was removed for copyright violation. A screen cap from the movie Brainstorm, with the proper licensing, could be used for the death section, since she was making the movie at the same of her death, and costar Christopher Walken was on the boat she fell from.Kbucket (talk) 22:46, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

I agree, there is no way File:Natalie Wood Still1.jpg was taken in 1960, but I don't think it could be as late as late 1960s either. In this photo from 1969 she has longer hair and a contemporary look, whereas in File:Natalie Wood Still1.jpg her hair is short and the makeup is more old-fashioned, I think it is from the mid 60s. As for her appearance, she always looked a lot older than her real age so that's probably why.Kbucket (talk) 19:37, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes it is a good picture, the uploader just needs to get an appropriate license for it (if that photo is allowed on here). I like this photo on the page (not sure of the date), if it can be properly licensed.Kbucket (talk) 20:20, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Peg Entwistle

Hello there!

Hope all is well with you. You may have noticed some activity on Peg's article between myself and Movie Fan. We are currently discussing the edits. Gosh, remember how I used to go ballistic when someone changed something there!? Now I'm a "Gee Whiz, Wally" kind of guy...I must be getting old...or mature! If you have any ideas, let us know. Otherwise, I think MF and I can work this out. Take care! Jameszerukjr (talk) 17:35, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

MFD

I believe consensus was pretty clear here. I have closed the discussion and removed the MFD tag from the page. This is just an FYI. :) enna_sis @ 20:26, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

Kim Basinger

Why is imdb not a reliable source for her filmography? Kim Basinger has appeared in many TV shows, but they do not appear on her[REDACTED] filmography. If imdb is not a reliable source, then what is? everyone uses that site to find out what projects actors have appeared in. It was probably used for A LOT of information on her page. Why do you think it is not reliable for her filmography?66.53.102.141 (talk) 08:27, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Drive by cmt... imDb is a handy (and even fun) database to get started on learning about what to look for in a research project but it's riddled with errors of fact. Anything gleaned from that website should be cross-checked with and cited to a reliable source which is straightforwardly independent of imDb. Gwen Gale (talk) 08:33, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi

Sorry to hear about your health issues. They can certainly hamper work, especially if stress was involved.

Wanted to mention you reverted edits with what you called 'British' dates. Actually, they're ISO international dates, which are not only acceptable with WP but usually preferred when an article has international significance.

Best wishes! --UnicornTapestry (talk) 09:44, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Photos

Although I've taken photos used in Misplaced Pages, and uploaded close to 400 photos for musicians' biographies (well, maybe 20 were of architecture, and placed all but a dozen of them (only in the Portuguese, English, Spanish, and some French, Arabic and Dutch Misplaced Pages articles), I still don't have a clue about how to get a TUSC account and how it works. All the photos I've uploaded have been in Flickr. Can you help with the TUSC thing? I may know how to read and write, but little else.--Leahtwosaints (talk) 20:00, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Health

Do you think you should wait until it gets worse? I hope you're ok. Rossrs (talk) 08:40, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

If your fever has broken, that's usually a good sign. I'm sure you don't need me telling you how to look after yourself, but look after yourself. Rossrs (talk) 13:29, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Hi, I hope you are feeling better today. I should be home and able to be contacted after 5 pm tomorrow, give or take. Things are going ok here. The 2 pups are behaving ok but they miss their mom and dad and we miss our own place now. :) The saying 'there's no place like home' really fits me right now. Make sure you are drinking a lot of fluids. The last thing you need is to dehydrate. I'll be in touch to see how you are tomorrow or Monday. We leave here as soon as we get a call that they are at the airport and everything is ok with them. Get well soon, --CrohnieGal 20:41, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Well stomach flu and poison ivy sound like a very unpleasant combination. My mother used to give me dry toast and flat lemonade when I was a kid, if ever I had any kind of stomach bug and it always settled it down. Very unappetising but it worked. I don't think she ever had to deal with poison ivy, so I have no home remedy for that one. It's good to know that it's not serious but miserable is bad enough. Take care. I'm thinking of you, although someone thousands of miles away thinking about you doesn't have any practical effect. Rossrs (talk) 23:17, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

There you go! Flat lemonade and flat 7-Up are identical cousins, so for that little remedy to be used in Brisbane and the U.S. - there must be something in it, and although I don't understand why, it must be flat to have any benefit. Your "buttered toast sprinkled with sugar and covered with warm milk" sounds kind of delicious, if you ask me. It's the lazy version of bread-and-butter pudding minus the currants, and that's always pleasant on a cool winter's night. Rossrs (talk) 07:59, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Tradition is great. I used to get severe tonsillitis as a kid, very severe and recurrent. On top of everything the doctor gave me, my mother always gave me vanilla ice cream and raspberry jelly, because it was cool and soothing for my throat. It served no medical purpose at all, but even as an adult it was the only thing that made me feel better when I'd get tonsillitis. There's a lot to be said for the psychological value of comfort food. I've since had my tonsils removed and I do not remember them with any fondness or nostalgia, but I can still have vanilla ice cream and raspberry jelly, can't I? Rossrs (talk) 11:52, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

I was in the area...

I think I decided to stalk you after seeing you on Pitt, but anyway, the edit war you stumbled into the other week seems to have blown over, so I've given you back your rollback button. Just, er, be careful! When in doubt, use another button and make sure you check what you revert. I also turned on autoreviewer for you because your content work demonstrates ample understanding of article writing. Like I say, be careful, especially with rollback. Best, HJ Mitchell | Penny for your thoughts? 02:36, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Tom Cruise ref.

Re 404 link removal: archived links are the first links when using Template:Cite news so I didn't notice that the "Internet archive" link was the archived article link - I thought the it was incorrectly linking to a 404 page. Maybe we can have both? If Parade is a tabloid and not a reliable enough source, then maybe the AP reprint boosts the reliability? -- Jeandré (talk), 2010-06-20t13:02z

Re:WT:ACTOR

Noted. I just noticed that the project never archives its talk page, and as a result it was bordering on unreadable. Wizardman _{Operation Big Bear} 16:40, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Ah, saw this and your posts on Wizardman's talk too late. I also archived a bunch. I did kept your ongoing project. The rest doesn't seem needed anymore on the main page. There will soon be a new RFC anyway on the colour. Garion96 (talk) 18:09, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

I moved the BLP sections back. Garion96 (talk) 18:33, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Question

Does this deserve a revert? --  ThinkBlue  (Hit BLUE) 22:21, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

That's what I thought, and did so to your suggestions. Thanks for the feedback, your help like always. :) --  ThinkBlue  (Hit BLUE) 22:32, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, I know I saw it pop up on my watchlist. I was going to revert his edit, but I wasn't sure, you know, but glad you got to it. I'll keep that in mind if he decides to revert it, his reasoning not that great. Yeah, exactly, notable relationships Ledger had with them, and properly sourced. He probably will throw a fuss, I already got into a dispute with him. Let's just see what happens. --  ThinkBlue  (Hit BLUE) 22:54, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

TY

I think I love you ;-)

She's BAAAACK! Brazen,bold and thinks WE are stupid! Going to my quiet place now BBL! AAARRRGGGHHH!! DocOfSoc (talk) 22:03, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

DocOfSoc (talk) 22:59, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Dancing with the Stars

It would seem as though there are more of them, including Template:Dancing On Ice Series 1, ..., Template:Dancing On Ice Series 5, Template:Strictly Come Dancing Series 1, ..., Template:Strictly Come Dancing Series 7. Plastikspork _―Œ 23:27, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

I responded on my talk page, but basically, I am indifferent to their existence. I found them while closing the TFD for the US templates and thought you might be interested. Thanks! Plastikspork _―Œ 23:57, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Disruptive editing by SIFT & WINNOW

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. The discussion is about the topic Seeking admin assistance for disruptive editor. ]. Thank you. Eurytemora (talk) 08:56, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

thanks :D

You're a good friend, thanks.Malke2010 23:10, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Awards

You cited some references in support of why we shouldn't mention in an actor's introduction that they won an academy award. WP:MOS and Undue Weight are pretty lengthy. Can you cite the exact language in them that you say supports your argument? Also, I'm not sure what you mean by "see every other actor's article". Can you clarify that? Thanks.  :-) Lawyer2b (talk) 02:06, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Re: Dennis Rader

My edit summary contained a typographical error; what I meant to say was that it is unnecessary to point out that "Rader would spend the rest of his life in prison, without any possibility of parole." "Rader would be eligible for parole after 175 years of imprisonment" is sufficient. C1k3 (talk) 03:42, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Jack Lord

Hi. An active editor on Jack Lord has requested a reassessment on my talk page. I believe you were the editor who last assessed it so I'm wondering if you would revisit the topic. If you feel the article does not merit a new assessment, could you briefly offer some suggestions for improvement on the article talk page? Thanks in advance. Viriditas (talk) 04:44, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

Re Jack Lord

First of all, I am pleased you did such a helpful assessment. My only goal is to get the Jack Lord page "up to code", so to speak. I have a question regarding the filmography. I'm using your excellent template to rewrite it. The reason I originally collapsed it, is because his filmography takes up most of the page. I won't collapse this time. But I'm wondering how you feel about giving the filmography a separate page on its own. Would appreciate your opinion on that.

Laugh or not, but before I got to your assessment, some other user jumped in and edited the filmography table, mostly by taking out the reduced font size. Not all that helpful, but it took a lot of work to do that. And I'm hoping that same user leaves the new template alone as it has reduced font size. So, following to that user's talk page, it says "This user is a Sock Puppet". Aren't sock puppets not supposed to be used? Did I read wrong somewhere about sock puppets?

--Maile66 (talk) 15:56, 24 June 2010 (UTC)