Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 22:10, 29 June 2016

No candidates are involved.

This isn't anti-Trump violence or Sanders violence or Hillary violence. It's straight up extremists on the left and right. There are no candidate that supports any of them. Mentioning any of them is not NPOV as the candidates are not the cause of the violence nor were any in the proximity. Even mentioning more mainstream groups that were present such as NAACP or ADL or more recently BLM, would be UNDUE and cast them in a unsubstantiated negative light. None have advocated violence and oppose it. --DHeyward (talk) 09:51, 27 June 2016 (UTC)

BAMN on FBI terror list

The relevance between BAMN's FBI terror listing and BAMN's involvement in the Sacramento riot needs a reliable source. The subject of this article is not BAMN, it's the Sacramento riot. The BAMN article would be a more appropriate place than this article to talk about the FBI terror list. Any edit on this article that associates the FBI terror listing and the Sacramento riot would be original research if it's not supported by a source that specifically makes that association. A previous edit used INFOWARS as a source, but this was rejected as unreliable. Another source would be needed. KinkyLipids (talk) 00:43, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

The ACLU news release cited was from 2005, and also states the the FBI "acknowledges in the report that the Michigan State Police has information that BAMN has been peaceful in the past." The fact that the best anonymous polyester left out these key pieces of information dictates that he/she has an axe to grind. It also shows that there isn't much substance to this. Oh yeah, Infowars. Hilarious. Ground Zero | t 01:00, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Then we'll be needing to take out the references to the SPLC, and their views on the TWP, by the same reasoning. Klortho (talk) 02:46, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

The reference to the SPLC's views of the TWP was from a source that associated its views with the Sacramento riot. As I said, the FBI terror listing would be appropriate if there was a reliable source that associated the terror listing with the Sacramento riot. KinkyLipids (talk) 03:11, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Sorry, that doesn't even begin to make sense. The information is clearly relevant, regardless of whether or not the source connected the dots. And the source is reliable. Klortho (talk) 08:42, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

I had the same reaction as you when an editor first pointed me to WP:SYN after reverting one of my edits. It's seems like it should be fine to connect the obvious dots, but the policy says editors should leave the dot-connecting to the sources. I didn't write the policy, but I want it to be enforced equally. As I said, the FBI terror listing is already on the BAMN[REDACTED] article anyways, and it can be included here as well once a source other than INFOWARS connects the same dots that you and INFOWARS have connected. As to whether INFOWARS is reliable, I'll leave that question to you and Ground Zero to discuss. I was the one who found it and added it, but I don't know enough about INFOWARS to defend it. KinkyLipids (talk) 10:36, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

Also, I balanced the 'Participants' section by adding BAMN's involvement in violence and looting at BLM and Occupy protests. At this point, mentioning the FBI terror listing would only be icing on the cake, and in my opinion, icing causes diabetes. KinkyLipids (talk) 10:41, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

WP:SYN does not apply ... there was no synthesis. As it was written, it was just a statement about the nature of the group. The question of whether or not it belongs in the article is an editorial decision -- including it, or not, has nothing to do with "synthesis". Klortho (talk) 15:11, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

That said, I agree that it's dated material. Makes me wonder what they've been doing these past 11 years. Klortho (talk) 15:15, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

The FBI comments were misrepresented in the last edit, and we're made 11 years ago. The FBI does not appear to have made any further comments to that effect since 2005, so there is no evidence that the FBI continues to be concerned about BAMN. I have reverted this misleading edit. Yesterday, I revised the BAMN article to accurate reflect what the sources provided reported on what the FBI said. Readers can get accurate information there. Ground Zero | t 10:52, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

The "Aftermath" section / reason for the threats

@KinkyLipids: have you read this article re: what you added in the "Aftermath" section about Yvette Felarca - http://www.eastbaytimes.com/breaking-news/ci_30067746/fbi-investigates-threat-against-berkeley-school-after-teachers "The threats came after Yvette Felarca, a social studies teacher at Martin Luther King Jr. Middle School, was identified not only as a participant in the counterprotest of the rally, but one of the people who initiated the violence, pushing and shoving a man to the ground, according to videos of the incident posted online." and "In one video of the incident, a woman who appears to be Felarca is captured yelling at rally participants, then shoving and punching a male marcher. Other counterprotesters can then be seen pushing the protester and kicking him repeatedly." 208.44.84.138 (talk) 01:18, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

The 'Riot' section of the Misplaced Pages article already addresses Felarca's involvement in the group that initiated the violence, but I have added other information from this news article to the Misplaced Pages article. Thank you. KinkyLipids (talk) 03:05, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

"White Supremacism"

Our organization explicitly rejects the White Supremacist label, and categorically do not believe that Whites are superior to or should dominate other races. While there are "credible" sources which label us as such, the most "credible" sources, the ADL and SPLC, label our organization "White Nationalist." Deliberately relying on inferior sources for the "supremacist" label while holding the fact that BAMN is a registered terrorist organization to an inappropriately high burden of proof is clearly and systematically biased. Matt Parrott, Director, TradWorker Wikitopian (talk) 21:23, 29 June 2016 (UTC)

BAMN isn't a "registered terrorist organization". It just isn't. Your organization's self-description isn't at issue here. It is how others define you. Misplaced Pages is an encyclopedia, not a platform for organzations of any type to promote themselves. Ground Zero | t`