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Revision as of 15:33, 28 December 2012 view sourceDrmies (talk | contribs)Autopatrolled, Checkusers, Oversighters, Administrators407,710 edits →Aunt Hassie Fletcher← Previous edit Latest revision as of 01:49, 23 January 2025 view source Wburrow (talk | contribs)Extended confirmed users, Rollbackers9,739 editsm →Hayden Miller Productions/ActuallyHayden: linking to case I opened 
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==Mail==
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== Good work ==

...caretaking the news of the day. Agreed that such articles need to be locked down early. Congratulations to you and other responsible editors. Of the events, words do little justice. Just sadness. Have a good evening, ] (]) 01:38, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
*That's very kind of you, 99, and I appreciate it. Yes, words. Our president was most eloquent, especially in his silences. I told my oldest and she cried in the car; right now, though, they're peacefully watching ''Lorax'' under a blanket with bellies full of ramen noodles. Friday night is easy dinner night. Mrs. Drmies and I are drinking beers, also with very few words. All the best, ] (]) 01:48, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:*]. - ] (]) 01:53, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

== You have a message ==

From Cjr100B, on my talk page. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 02:46, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks Dennis. Hey, your talk page is more popular than mine. I may have to block you. ] (]) 03:06, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

:*Well, if you would quit deleting everyone's perfectly good articles, maybe more people would like you. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 17:19, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:::Hey Drmies, I came across the same thing you did recently while patroling the backlog at newpages. I posted on Dennis's talk page about it and he suggested batphoning you in as you know more about the situtation. So... you know... ring ring <font face="Verdana"><font color="Blue">]</font><font color="Green">]</font> <sup>(]•])</sup></font> 16:23, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

== Please unprotect ] for edit ==

Hi there, please reconsider the semiprotection. People making sourcing mistakes is not good enough a reason to semiprotect according to ]. It's not even a BLP. ] (]) 15:46, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:Actually, it is a multiple BLP. - ] (]) 15:56, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:Protection will expire in a few hours. How long the article will remain ''unprotected'' is an open question.--] (]) 16:02, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::10 minutes? I'm nipping to the bookies now. - ] (]) 16:05, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:::HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! That was very funny!!1!
:::Please operate within policy. Thanks. ] (]) 16:52, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::::We are operating within policy. Considering what I saw yesterday I agree completely with in(de)finite protection. If you think living people aren't involved, you're even less smart than I think you are. ] (]) 22:20, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::::I've boldly extended protection one week via ]. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 17:08, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::Common sense was recently banned by ArbCom.--] (]) 17:17, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::Only for their own use. We mere mortals are still free to use it. ;-) ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 17:56, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::Just a question, could you indef (not permanent) the protection? I don't want us to have to scramble with edits from IPs that aren't sourced and are speculation (Jewish perpetrator, the principal let him in and shot people herself, etc.), or edit conflicts from those edits and having good edits being erased by IPs copying to resolve an edit conflict. If any of that make sense. Thanks ]<span style="position:absolute"><sup>]</sup></span><sub>]</sub> 18:11, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::There's no such thing as indefinite or permanent page protection; it's called "infinite"; don't ask me why. In any event, it stays in place unless it's lifted - no meaningful distinction. I see no justification for it at this point.--] (]) 18:17, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::Indef semi-protection (which does show as infinite in some areas) is reserved only for articles that are proven targets for vandalism, and no passage of time will cure the issue. A good example of candidates articles include ] and ], which attract a lot of lolz and more vandalism than good edits. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 18:29, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thank you, all who responded to this request. ] (]) 22:20, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
**Been having lots of fun there, with one IP in particular. Articles like this bring out the worst in some, and bring in self appointed experts on Misplaced Pages, who are usually clueless. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 23:21, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
***Self-appointed experts? That would be me, then. Ha ha! More seriously, as per the thread on DB's page, we may need to sort out some guidelines for issues such as this. Yes, in theory, they are covered by policies and guidelines that already exist but maybe it is time to coalesce the things for this specific purpose? - ] (]) 01:15, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
****I get a kick out of IPs who link ] and preach to me about how I'm violating that policy. Then I link ] just so they can tell me that is is just an essay. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 01:23, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Oh, I can feel a neologism coming on: has no-one heard of "wikilawyering" before ''(sic)''? Keep doing what you are doing, guys. Dennis, yesterday (depends where you are) you applied ] and that one will do for me. But the generalities raised by this issue do need some sort of overarching community decision because they waste a phenomenal amount of time and cause a lot of potential legal problems etc. And if someone wants to delete the {{tl|Timeline}} template, which causes a huge amount of grief with Indian news stories, well, I likely wouldn't say no. - ] (])
See ]. See also ] for my experience with the London bombings. I've been WikiGnoming the talk page for several hours, fixing up edits by people who seemingly just hit "create new section" when they want to reply to things, or discuss something already being discussed. Tag! You're it. &#9786; ] (]) 01:50, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*I just had a request to unprotect on my talk page, same geolocation as this IP, Hong Kong. I get the feeling this will need to be protected for more than one week, however. The event is bad enough, we don't need more dramah to go with it. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 01:53, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*And there's some stuff outstanding at ]. The markup for the multicolumnar layout is there. People just need to sort out their tastes in colours, title, and headings. ] (]) 02:12, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
**Adjust to taste. ;) Your little green box now requires fewer characters to reach. ] (]) 02:51, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
Do you think an editor should be notified everytime their name is mentioned, regardless of how unimportant the mention is? If so, please see ]. If not, please delete this message before reading it. <small>]</small> 13:09, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*Hmm. Interesting question. Thanks for the update, though--I don't patrol those boards very well. Can I keep this message after having read it? ] (]) 17:30, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
:*Beware ]. ] (]) 18:15, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

=== The general case ===

I was thinking of throwing together a proposal for a generic editnotice to put up on any major in-progress news event; I feel like the "current event" ambox doesn't really cut it. My thinking is that, here, the vast majority of the problematic edits were indeed in good faith, but people weren't really thinking about the consequences - so create an editnotice for anything like this, that reminds people that the standards for sourcing are ''heightened'', not lowered, that ], and that verifiability and coherence is more important than reporting every latest detail. If you could get even 20% of people updating the article with the newest 50%-chance-of-being-false tidbit from CNN to stop and reconsider, it'd take quite a load off... which would be pretty helpful, considering the defamation risks in these areas - last I checked we were at 8 or 9 revdels and 2 Oversights. What do you guys think? I can draw up a sample, if people are interested in the idea.''' —&nbsp;<u><font color="#000000">]</font></u>'''<sup>(''<u><font color="#000000">]</font></u>'')</sup> 05:07, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Hey Francophonie, I meant to leave you a response two nights ago but the internet broke. In summary: I think that would be a great idea. Look, if you like, what I said to Masem on ANI in the Sandy Hook thread (the second, I think) to see if those strengths can be blended. Thanks. Oh, maybe you're interested in a link to an NPR story I dropped on the Sandy Hook talk page. ] (]) 16:07, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

== Email ==

Old man, you have an email. :-) ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 00:19, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*I don't think so--the mail lady comes by before 5 on a Saturday and it's already past 6. Are you sure? ] (]) 00:38, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

== Procedural question ==

If I speedy delete an article that has an ongoing AfD, is there something I'm supposed to do with the AfD?--] (]) 00:56, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*Just close it, noting what you've done. I think most admins don't apply "speedy" close to it, but I suppose it doesn't matter. Or you can drop the link and I'll close it for you, so there is a bit of oversight/consensus. ] (]) 01:17, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*What is it with all you deletionist admin? ;) Not sure oversight is that big of a deal here, since the close is just a procedural close, no real conflict. I usually close them, but I see a lot of NACs instead. Maybe some admin don't like closing after they speedy. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 01:20, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*See ]. ] (]) 01:40, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
**The only thing I do differently is I try to remember to add "by me", for disclosure. I don't think it is required, however. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 01:45, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
**Thanks Uncle. ] (]) 01:52, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks, everyone. The editor who tagged the article for speedy deletion closed the AfD for me. Nice of him.--] (]) 02:45, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

==DYK for Amina Mama==
{{tmbox
|style = notice
|small =
|image = ]
|text = On ], ''']''' was updated with a fact from the article ''''']''''', which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ''... that after twice fleeing civil unrest in Nigeria, ''']''' moved to South Africa, where she became director of the ''']''' and founding editor of its peer-reviewed journal, ''''']'''''?'' {{#if: |The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template:Did you know nominations/Amina Mama|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template talk:Did you know/Amina Mama|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].}} }} }} You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page <small>(], )</small> and it will be added to ] if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the ].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK --> ] (]) 08:03, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

==DYK for African Gender Institute==
{{tmbox
|style = notice
|small =
|image = ]
|text = On ], ''']''' was updated with a fact from the article ''''']''''', which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ''... that after twice fleeing civil unrest in Nigeria, ''']''' moved to South Africa, where she became director of the ''']''' and founding editor of its peer-reviewed journal, ''''']'''''?'' {{#if: |The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template:Did you know nominations/African Gender Institute|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template talk:Did you know/African Gender Institute|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].}} }} }} You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page <small>(], )</small> and it will be added to ] if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the ].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK --> ] (]) 08:04, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

==DYK for Feminist Africa==
{{tmbox
|style = notice
|small =
|image = ]
|text = On ], ''']''' was updated with a fact from the article ''''']''''', which you created or substantially expanded. The fact was ''... that after twice fleeing civil unrest in Nigeria, ''']''' moved to South Africa, where she became director of the ''']''' and founding editor of its peer-reviewed journal, ''''']'''''?'' {{#if: |The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template:Did you know nominations/Feminist Africa|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].|{{#ifexist:Template talk:Did you know/Feminist Africa|The nomination discussion and review may be seen at ].}} }} }} You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page <small>(], )</small> and it will be added to ] if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the ].
}}<!-- Template:UpdatedDYK --> ] (]) 08:04, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

== Grammar ==

I'm pretty sure that you watch the goings-on but in case you miss this one, I've mentioned you ] and, well, I'm lost in a miasma of grammatical correctness. Your thoughts would be appreciated. - ] (]) 00:22, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Ha, that's funny--this is like Ent's note in "Please unprotect Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting for edit"! I'm being mentioned on ANI 3.0? ] (]) 05:03, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Drmies cannot even get the grammar right in xyr own username, and you ask for this? &#9786; ] (]) 13:54, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
**Are you referring to my edit notice, Uncle G? What's wrong with "xyr"? ] (]) 14:58, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
***No, your username. I have, as you know, diligently kept the secret of your ungrammatical user name. Do you ''really'' want me to get M. White Background and M. Chapstick all overexcited? You ''know'' what they'll say. M. Chapstick will start asking whether you are real, and M. White Background will start weeping over some dead soap opera character. &#9786; ] (]) 15:25, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

== Your blanking of my edit ==

I made myself a promise some years ago, when I was a new editor and saw that an admin was guarding her fringe POV in ] and would never allow any compromise, that I would not engage in editing wars. So, rather than reposting the info and adding the Time Magazine link I was preparing I'll move away from the argument. There is nothing to talk about with people who have a social agenda. Regards. ] (]) 02:44, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks. ] (]) 02:48, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
==Time for your shift==
Bigh Whigh has been adequately warned about edit warring by me, fully explained on his talk page, but I get the feeling he doesn't get it. I've been sick all weekend but watching the article talk page closely. I gonna get some sleep, so it's your turn to babysit. Bring a stick. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 02:52, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Ha, I was just about to drop Masem a line. Sorry to hear you're sick. I just made a Rite-Aid run for Zantac, Benadryl, and Pepto-Bismal: everyone at my house is sick as well! Whigh's latest effort was not for the same thing so I don't have a good reason to block; I just hope it doesn't go any further. I'm wondering when it gets to be time to drop the hammer for full protection: it's Sunday night, and nothing real is happening--it's just reactions and hot air. I may place a note on AN proposing this; by now I've been so active that the POV warriors (see above) will have me before ArbCom by Monday morning if I lock it down. Hope you feel better soon, Dennis, and thanks again for your efforts. ] (]) 02:59, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
:*I already posted on Dennis's pagve. Thank you also for your efforts in the Sandy Hook article and talk pages. I appreciate seeing your oversight there. Well wishes all around, folks. <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 03:33, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
::*I'm checking out the backlog at RFPP. Honestly, I don't want to look at the article right now, but I will in a minute. I just blocked that edit-warrior, BTW. ] (]) 03:37, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
:::*I can breathe! Spend all weekend with a sinus issues that made it feel like someone stuffed a tennis ball inside my head. My nose is so raw from blowing, it feels like someone took a belt sander to it. I was doubling up on Benedryl, Sudafed, Flonaise, aspirin and kleenex but much better now. Hope the wife and kiddopoos are feeling better. The article has been a trying affair, I've stayed away from direct editing and just stuck with traffic patrol on the talk page. I figure there is no shortage of people wanting to tweak it, so that was the best use of my time. I appreciate the help as well. Just knowing there are admin there actively patrolling has surely helped keep some of the disruption tamped down. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 13:36, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
::::*And now I'm back in bed sick. :p ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 22:51, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

== A barnstar for you! == == A barnstar for you! ==


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|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Original Barnstar''' |style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Original Barnstar'''
|- |-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | I was snooping around your user page and wanted to commend you for your work on ]. Writing about George Washington or Helen Keller is all well and good, but it's articles like yours that keep me perpetually in love with Misplaced Pages. -- ] (]) 03:00, 17 December 2012 (UTC) |style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Happy New Year, Drmies! In 2024, other editors thanked you using the ] on the English Misplaced Pages. This made you the '''#11 most thanked Wikipedian in 2024'''. Congratulations and, well, ''thank you'' for all that you do for Misplaced Pages. Here's to 2025! ] (]) 19:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
|} |}
*Khazar, that is very kind of you--but let me give credit where credit's due and point you to Malleus Fatuorum, who is responsible for most of the work on that article, including everything that's correct about it. Still, I appreciate it! ] (]) 03:04, 17 December 2012 (UTC) *Haha thanks, {{U|Mz7}}--and I just hit you with a +2! ] (]) 15:28, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
::They've got one headed their way as well, then. Enjoy your evening, Dr... -- ] (]) 03:20, 17 December 2012 (UTC) *{{U|Bbb23}}, happy new year, and how is it that you are thanked more than me??? I thought I was the good cop! ] (]) 15:29, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
:::You're no slouch either, Khazar. I just read ]. Have you met my pal Crisco 1492? I'm sure you have--he and I have done a few Indonesian and Dutch-Indies articles together. Happy days, ] (]) 03:25, 17 December 2012 (UTC) **It's a conspiratorial ploy by the perps to cozy up to the bad cop.--] (]) 16:04, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
::::Yep, Crisco actually co-wrote that one with me. One of my favorite Misplaced Pages collaborators--always kind, always skilled. -- ] (]) 03:27, 17 December 2012 (UTC) ***Shoot I just thanked ] for an edit, and she was already ahead of me. ] (]) 17:54, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
{{User QAIbox

| image = Ehrenbach icicles.jpg

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== ] ==
| bold = ] · ] · ]

It appears that this page has not been locked after all, and user , despite numerous warnings, continues to vandalize this page. Why can't his vandalizing be controlled?

] (]) 03:54, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Simple. I accidentally applied semi-protection, not full protection. That's rectified now, with my apologies. But that their edits are vandalism is not immediately obvious to me so I'm not going to block them: you all are having a content dispute and you should hammer out a consensus on the talk page of what the article should say. After that an editor can be warned and possibly blocked for disruption (edits against consensus)--but ] is quite strict on the topic. Also, if you have suspicions of socking, start an ] so that can be looked into. Thank you, ] (])

Thanks- IF you read the talk pages for some of these sock puppets, esp. , you will see recent warnings of suspension.
Changing a caption from the subject's given, legal name to "dilletante" is not really a content dispute- it's outright vandalism.
*I didn't see that one--thanks. That's reason enough for a block. Now, I still think you should get something going on the talk page if only for future reference: if there is socking, and if there are personal and business interests, it won't go away and future admins will have something on the talk page to fall back on. Now, I looked at Kimocarew and blocked it as a sock: the best thing for you to do is to start an SPI, even though this one is already blocked, and ask for a CU (Checkuser) so there is evidence for future investigations. ] (]) 04:13, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

It appears you may have blocked user kimocaraw for sock-puppetry. If you re-examine his post, you will see that another editor added text within his text box. The context of the final edit shows conflict within the text. I have nothing more to add on these pages. thank you.
] (]) 20:34, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

==Ahem...==
A-, a-. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 03:56, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
:I have updated the SPI with the further information. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 04:03, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
*Reverted, and warned for edit-warring. Report them to AIV next time if I'm not on call, and a block will be on the way. That's one way to tackle this...I saw the SPI was still not acted on, last time I looked. Patience, grasshopper! Thanks Homer, ] (]) 04:05, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
**Have we gone a full set of warnings with this guy? Some admins are sticklers for doing a full set before any blocks are issued. SPIs are very slow, I know. Sometimes too slow for my liking. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 04:07, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
***Sorry, but sometimes I'm a bit of a stickler, yes. But I don't believe in 1-2-3-4. Does that help? Don't worry, next time they're blocked. And if that other one returns, no matter where the SPI is at, they'll be blocked too. Domino theory, dear Homer. ] (]) 04:15, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
****If you think we have issued all the warnings we can, then that's good enough for me. :) - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 04:17, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
*****Well, that's the nice thing about the edit-warring notice: a revert after that is blockworthy. Wow, Tom Brady is fantastic, and I don't even like the Pats. ] (]) 04:39, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
******Now 38-31 San Francisco. I watched the Steelers game and they handed that thing to Dallas. Pittsburgh had a chance in the 4th to kick a field goal from their 39 to make it 27-24 and give them the win. They didn't! They punted back to Dallas! Dallas held them off, got into OT, intercepted, got within field goal range, kicked the field goal, Dallas won, score 27-24. Dammit! Pittsburgh got cocky and wanted a TD, it bit them in the ass. Steelers suck this year. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 04:51, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>

== ] ==

I've noted your comments, but the problem seems to be that IPs and, now, newly registered users - seemingly linked to the Exaro site or at least with non-public knowledge of the investigation - are repeatedly adding unsourced or very poorly sourced information, to an article about an ongoing police investigation which could potentially have significant political repercussions. The legal implications of WP repeatedly adding such allegations need to be addressed in the light of the McAlpine affair, and I would have thought that some form of page protection was the best solution. ] (]) 11:19, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
:Thanks for your comments. Hopefully, more editors will take an interest in the article and help keep it on track. ] (]) 15:41, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
::We can always revisit. I don't ''mind'' protecting the article, but I'm always hoping that a different course of action can solve a problem--protection often just postpones it. Drop me a line if this flares up again. Thanks, ] (]) 01:57, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== A question of sources ==
I have been lurking at ] and its associated talk page and have a dumb question. I would rather appear dumb to you than appear dumb to the thousands of editors at those pages, so here goes: as a Misplaced Pages editor I am curious to learn why the Connecticut Department of Emergency Services and Public Protection (DESPP) has not been used in the article for fact reporting. Specifically, their press releases on this incident, which can be . I am particularly intrigued because during this incident, there has been proven misreporting by some of the sources currently still used in the article (CNN, Fox News and Huffington Post for example) --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 12:26, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*<small>Here's the citation for you. ] (]) 12:58, 17 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
**{{cite press release|ref=harv|publisher=State of Connecticut Department of Emergency Services &amp; Public Protection|date=2012-12-16|title=Newtown School Shooting investigation continues|url=http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?Q=515570&A=4226}}
*While Drmies and friends are processing this conundrum, Senra, you could get your Local Historian bush telegraph out and try to find one of your colleagues who deals in places that aren't ''quite'' right next door to you, to see about the {{On AFD|Thomond deeds}}. ] (]) 14:39, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
** Looking ... --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 15:31, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
** ] --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 15:48, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*Interesting question, Senra, and believe me, both at face value and in relation to some other comments on the talk page this is not a dumb question. Let me preface an answer with a disclaimer: I have been concerned with the various additions made to the article and their sourcing--I haven't been writing, just editing, and while I'm aware of some of the details that turned out to be utterly erroneous you likely know more, in detail, than I do.<p>I can give you a philosophical answer: in general we use secondary sources, not primary ones, so mistakes in reporting may seep into the article, yes. Personally, I don't think I would have a problem with citing reports such as the one you linked--I think you can make a case on the talk page that such reports ("According to the Connecticut State Police,...") are acceptable. Now, the reminder there that social media may not be used to harass people, I'm not sure if that could find a way into the article: we all know what it means, most likely--people ''have'' been harassed, but that's not a conclusion that we could write up. (I'm not saying you'd want to consider that; I'm sure you know better than I do what is and what isn't acceptable.) There may be a practical answer as well--editors just haven't looked at it; I'm sure those communications don't have the highest ranking among Google results...<p>The way to go about it is probably to identify one or more problematic statements in the article (I'm almost afraid to see what happened between 11 PM last night, when my internet connection gave up, and now) and bring them up on the talk page with the relevant links to the correct information. I hope you will engage this on the talk page: it needs cool heads, experienced Misplaced Pages editors. Thanks, ] (]) 15:08, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
** I am aware that primary sources are discouraged but not, I believe banned; especially were facts are concerned. Perhaps I should not have been afraid to raise this issue on the talk page. Still, you have answered my initial query, so thank you. <small>I think that Uncle G jumped in here, in good faith, and may have partly destroyed my thesis by linking to only one DESPP press release when, in fact, I was talking more generally about all DESPP press releases on this incident&mdash;three at the time of writing. I have taken the liberty of re-factoring Uncle G's citation to make it clear that it was not part of my initial question</small> --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 15:31, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
***Oh, I think ] provides every opportunity to use these sources in this case. It's always a matter of editorial judgment--one exception (though I can't find a link to any policy or guideline) is that such documents as court transcripts are strongly discouraged. Someone can set me straight if I'm wrong, or point to the relevant guideline. Again, in this case, please go for it. I mean, it's easy to argue that one problem with primary sources, "They offer an insider's view of an event," is actually a strong point here: there can be no reporter who misunderstood. There was a clear case of inappropriate use of primary sources, currently at ] (quick, before it's archived) where our primary source policy was used to remove the material for all the right reasons, but this is obviously a different case. After all, ] cites heavily from '']''. ] (]) 15:54, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

== ] ==

Following ] and ], I don't suppose you'd be interested in making it a hat-trick of "articles expanded lots of by Uncle G and friends to make an AfD collapse" and early close this? --] ] ] 14:29, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*I refuse to accept any sort of blame for that article whatsoever. I was never there, and you never saw me. ] (]) 14:35, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
**Only because somebody else got to the sources first. We felt you were certainly there in spirit. --] ] ] 14:40, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
***I do like a good gerbil story. In this case, the earlier version is not a completely different article from the current one, though it is radically improved, so I'm hesitant to close this per SNOW, for instance, and it's way too early to close it normally. What I'd do is ask the nominator to have another look at the article, even invite them to help improve. There's a DYK in it, methinks. is charming but unfortunately unacceptable; I haven't been able to find more. Of course, I do not have Uncle G's talents. ] (]) 15:14, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
****Don't you go mentioning ], now. M. Chapstick and M. White Background are all quiet and calm. ] (]) 15:42, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*****You know, Uncle, I can't find your first mention of this mysterious error of mine. I do vaguely remember it, and I remember it going completely over my head--it's not that your incomprehensibly cryptic, but you do sometimes remind me of Borges, and combined with those Harvard references I reach brain overload quite easily. Moreover, you make me stray, since I'm now reading on Power and Society in the Lordship of Ireland 1272-1377 when I was already doing three other things. ] (]) 16:00, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
******You're lucky. I've only just ''today'' cleared the backlog of sources that I had to check through for ]. ] (]) 16:16, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
***As you can see, Ritchie333, I have to endure the blame throwing of Aymatth2 and Drmies, who both think that it is exceedingly funny to get some some robot to come and post on my talk page asking me whether I know things. Fortunately, I now have the <code>&#123;&#123;]&#125;&#125;</code> template for combatting this, used to great effect at ]. {{On AFD|Thorsø, Norway}} required the abilities of an editor who could read Adûnaic. ] (]) 15:42, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
****Which reminds me: I need to put that Frisian book up at DYK. The Fifteen Signs ought to be a huge FA. In the meantime I'm trying to work on ]: I may need some more mescal. ] (]) 16:25, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*****One of the sources that I read mentioned that there was a flurry of scholarly interest in the '']'' in the 19th century, and cited a whole bunch of sources as examples. I agree that factoring in the French and German traditions would probably make the article a lot more substantial. ] (]) 23:15, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

== I guess it's me... ==

Hi, Could you perhaps have a quick look at the discussion at ] when you have a moment to see whether I really have gone totally bollocks? Thanks! --] (]) 15:34, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

== Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting ==

With this page we are moving previously used references to the bottom of the reference section and hiding them in a HTML comment section so that if they are reused we dont have to dig through 100's of revisions looking for the reference content. Thanks, ] (]) 17:26, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*I think I know what we're doing with this article. But if anyone restores deleted content, they should probably add that reference themselves. An article from the NY Post isn't worth saving anyway, nor is a Russian press release. Thank you, ] (]) 17:30, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Hi. You recently removed a picture of a rifle from the article and said to see the edit summary of ''North8000''. I looked at that edit summary and no factual sources were presented. I've started a section on the talk page regarding the picture. ] (]) 18:18, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*I don't know what you mean with "no factual sources were presented". The edit summary presented an argument, one which sounded acceptable to me. I saw the talk page entry; thanks for starting that. ] (]) 18:25, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
== What's in a name? ==
Since you mentioned Borges and confusion, I think that it has finally reached the time that we had a small walled garden of substub encyclopaedia articles.
{{divbox|brown||
===]===
:''An editor has suggested that this be merged into ] (])''
'''White Background''' has been a ] ever since {{gender:Bgwhite|he|she|xe}} was a child. After watching a genericized trademark on television, {{gender:Bgwhite|he|she|xe}} has, ever since, conscientiously vacuumed ], with {{gender:Bgwhite|his|her|xyr}} hands over {{gender:Bgwhite|his|her|xyr}} eyes. ], {{gender:Bgwhite|he|she|xe}} introduces {{gender:Bgwhite|hisself|herself|xyrself}} with a small white calling card which has a big blob of old chewing gum in the centre, and in the corner of which can be found the mysterious symbols <tt>]</tt>. Of course, as you are well aware, this is but a pale imitation of a pale imitation.
:] ''This article is a substub; you can help Misplaced Pages.''
}} }}
:::* As explained on my talk, I hope I do more real thank-you than lazy click-thanks ;) - Happy new year 2025, opened with ] that first sounded OTD in 1725 (as the Main page has). --] (]) 18:01, 1 January 2025 (UTC)
{{divbox|brown||
:::* ], my ] 300 years after the first performance, is up for GAN. ] will be my story tomorrow. --] (]) 21:09, 6 January 2025 (UTC)
===]===
:::* My ] is about a composer who influenced music history also by writing. Did you watch Masilo talk and dance? --] (]) 09:54, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
:''An editor has suggested that this be merged into ] (])''
:::* ... and today, ], ], in memory of her first appearance on stage OTD in 1900, and of principal author ]. --] (]) 18:56, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
'''Chapstick''' has lurked on the shelves of airport duty-free shops in Canada, the United States, Australia, Mongolia, and other places ]. {{gender:Kelapstick|He|She|Xe}} has written several unused Misplaced Pages essays, including ''Evils of lip gloss'', ''More evils of lip gloss'', and ''Do you have shares in Revlon, or something?''. After ], {{gender:Kelapstick|he|she|xe}} became a fan of ''Dr Glue'', a children's television show starring Tim Allen about a supply teacher in Art who dashes from school to school in a ] that is even smaller on the inside than it looks from the outside, and is so obsessed with the show that {{gender:Kelapstick|he|she|xe}} is thinking of changing {{gender:Kelapstick|his|her|xyr}} name to ].
:::* Today, between many who just died, ] on his 45th birthday who was good for ] mentioning a Verdi opera in 2018, - you can see his work in the trailer of another one that I saw, and my talk page has a third (but by a different director). 2025 pics, finally. --] (]) 18:43, 17 January 2025 (UTC)
:] ''This article is a substub; you can help Misplaced Pages.''
:::* Today I have ] (trumpeter, conductor) on the main page who worked closely with ] who became GA yesterday, - small world! To celebrate: mostly flowers pics from vacation ;) --] (]) 20:01, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
}}
{{divbox|brown||
{{divbox|red||This page was ] by Drmies, with the rationale: ''Oooh! Twinkle! What does this button do?'' Deletion was challenged at the last minute, however, and now you have to use AFD. Ha-ha!}}
===]===
:''An editor has suggested that this be moved to ] as a primary topic (])''
The grammatically incorrect '''Drmies''' can be found fighting, episode after episode, against ]s, ], ], ], and ]. As of 2012, {{gender:Drmies|he|she|xe}} will close discussions citing the likelihood of ]. Although M. Chapstick and M. White Background have tried to out Drmies in the past, only one person managed to work out the jealously guarded secret of {{gender:Drmies|his|her|xyr}} name.
====Family and species background====
Drmies is an ] from outside of ]. He is a remnant of what was once a vast empire, that largely fell as a result of the ]. So advanced was the civilization, that its citizens had long evolved beyond the need for consonants. Indeed, much of its writing needs only ]. However, as a result of this linguistic advance much of it is unpronounceable by the human vocal apparatus. The nearest that a human being can come to speaking Drmies' name, for example, is when an automobile runs over a Frenchman's foot.


== Advice needed ==
Drmies ] and ], in episode if not chronological order.
====Name====
Drmies' pseudonym is, of course, a grammatical mistake that is obvious in hindsight. Any ] knows that it should be ] ]. Even whilst trying so hard to hide it, subconsciously Dr mi estas is, by making a grammatical error for people to catch, giving a clue to {{gender:Drmies|his|her|xyr}} real name &mdash; a name that will be spoken, according to prophecy, ], just before ]. If the answer is "I am.", then the question is, even on this very page, hiding in plain sight.
:] ''This article is a substub; you help Misplaced Pages by giving the Doctor a crash course in Esperanto.''
}}
] (]) 18:41, 17 December 2012 (UTC)
*{{like|num=6}}
**This Hoovian applauds the above post. I also remind everybody that the Dr. Who special is coming up on Christmas day. A new companion is to be reveled, of course she will pale in comparison to my beloved Amy. ] (]) 09:30, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
***i have no idea where this came from. But I like it. Currently on time off, so perusing the Misplaced Pages tends to be via mobile Device (iPhone today), so I don't always "catch" everything. . We have a Marathon on Christmas Day BG, oceans of Pond. --]<sup>(]) </sup> 12:45, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*{{diff|User talk:Drmies|528652920|528652871|One person didn't like it}}. ] (]) 22:58, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
**Meh, I liked it. Much better than reading ] at least.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 23:19, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
***So you're done with Lacan and Heidegger? I recently had a brief engagement at ]. Crisco, when you're done with all your reading you might be smarter than my uncle. ] (]) 23:34, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
****Yeah, ended up analysing '']'' with Lacan. How well I did is another story. M... oh well.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 23:40, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*I now have just five days to rescue this. ] (]) 10:08, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


How can I convince user:Sky258 that, per ], airport connections need independent sources? Nearly all his/her are unsourced and reverted. Warnings did not help but blocking seems over the top. Do you have any ideas? <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 17:46, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
==Talkback==
*Hmm I disagree: they were warned by multiple editors, and the content is unsourced. I was going to ask about talk page consensus, but there is project-wide consensus... ] (]) 22:59, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
{{talkback|Malik Shabazz|Equal opportunity offender/idiot|ts=03:27, 18 December 2012 (UTC)}}
**Okay. <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 23:33, 3 January 2025 (UTC)
***Unfortunately, the learning curve after the prior block is best described as flatliner... <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 02:17, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
****Hmm Banner I jumped on that too quickly: it was not a complete flatline, and I left the editor a note, which one might call a final warning. ] (]) 16:25, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
*****I disagree: and . <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 18:52, 18 January 2025 (UTC)


== CS1 error on ] ==
== breast cancer awareness ==
] Hello, I'm ]. I have '''automatically detected''' that ] performed by you, on the page ], may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:
* A ] error. References show this error when they do not have a title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. ( | )
Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a ], you can .
Thanks, <!-- User:Qwerfjkl (bot)/inform -->] (]) 23:15, 8 January 2025 (UTC)
== CS1 error on ] ==
] Hello, I'm ]. I have '''automatically detected''' that ] performed by you, on the page ], may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:
* A ] error. References show this error when one of the URL-containing parameters cannot be paired with an associated title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. ( | )
Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a ], you can .
Thanks, <!-- User:Qwerfjkl (bot)/inform -->] (]) 23:16, 8 January 2025 (UTC)


== ]/] ==
Thanks for taking a look at ]. I agree with you both about the fundamental POV issues and also about the toxicity of the talk page conversations. I'm hoping that the article will improve with the involvement of experienced outside editors. ] (]) 06:17, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*Well, it saddens me to see two editors who obviously know their stuff get at each other in such an unproductive manner. It's an odd situation, since I am quite sympathetic to the POV of the most blatant POV warrior and convinced of the (in my opinion misdirected) good faith and MO of the other party. I am not the one to improve the article by addition, though; it seems to me that you know more than I will ever learn. I am also hoping, indeed, for experienced outside editors--if nothing changes, an AN thread may bring attention to it. This has been going on for far too long. Thanks for your note, ] (]) 14:51, 18 December 2012 (UTC)


Returned to ] AGAIN, with that nonsensical ref about a BENFICA match for a SPORTING championship win (reverted it on the spot)! I guess the rest can stay (should you see that the sources are appropriate, if not remove it), will duly compose it (i.e. Style of play section) when i get home.
==]==
In case you miss it blended with the other traffic, perhaps this is an essay you would be well suited to create. ] and all that, but there appears to be a void. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 15:37, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*Maybe. I'm hoping Masem will come up with something. Ed has me writing already. ;) ] (]) 16:05, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
**Glad to see that link has turned blue. Hoping to see it expand into some good guidance on where to draw the line as it applies to BLP and WP:N in general. I did notice Drmies has been slacking off and has yet to pontificate there... ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 15:34, 20 December 2012 (UTC)


Attentively ] (]) 19:44, 9 January 2025 (UTC)
== Jay Westervelt article name ==


== Books & Bytes – Issue 66 ==
Just a curtesy FYI as you're the protecting admin: I've submitted a page move request at ] (a technical move, as I don't believe it's controversial as it's not part of the content dispute, and is supported by the article text and by all the sources attached to the article). The proposed move is: {{la|Jay Westervelt}} → {{la|Jay Westerveld}}. I would move it myself, but I am involved in the content dispute over the career label, so do not want to use my admin abilities to move the article through the page protection. --- ] <small>(] • ])</small> - 17:49, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*Done. Those Dutchies and their silly last names. ;) ] (]) 18:15, 18 December 2012 (UTC)


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== FYA ==
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]</div>
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<span style="font-size: 2em; font-family: Copperplate, 'Copperplate Gothic Light', serif">'''The Misplaced Pages Library''': ''Books & Bytes''</span><br />
For your amusement
Issue 66, November – December 2024

-->Re : --] (]) 22:52, 18 December 2012 (UTC)
*Well done. Next thing you know I get bacon delivered to my house. Seriously, playing nice is a good way to get things done: I should try it more often. ] (]) 01:48, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== Can someone else sane look at this please? ==

] and the relatively slow - and very lame - edit war on the article - between two established users who should probably have an interaction ban. Thanks, <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 23:18, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

==Talkback==
{{talkback|WP:RFPP|English_personal_pronouns_.28edit.7Ctalk.7Chistory.7Clinks.7Cwatch.7Clogs.29|ts=23:49, 18 December 2012 (UTC)}}
]<sup>] - ]</sup> 23:49, 18 December 2012 (UTC)

== Natalie Hammond ==

Hi Drmies. After yesterday on the Sandy Hook talk page, someone changed Hammond's title from vice principal/lead teacher to vice principal/teacher, and removed two of the three sources. And the cite that remains even verifies she is vice principal and lead teacher. Can you restore the content? Thanks. --] (]) 01:36, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*Do me a favor and find me the edit? I hope it's just one. ] (]) 01:44, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

::Sorry, I should have given that to you originally. Actually, this involved edits by multiple editors. First, an editor added a 4th cite (which is overkill, I think). Then is where 3 of the 4 cites were removed. Then removed the word "lead" from lead teacher. Even shows her title was lead teacher. Hope this helps and sorry for any inconvenience. However you decide to handle this is totally fine with me. I know you have a lot more important things to handle. --] (]) 02:13, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::The biggest problem is that the page loads so slowly, so getting all these diffs is a bit of a hassle, but I'm on it. Thanks, ] (]) 02:21, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

{{talkback|David Levy|Minor detail}} —] 02:51, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== RE: December 2012 ==

Hello, Drmies. Nice to meet you. Sorry for my very bad english. But, the user ] I'm sure he edited from before with an IP (; I'm sure he is, just have to go with a ]). The problem is that he endeavors to remove references equally reliable and, edit arbitrarily, for example: or . And in "Thalía" he removes all without consensus or, as I say, . With your account, he does the . What I can do?, I do not know English very well But please, could you help me?. I just want to do a job in ]. Best regards, ] (]) 05:29, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*Well, then you shouldn't have been edit-warring. Rest assured, I saw the IP edits, and Zz2zz is blocked like you are. When your block expires you can discuss it on the talk page with them, like adults. Thank you. ] (]) 05:32, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== Harryzilber ==

Thanks Drmies, and good choice on the block length. It is probably just enough time for the user to step back and re-evaluate.&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 05:41, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*Sure thing. I wonder how a long-time editor makes such an error, and I figured a short block would be sufficient to stop the disruption and get the point across. I hope I'm right. Thanks for keeping an eye open--ha, it was your edit summary on Recent changes that caught my eye, so good work with the prose. ] (]) 05:51, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::Recent changes? You're keeping it old school. I think I used recent changes once or twice in my first month and then found lupin's tool and never used recent changes again. I use newbie recent changes sometimes.&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 06:01, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::It's like Adrock said, "in the next millennium I'll still be old school". Haha, lupin's tool? Never heard of it! ] (]) 06:07, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::::] I use it when I don't have access to Huggle. It filters the recent changes for likely vandalism.&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 06:11, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::I am now worried it was too short. He doesn't understand why he was blocked, and while he has no stated intention to continue restoring the information, his comments imply that he doesn't understand that further restoration of the material would violate policy.&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 06:23, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== Sandy Hook archives ==

Someone renamed them without my realsing and now I can't seem to move them back.--] (]) 06:18, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
There are redirects on the others so it must be because I have been copy pasting the titles without seeing that they were named wrong. I will redirect the new archive.--] (]) 06:21, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*I wish you hadn't left that to a Luddite like me: I managed to screw up the reversion of that process. Geek alert--I posted a note on the talk page. The right one, I hope. Who goes around renaming ''archived'' talk pages? ] (]) 15:29, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**A bot. ]'s bot, to be specific. I'll take a look. ] ]] 15:34, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**Okay, that should do it. What happened was that Tvoz had moved the page on the 15th, which was quickly reverted. Three days later, TAPbot came in, thinking the page was still moved, and completed the "move" by moving the archives to where they should have been, had Tvoz's move stuck. I'll drop TAP a line; sounds like some sort of bug. ] ]] 15:44, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
***A user was involved as well. The screw-up is mine, though--copying and pasting those names (to get the capitalization correct) I put a 3 instead of a 4, or the other way around. I'm not looking anymore: please have a little bird tap on my window to say that everything is fixed. Thanks. (after ec: did you check to see if 3 is 3 and 4 is 4? The one starts with the Bushmaster, so the other shouldn't.) ] (]) 15:47, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
****Actually, I think they both start with Bushmaster; apparently it's a hot topic. I made me moves by comparing timestamps, though, so we should be good; double-checking is welcome as always. ] ]] 15:56, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Oh, I'm afraid to (and I apologize for the non sequitur in the preceding comment, nicely undercut by the popularity argument). Thanks Writ Keeper. Someone should make you admin one of these days. ] (]) 15:58, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

'''*''' <-- That's a tiny barnstar for Drmies for making me laugh on that talk page. :) ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 20:42, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::I read all of the above....and then my head exploded. I kept thinking the easiest way to deal with it was destroy it all and sort it back out afterwards. LOL! Thanks to Writ...no archives were harmed in the making of this thread. LOL! I support the tiny barnstar. Put me in a good mood suddenly. <sub>It probably won't last though</sub>.--] (]) 21:20, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::I was in a good mood until I saw a bunch of white men on TV purchasing AR-15s; gun sales are spiking especially on such weapons. Ha, we should probably put that in the Sandy Hook article. Funny--people who probably don't have a nail to scratch their ass with (as the Dutch might say) shelling out $1000 for a weapon for which there is no legitimate (I'm speaking morally) use. ] (]) 21:23, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== Thank you -- about ] ==

Thank you for all your help in dealing with User:MikeFromCanmore. ] (]) 07:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*He's emailed me, I haven't gotten around to reading it. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 12:21, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**Well, now that I just confirmed my email, I'm sure that he'll be emailing me. I say bring it on. ] (]) 15:12, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
***Oh, yeah, that one. Sure thing--it led to collaborative editing and article improvement. Maybe . ] (]) 15:16, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
****Blocked another one of his socks today; fun times for all to be had. ] ]] 15:19, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Thanks Writ Keeper; I appreciate you staying on top of that. ] (]) 05:16, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Gibraltarian devilry ==
* {{On AFD|Devil's Tower Road}}
* ]
You've nominated something for deletion by proxy. Also note the copying and pasting from tourist brochures that I've pointed out to Prioryman. ] (]) 13:35, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*I would have thought that Priory man should stay away from Gibraltar (he's one of the reviewers on DTR) given how many Gibraltar DYKs are praised on his talk page. ] (]) 18:00, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**I haven't paid any attention to the whole Gibraltarpedia fiasco, so I don't know who has the conflicts of interest and who does not. I notified Prioryman simply because xe was apparently doing the DYK reviews and looking for copyright problems. ] (]) 11:16, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
Apparently, your application of the BLP policy to roads is faulty. ] (]) 03:47, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

I've tried to explain what you meant, but it would be better coming from you. ] (]) 11:11, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

==Manufactured consent==
"you may do so, in a calm and non-accusatory manner" - "if you want to persist living in dreamland"

Aren't these two statements of yours contradictory?

My complaint is that debate is being stifled. What is wrong with that? Why aren't you allowing a debate to happen? --] (]) 14:42, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*No they are not contradictory. We are not a debate society or a forum where your proposition, , can be discussed. You may ''suspect'' that winter has something to do with it, but that's best uttered on Facebook or so--it has no place in an encyclopedia, not even on a talk page (OR, fringe science, etc.) That discussion, for anyone who is interested, is at ]. Whether claims and statements pertaining to that claim of yours were to be included in the article was indeed discussed in that section on the talk page and the consensus was clear: no. Thank you. ] (]) 15:13, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

::Saying that I live in Dreamland is an accusation. It means you are accusing me of being some kind of fantasist. My main interest, in fact, is in the lack of an international outlook in that article. This has become a global news story, with global responses. If you looked at my edits on the actual page, you'd see that I'd put '''nothing''' about winter on it. I mentioned it on the talk page, in passing, but didn't put it on the page. It is a discussion page. That's what it's there for.

::I am sceptical of your definition of "consensus". So called consensus on Misplaced Pages appears to have a different definition from the real world. Especially when the one side of the debate is censored and stymied, and not counted in the vote.

::By the way, I don't use Facebook, and never intend to. I consider it to be trivial junk. It also sells people's personal information, which is inexcusable.-] (]) 16:24, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Blocking discussion notice ==

Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at ] regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.<!--Template:AN-notice--> ] (]) 18:03, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*Ha, now I'm . Anyone who knows me knows that that's really a personal attack. ] (]) 18:43, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**We knew that you are a ] fan. But a National Retail Association supporter as well? ] (]) 19:01, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
***Not MTA, Uncle--]. ] (]) 19:03, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:*I'm a card carrying member, but I would have removed the material just the same if it had been the other way around. POV material is POV and inserting it without discussion is ridiculous.&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 19:04, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::*You are? Hmm. Next thing you know Dennis Brown is one too. After all, he likes cars and bacon. ] (]) 19:06, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::*He had the FFL, not normally a license held by those opposed to guns. It's pretty hard to oppose guns after you've had a chance to do some target shooting with my ].&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 19:12, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::::*I beg to differ, but let's agree to disagree--. ] (]) 19:15, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::*An agreement that's easy to make. There's no reason everyone has to like what I like or think what I think (except when it comes to . Everyone has to like Hardy's BBQ).&nbsp;]&nbsp;] 19:23, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::*. ] (]) 21:16, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::*I never belonged to NRA and neutral about it, but I used to sell a lot of guns and gold. I let my conceal to carry expire since selling the pawnshop, something I should rectify. Most people wouldn't have guessed this because I don't wear my politics on my sleeve or allow it to enter my work here. We are building a neutral encyclopedia, so it shouldn't matter. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 22:43, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::*Someone signed me up as an NRA member some years back. I got all sorts of mail from some really '''''interesting''''' organizations after that, until it stopped. I never found out who did it, or why it stopped. I think I still have the card somewhere, probably with my NYCLU card. ] (]) 22:50, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::*Yeah, I never had an interest in all the "interesting organizations", never wanted to be involved in the politics of it all. People hear you had an FFL and usually assume you read Soldier of Fortune and all that. I find those guys just as nutty as you likely do. But it takes all kinds. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 22:58, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::::*OK, allow me closing remarks on "my" talk page. You all use "political" in a way-too limited sense, typical of Americans (sorry). You mean it as it relates to your party or to Washington. That's too narrow. "Political" involves any kind of ideology. If I buy free-range eggs (I don't because I can't afford them) I am committing a political act. If I don't buy free-range eggs I am also committing a political act. The company that's selling its interest in those weapons of mass murder, whatever their motives are, they are making a political statement.<p>If you go out as a private citizen and buy a gun you do not do so in a value-free environment. First of all, ''you'' (US citizens here) do so in a country that has long supported the private ownership of guns, and has extended those rights in recent history, some might argue to a ridiculous extent. When you do buy a gun, then, you affirm that you believe in that right--or, if you say no one has that right, but you buy your gun anyway because others buy guns and you need to protect yourself from them, you still affirm the basic right to ownership, pragmatically if not theoretically. Ergo, if you buy a gun, if you consider buying a gun, if you decide not to buy a gun, you are making a political statement one way or the other.<p>If you buy a gun, the gun makers make a profit, you support their industry--and they in turn can influence politics in the way you were using "political". If you buy a gun, you say to yourself and to others (and possibly to ], if you believe in such an entity) that you have a moral right to it, that you are responsible, that you can handle it, that your kids will NEVER have access to it, that you won't do crazy shit with it, that you will make sure it won't get stolen by a criminal (which is what happens to a lot of guns, and you know it)--all those are political statements also since they take place in an environment where none of those things are value-free.<p>You know I respect you all as Misplaced Pages editors and chances are I love you like a brother, but when you say "I don't get into the politics of it" you're fooling yourself. I'm not going to chastise you for it, but you're fooling yourself. Every gun that's bought supports the industry, the gun lobby, the NRA, the general sentiment that guns (at least some kinds of guns) are OK to be handled by private citizens. That's fine--you just need to be aware that you can't be unaware of that. Every gun that's bought without FBI background check (40% of all sales go without check) adds, possibly, to the amount of poorly monitored guns and gun owners floating in the country and out of it, to the south, into Mexico. All these are political acts, yes, in the broad sense of the word.<p>You can say "I'm not interested in the politics of it", but that just tells me that, usually, someone is unwilling to think through the larger ramifications of their private act. Don't think you can buy or own a gun and it have no consequences. Even if that gun is buried deep underground, it's still loaded with ideology, with market values, with politics. I don't care if you believe what some say the second amendment says (personally, I don't care very much about what some white guys centuries ago came up with), I'm a realist--but don't say that "politics" has nothing to do with it, because it has everything to do with. The Soldier of Fortune is easily laughed at, but Mr. Lanza didn't get his guns from a soldier of fortune; he got them from his mommy (a fine, tax-paying citizen), who got them legally from a gun dealer (a fine, tax-paying citizen), who got them legally from a gun manufacturer--who provides a fine boost to our economy with an impact of almost , thanks to Prez. Obama (by proxy). So, of course it's political. Christ, I'm sounding like Christ here, crying in the desert. You think Christ would have advocated gun ownership? A bumper sticker sure to get me my car keyed down here. </soapbox> Now, where were we? ] (]) 23:44, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

== Just saw your note on my archive... ==

...when Miszabot came by to do her chores. I'm flattered it took you only six months to see it, shows how you've stopped visiting my TP after Miss Silverstone was banished. I'm still sort of around, just not active anymore. It's just way too much nonsense to deal with, all the way from the standard POV pushing in India articles to sometimes having to deal with rather strange interpretations of policy etc. I'm also glad that you've finally come out of the closet and identified yourself as an NRA member. And apparently I'm now back just in time to pop some corn in the microwave and watch the arbcom case page. Jeez! &mdash;]''']''' 19:17, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*I'll shoot you right out of outer space, Spiffy, if you keep this up. I for one miss having you around. I ''could'' say I understand your concerns about Misplaced Pages, but I have yet to see people being falsely accused of (NRA) advocacy, POV editing, personal interest, admin abuse, censorship, waging vendettas, and commafucking, so I reeeaaalllllllly have no idea what you're on about. But I do miss you. Did you see ] is on the front page? TTYL, ] (]) 21:02, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
**
***Writ Keeper, instead of yanking my chain (a clear example of battleground mentality), why don't you bow down in front of SpacemanSpiff, a true master and a free spirit, and ask him to stay? Man, we should all get together for beers. What's Saturday like for you all? ] (]) 21:14, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
****Snowy. ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 21:22, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
*****I'll go for a pint of warm beer, it's rather cold here. I love the tits, btw. &mdash;]''']''' 08:02, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Merry Christmas ==

<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:red; background-color:fff; border-width:2px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">]


] <small>(] • ])</small> is wishing you a ] ]! This greeting (and season) promotes ] and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a ], whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Happy New Year! <br />

<i>Spread the cheer by adding {{tls|Xmas2}} to their talk page with a friendly message.</i>
</div> </div>
<div style="margin-top: 1.5em; border: 3px solid #ae8c55; border-radius: .5em; padding: 1em 1.5em; font-size: 1.2em;">
*Well, thanks, but my Christmas cheer is a bit dampened by the fall-out of your . ] (]) 18:53, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
* Les Jours and East View Press join the library

* Tech tip: Newspapers.com
== The M-word ==
<big>''']'''</big>

Nice op-ed (and I agree thoroughly). <!--<sarcasm>-->But I found a cute ass for my write-up.<!--</sarcasm>-->&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 23:01, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
:{{like|username=The ed17}}
::Crisco, what's with the language? What if some innocent passer-by sees it, and doesn't know what you're referring to? Hell, I don't even know what you're referring to! BTW, those are nice tits I have, aren't they. ] (]) 02:26, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::*Two of the best.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 06:32, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:::*All you need now is some of Ernst Blofeld's ]. But, some of his penises are too huge to be concealed weapons, so they are probably not allowed here. ] (]) 08:04, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::::*] is more than enough.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 08:48, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Assistance please ==

Who is our best Reliable Sources expert on Misplaced Pages? I need to gain a better understanding on using some particular sources quickly.--] (]) 01:45, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Well, it depends. What kind of source? ] (]) 01:47, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*School publications, handbooks etc. (here's a dollar).--] (]) 01:50, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**That's ... difficult. As in, a school yearbook? ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 01:51, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
***Yeah, probably no, but this is to be judged individually, probably. ] (]) 01:55, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
***These publications to cite facts to the alumni page. Would these be acceptable as primary sources without problems or issues?--] (]) 01:53, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
****I would say, generally speaking, that the facts you can reliably cite from that are of the directory type--name of principal, address, number of AP classes. So it's limited. I wouldn't cite alumni BLP info from it, no. ] (]) 01:57, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*****We just got a question at the ] regarding this type of sources. I wasn't quite sure there either. ] ]] 01:58, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== ] ==

Well done. ] <small>(])</small> 02:28, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Yes, nicely done. <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 02:44, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Excellent article actually. I am also a little surprised by the numbers of page views you stated in it. That is staggering.--] (]) 03:01, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
{| style="border: 1px solid gray; background-color: #fdffe7;"
|rowspan="2" valign="middle" | {{#ifeq:alt|alt|]|]}}
|rowspan="2" |
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" | '''The Writer's Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 1px solid gray;" | For your Sandy Hook Signpost article. Excellence is so common with you it makes me sick. LOL! ] (]) 03:05, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
|}
*Whoa, they ran it already? I hope they proofread it a bit... ] (]) 03:08, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**We're a newspaper, dear Doctor; we have to be timely, or we won't run it at all! Yes, much proofing was done by ]. :-) ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 05:36, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

==Hollisz==
Yeah, . I reverted per your previous revert "edit-warring, previously warned by admins". Time for a block. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 03:15, 20 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
:Personally, I would go indef, as the user has made no attempts to communicate with other users/admin, doesn't seem to be listening to warnings, doesn't appear to be here to edit constructively. I would also recommend temporary indef-protection (until after the holidays) for ], ] and ]. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 03:17, 20 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
::Posted to as well, which is currently backlogged. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 03:24, 20 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
*OK, I blocked them for 31 hours--which is pretty usual for a first-time edit-warring block. No, you won't get your protection, sorry. But I did look at the ], and with an editor blocked we may see what happens. If the other editor comes back, we know, and DQ will have something exciting to look at. If an IP comes back, we know (and I will protect). ] (]) 03:31, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**Understandable, eliminate the problem, no need for protection. I will keep an eye on the articles and let you know if I see the other account or IP pop up. Wouldn't surprise me if they didn't since the guy knows he has eyes on him...but stranger things have happened (this ''is'' Misplaced Pages after all). - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 04:12, 20 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
***You do wonder about these people. They're editing against consensus, they know it, they know they're being watched and talked about (hey Hollis, how you doing?), and they don't say anything, just create a new article. ] (]) 04:16, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
****Yup and think that we aren't going to connect the dots between the two accounts and the IP. Numerous editors do this over and over and it gets laughable after awhile. Same thing, same act, just a different person and a different set of accounts. It ''does'' make you wonder. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 05:17, 20 December 2012 (UTC)</small>

==Peter Lanza==
That article is hard to revise at the moment due to edit conflicts, but the father's name is worth including in article space, though his employer is not relevant. We include the father's name in one of the refs, and it helps clarify that Adam Peter Lanza and Peter Lanza are different people. I am sure we will also be hearing more from the guy about his involvement with his son (or lack thereof) in the time leading up to the murders. ] (]) 03:52, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Please see ]. Time will tell--for now the consensus is that the name is out. Thanks, ] (]) 03:55, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::A discussion closed after 2.5 hours doesn't seem to be based on consensus, but on the decision of the few editors who weighed in during that brief window. I'd like to see a more thorough discussion, as we are having with the ] redirect. ] (]) 03:59, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:::You're welcome to begin the discussion anew, but in the meantime the name won't be allowed in the main body of the article. I'm looking at the redirect; I didn't know there was an issue. Thanks, ] (]) 04:05, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::::Well....there went my good mood. I knew it wouldn't last. And I thought the thing would keep me smiling for a while.--] (]) 04:46, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
Somehow, Wtmitchell accidentally reverted the father's name back into the article when he was trying to ungroup a reference. I left him a note , although for some reason when you look at his talk page, the text of my comment doesn't show up. Regards, ] (]) 04:35, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:He fixed it, and he fixed a missing ref bracket on his talk page such that comments show up now. All good... ] (]) 05:14, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::I saw, thanks, and in the meantime I corrected the "correction" of an "error". Thanks, ] (]) 05:15, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:::You should look at ] while you're at it, if the goal is to suppress his name in the article where he's mentioned and quoted. ] (]) 12:34, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Can you pre-protect the soon to be created 'end of the world' page? ==

As you have experience it protecting breaking news stories, could you pre-protect the soon to be created 'end of the world' page? When the world ends on Friday, I don't want to be reverting some IP's BLP violation while dodging brimestone, bombs, earthquakes or whatever happens. Hmmm, maybe it will be like the Dr. Who episode, ], where everybody will be turned into Bieber or Honey Boo Boo. Eh, my world ended when I got married, so I'll enjoy the end of my suffering. ] (]) 09:44, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*{{like}}. I'll probably end up as ] or ].&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 09:48, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:*] ] (]) 10:05, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::*It'll end up prosline-style
:::#12:00 UTC Nothing happened
:::#12:01 the first signs of trouble, a rumbling in the earth
:::#12:03 rumblings grew more intense, earthquakes recorded around the world
:::#:...
:::#5:00 New York and London are reportedly destroyed by aliens
:::#5:01 Paris's destruction also reported
:::#5:02 A terrorist cell rereleases Drmies nude pictures
:::#5:03 ] goes rampant, shutting down most of the internet
:::#:...
:::#12:03 ] rises from the grave, chases literature students who read the Misplaced Pages article on ]
:::#12:04 ] begins protecting old women with his baseball bat
:::#:... (Bonds eaten by zombies sometime around 12:15 p.m.)
:::#17:51 tsunami wipes out ], ], and ]
:::#17:55 waters recede, ]'s palace revealed. All persons in green shirts are abducted
:::#:...
:::#00:00 ] captures the last living human while singing "]"
::::Terrifying.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 10:13, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Would that be {{On AFD|21st December, 2012}}, {{On AFD|21/12; Doomsday (film)}}, or {{On AFD|December 21, 2003}}? And, M. White Background and M. Cripes It's 1942, you should know what the ] are. They've been known for over a millennium, which in Misplaced Pages time equates to ]. &#9786; ] (]) 10:52, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**], ]...&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 10:59, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*All I know is, I quit my day job and now busy maxing out all my credit cards and having unprotected sex with as many strangers as possible. I would hate to see the end of the world with all my bills paid up. Seriously, anyone who isn't doing that can't say they really believe it will be the end of the world. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 11:08, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**] is the place for you. ] (]) 11:27, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**Good point, Dennis--I'm already stockpiling dogs so I won't have to die alone. The rest of my family will be watching it, each on their own iDevice. ] (]) 14:43, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
***Be sure to download a copy of . And check out the weather forecast while you listen. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 15:39, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
****Ha! Twenty-five years later, I finally know what the hell he was singing. ''Document'' is one of my favorite albums ever. Thanks for reminding me. A (n older) friend of mine asked me last year about my top-ten of albums ever, and I didn't get farther than '']''. He told me to add '']'', which I did after listening to it a couple hundred times. I can't rightly decide between ''Document'' and '']''; I suppose one by REM is enough. '']'' is on the list as well, and you have my permission to fire a warning shot in the air in case of protest. ] (]) 16:16, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*****'']'', '']'' and '']'' have to be somewhere on that list if we are looking at ''complete albums''. I would also add '']''. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 16:26, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
******Well, for me, '']'' is more than just an incredible album; listening to it is a religious sacrament. Strange, in all of my time here I don't think I've ever mentioned The Beatles before, and now I've gone and done it twice . ]&nbsp;<span style="color:blue">•</span>&nbsp;] 20:05, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Standing a drink ==

Wait, what?? Are you saying that'' "standing someone a drink" ''is a Britishism?? Gosh. I honestly had no clue - I just thought it was general-use English! Holy moley, one learns something every day. I'm going to have to go and waste time looking it up now ... Cheers! ] (]) 15:13, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Oh, totally--few Americans would know what you're on about (and they don't say "what you're on about" either). Well, it seems my ] access is unavailable, so I can't be proven wrong right now. "Standing a drink"--I imagine a bunch of gruff, bearded Brits standing at a counter drinking big pints and muttering incomprehensibly about the weather and the government. I'd love to join. ] (]) 15:55, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
**Ha! Well you learn something every day - or at any rate ''I ''do, on a good day. Thank you. I am neither tough nor bearded but will be delighted to stand you a pint on your next visit to London. Cheers! ] (]) 16:21, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
***Hehe I can't wait. I've only spent time in London once, on a bus layover, and man was it impressive. I'll give you a call, or a buzz, or a ring, or whatever. Thanks! And when you get on the wrong bus and end up in Warehouse City, tell MF I said "toodles". ] (]) 16:25, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
****Actually "standing a drink" used to be reasonably common in the U.S., especially in the West ("I'll stand the house" crops up in older Westerns...the print not screen kind). This is prior to about 1920, though. <slinks away after cutting loose with historical trivia> ]] 18:34, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*****My OED access works. Earliest recorded use is Dickens, ''Sketches by Boz'', 1836, when the usage was new enough for him to put the verb in quotes: "Mr. Augustus Cooper..‘stood’ considerable quantities of spirits and water." ] (]) 20:00, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== Request to delete user account ==

I reverted the blanking of ]'s page by ]. I then got an email from Lowczarek: ''Please delete the wiki Lis4930 as it was only used for instructional purposes, and the course it was used for has ended. Thank you.'' I replied on Lowczarek's page, why I could not / and suggested that Lis4930 blank it. A reply on Lowczarek's page by an IP was ''I created the Lis4930 account with no e-mail and cannot retrieve the password. Please delete the page as previously requested and as mentioned in the first line of the wiki (the course has ended, the students want that information down)''. Any suggestions? Willing to help? Best ] (]) 20:09, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:I don't see any harm in it, and I don't imagine this is a malicious sockpuppet, so I blanked the page. ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 20:20, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::I put some info on the various talk pages involved here, but I'm curious about what was meant by "as mentioned in the first line of the wiki". I'm pretty sure nothing here would have promised that the account could be deleted, so is the reference to a course-related wiki? In that case, the instructor (perhaps Lowczarek?) should be made aware that such a promise cannot be kept. ] (]) 20:33, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:::"The first line of this wiki" was a message at the top of ] when it was set up, which read: <blockquote>"Hello, This wiki is for the class LIS 4930 at the University of South Florida. This page has been set up for students in the course to learn how to use and edit a wiki. At the end of this course, this page will be deleted."
</blockquote>
:::I added a note to Lowczarek that he should have pointed out to his students the "irrevocable release" message below every edit screen, and also pointed him to ].

:::Then I looked at the pre-blanking versions of ]. That's a terrible "course". The shows entries from seven students, not one of whom has anything on their talk page, or edits to anything but this single page. They were just using WP as a scratch-pad to practise editing. Still, at least they weren't doing any actual harm, unlike Sandy Georgia's favourite Psych101 classes. ] (]) 21:31, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::::I didn't realize that "Lis" was part of a course identifier, I thought it was part of a person's name. So... it was a ] in the first place. I wonder if it would be worthwhile to set up an edit filter to try to catch stuff like that before it happens, so that we can get the instructors the information they need (but don't know they need) about editing Misplaced Pages? ] (]) 21:39, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*We're walking a fine line between inviting new editors and inviting trouble. Someone at some point got it into their heads to let a bunch of students loose on ], and no one knew what the f*** they were doing. That's damage. A filter would be great, but I don't see how that could be filtered out. There's still a case on Dennis Brown's talk page--that I suppose I should have a look at. ] (]) 22:55, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
::*I was thinking of the filter more as a way to alert our education people that a course using Misplaced Pages was being set up, so they could step in and help out, if necessary. Since there would be no actual "filtering" per se, false positives wouldn't be much of a problem. ] (]) 23:04, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:*John, you were absolutely right--just a notepad. I was going to leave welcome messages and stuff, but it's from months ago and they won't be back. Those instructors should use BlackBoard--their institution is paying out the ass for it anyway, might as well use it. ] (]) 22:58, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
*Don't we have some kind of Ambassador for these college issues? If not, it is likely overdue as this is starting to get more and more common. And problematic. We want to greet, help, and direct these people in the right direction, as to be actually helpful here and not an accidental burden. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 23:56, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
:*I seem to recall that Drmies is such an ambassador himself... ''n'est-ce pas, Docteur''?''' —&nbsp;<u><font color="#000000">]</font></u>'''<sup>(''<u><font color="#000000">]</font></u>'')</sup> 00:10, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::*Oh there are ambassadors; I'm also one. However if the instructors (or even students) don't make themselves known to us; it's a little hard to help them. Just creating a user page for a class isn't enough to get the attention in the right places. To be fair, they may not know, but it seems incumbent upon a university instructor to learn how to use the tools and collaborate with the people upon whom he/she is unleashing students. <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 02:49, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::*It may be yet another consequence of being "The encyclopedia anyone can edit," a slogan we ought to retire. ] (]) 02:59, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::*The encyclopedia any loser can edit?&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 03:13, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::*And the encyclopedia some winners can't edit either. I wonder if Malleus will be back; I haven't stopped thinking about it. ] (]) 06:33, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::*I believe that the word encyclopedia is being misused. &mdash;]''']''' 06:44, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::*Says the spaceman who used the phrase "moving forward". The only thing worse than that is "Having said that, ...." Crisco, please send me your doctoral thesis before you hand it in so I can make sure you don't abuse this beautiful language in that way. For Spiff it's probably too late. ] (]) 06:53, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::*I take cover under the guise of ] -- anything the Yanks, Brits, etc. can't understand or don't like is allowed here. I'd slap {{tlx|Indian English}} on this page, but Sitush would come after me with an ]. &mdash;]''']''' 06:58, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::*Hey now. Yanks? Them's fighting words. Spiff, you must have gotten stood up for the night, or your local jam band is even more boring than you had feared. As for Sitush, he'll have to gather his toes before he comes running after anyone. Remember, his brother got the bike. ] (]) 07:12, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::::*My doctoral thesis? Geez, that's a little far off. Haven't even finished my master's yet. I think Spaceman Spiff is upset because he doesn't have to ]&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 07:44, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::::*No ark for me Crisco, ] with another 4.2bn years to go before destruction :) &mdash;]''']''' 13:45, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::::::*Interesting, thanks for the link (never heard of that before). Check out mine; the "ark" was a secular reference.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 13:52, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::::::::*Oh, as an atheist, any reference I make to religion is secular IMO -- my belief in them is the same as my belief in your link, sorry if it came out as suggesting anything more than a preference or a need for a transport system. &mdash;]''']''' 16:54, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
*{{od}} Gotcha. So Drmies, why didn't I get a seat on whatever bacon-blimp you used to escape the FSM?&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 23:46, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== For the Drmies juniors ==

has kept my nieces/nephews etc amused in recent years. And driven me barmy as it whips up their expectations. Enjoy, with my best wishes. - ] (]) 21:54, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

== A beer for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Here's wishing you happy holidays and a successful Wiki New Year! ] (]) 23:28, 20 December 2012 (UTC)
|}
*Ha Kudpung! Thanks! I was just thinking about you the other day, and about how GWU should have had a bar in every venue. Imagine how much more fun we could have had. Hey, feel like dropping by this spring? I'm teaching History of the English Language; maybe you can do a little spiel on something exotic. All the best, ] (]) 00:08, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== A cup of coffee for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
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|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Thanks for your timely op-ed in the Signpost. <font style="white-space:nowrap;text-shadow:#008C3A 0.1em 0.1em 1.5em,#01796F -0.1em -0.1em 1.5em;color:#000000">]]</font> 08:59, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
|}
*I appreciate that. I didn't plan it as an op-ed, but I suppose the editors had no choice since I can't keep my mouth shut very well. ;) ] (]) 15:01, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== User:Varlaam ==

Sorry to bother you, but you have been ] with this editor before. Thanks to your warning he stopped attempting the change that article. However more recently he made the same change to another article - in this case a list. He must have know it was controversial but engaged in an edit war while making no comments on the talk page. This included , and started with . The editor concerned has an outstanding track record of article creation and work by the way, as a simple check by Varlaam would have revealed.

As in previous incidents Varlaam ignored the talk page until this morning. involves him calling the other editor a "punk" and a "parasite" as well as exhibiting ownership issues. Now all of that said, this is an editor who is putting a lot of work into many articles, but seems incapable of interacting with other editors. If thwarted s/he lashes out. The speaks for itself. Is it possible to have a word? I half thought about taking it to ANI but that history an indef would have probably been the result and we would have lost someone who is making valuable contributions.

If you don't want to take it up fair enough! ----] <small><sup>]</sup></small> 10:08, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

PS: Another revert (up to four now) with the same vandalism accusation
*I'll have a look. Thanks, and thanks for including the relevant links. ] (]) 14:57, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
*See ]. ] (]) 16:04, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

===Thank you!===
I know you've opened a discussion of this block at AN, but I wanted to take a moment to thank you for finally doing something about Varlaam. Having been the object of his ire in the past, to the degree he once likened me to Joseph Mengele because I removed one of his pet bits of trivia from an article, I have long believed that Varlaam's copious editing has allowed him to skate by with this kind of abusive battleground behavior far too long. I have also long questioned the quality of many of his edits and his obsession with numbers of edits versus content. I'm glad to see an admin finally stand up to him and draw the critical line in the sand. Behavior like his and a coterie of others (and we all know who the president of the club is) must stop if this community is to survive. --] (]) 16:17, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
*Drmargi, I'm not aware of a coterie. I mean, I am aware of some coteries, but not of one related to Varlaam. Is that what you meant? Please enlighten me if you like me to look into something (as long as it's not related to K-pop--not during the holiday season). ] (]) 16:58, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:: Sorry, I wasn't very clear. I was just referring to that small group of editors who seem to be able to teflon out of abiding by the same civility expectations as the rest of us. You know the ones -- they're at ANI over and over again. It's nothing you need to do, just me being pleased one has been indeff'd and blowing off a bit of steam at the same time. --] (]) 19:58, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== A thought for Sitush ==

Please keep Sitush in mind today; he's in hospital for a procedure. I don't know if he wants to handle best wishes on his talk page since that might flood his little smartphone, but I'll gladly accept flowers on his behalf. Hope all goes well, Sitush. ] (]) 15:00, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:To avoid overwhelming his talk page, I'll stand him a pint here. Best wishes, Sitush. &mdash;]''']''' 16:57, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::All good wishes Sitush's way. Rapid healing! <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 19:14, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::I sent him an email earlier today, short, thus suitable for a smart phone. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 22:38, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::*Best of luck, Sitush!&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 23:47, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== A barnstar for you! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Original Barnstar'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | For your continued good work to enforce policy and maintain order. ] (]) 16:39, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
|}

== Jay Westerveld (again) ==

Thanks for stepping in over there. Hopefully, with the request at ], the article will get the attention it needs to clean it up. I had never heard of him before I saw the post on a user talk page (now archived at ]), and I had done some initial cleanup of the most egregious unsourced promotional content, but then got bogged down in the career naming nonsense. At this point, I'm feeling a bit burned out on a subject I have no strong connection about, so am thinking of just taking it off my watch list for a while and focusing on areas I can be more productive. Thanks again for your involvement over there - and good luck! --- ] <small>(] • ])</small> - 19:41, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:Update: just saw you comment at ANI. I had viewed myself as involved, as I had done several of the reverts in the profession area. But, given your ANI comments, I may keep the page on my watch-list to still keep an eye on developments and to act if additional BLP or NPA issues develop. --- ] <small>(] • ])</small> - 20:04, 21 December 2012 (UTC)

== The Coral Island/GA1 ==

{{tb|Talk:The Coral Island/GA1}}
:The entire review needed to be transcluded to Drmies's talk page rather than just pointing him back to the discussion? <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 20:56, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::Sorry, supposed to be a talkback but I typed the wrong thing.<span style="color:#3A3A3A;background-color:#FFFFFF">'''Grandiose''' </span><span style="color:gray;background-color:#FFFFFF">(], ], ]) </span> 21:22, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::Now corrected by the nominator, to whom I also managed to transclude the review... sigh. <span style="color:#3A3A3A;background-color:#FFFFFF">'''Grandiose''' </span><span style="color:gray;background-color:#FFFFFF">(], ], ]) </span> 21:23, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
:::Hah, ok. ;-) <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 21:27, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
::::Lady, thank you for looking after me. Grandiose, the issue was a license and it's taken care of? Good, I'm glad. Lady, I bought a digital recorder--you should hear Sippy sing and then sing along with herself. Also, while she sings (all improvised and full of cliches) she does interpretive dance...it's quite charming (unless you're tired from cooking and cleaning). I'm watching her now. ] (]) 01:22, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
::::Now Rosie is in on the action--"'Up in the Sky' and it's a new one! It's now available!" ] (]) 01:24, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::The cuteness that is little girls. I'm so looking forward to seeing the nieces. <span style="font-family: Lucida Calligraphy">]<span style="color: #22aaaa">of</span>]</span> 05:32, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

== Season's Greetings! ==

]

Happy children join me in extending the best possible Season's Greetings to you and your loved ones at this time of year, and if you don't celebrate the usual holidays (], ], ], ], ], etc....), then we will still wish you a ]. All the best: ] (]) 20:59, 21 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks Harry, I appreciate that. The same to you and your loved ones. We'll settle for Christmas here and the kids will bargain for whatever will get them more presents. ] (]) 01:17, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

== Thanks ==

Thanks for your support during my "block". As for my Survivor habit, well... we all have our guilt pleasures. =) -- ] (]) 04:27, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*Rock on, Dodo. I'll keep mine to myself; people might start respecting me if they knew what I watch. Thanks for dropping by! ] (]) 04:28, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
== Nun's Well that starts badly ==
] was unmitigated drivel for six years. I'm not convinced that it is properly a primary topic, either. An equal weight disambiguation seems the best. I am more persuaded of this having found ''Nun's Well, Brigham'', a poem by ] that doesn't seem to rate much literary analysis by itself, but which is discussed in the context of an aspect of Wordsworth that we don't appear to have. That would make for an equal weight disambiguation between ], ], Wordsworth's friendship with geologists (when it is written), and the other Nun's Wells that there are. If you turn the English Professor Vacuum up to a higher setting, maybe one of those English professors being sucked in by it will remedy this gap in our coverage of literature and Wordsworth.<p>And maybe Senra might be persuaded to deal with the St Nun's Well in ], U.K. (after the saint variously named ], ], or ]) which is listed at {{harvnb|Hope|1893|pp=17&ndash;19}}, the St Nun's Well in ] (also called ]) U.K. (after ]) that is at {{harvnb|Hope|1893|p=19&ndash;20}}, and the Nun's Well at ] (also called ]) that is in ] {{harv|Hope|1893|p=165}}.<p>I found all of this as fallout from the Gibraltarian devilry. I'm dropping it off here for much the same reasons that I dropped off ] elsewhere. I have work on ] on my to-do list.
* {{cite news|ref=harv|title=A lapidary lyricist|date=1996-08-30|newspaper=]|first=Stephen|last=Moorbath|url=http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/story.asp?storyCode=162252&sectioncode=22}}
* {{cite book|ref=harv|title=Wordsworth and the Geologists|volume=16|series=Cambridge Studies in Romanticism|first=John|last=Wyatt|publisher=Cambridge University Press|year=1995|isbn=9780521472593}}
* {{cite book|ref=harv|title=Romantic Rocks Aesthetic Geology|first=Noah|last=Heringman|publisher=Cornell University Press|year=2011|isbn=9780801457517}}
* {{cite encyclopaedia|ref=harv|article=Nunit (Nynnina)|pages=20 et seq.|encyclopedia=The Saints of Cornwall|first=Nicholas|last=Orme|publisher=Oxford University Press|year=2000|isbn=9780198207658}}
* {{cite book|ref=have|title=Legendary Lore of the Holy Wells of England Including Rivers, Lakes, Fountains and Springs|year=1893|first=Robert Charles|last=Hope|edition=reprinted by Kessinger Publishing, 2003|isbn=9780766167162|location=London|publisher=Elliot Stock}}
] (]) 12:08, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*Sshh! we keep it raw on the set. ] (]) 13:16, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
**After ], I could not resist ]. ] (]) 14:10, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
***Nice. Mrs. Drmies doesn't have to go to work, so my WP time will be limited over the next days and weeks. I'm having to be social, which also involves cooking and cleaning and taking care of her visiting mother. I love the holidays. ] (]) 14:54, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
***Also, I can't log in to my library--very irritating--so I can't look at JSTOR etc. Are you sure it's ] and not ]? The latter is venerated widely in Wales, and Staffordshire is (according to Misplaced Pages so, you know) in the neighborhood. ] (]) 15:03, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
****I just wikilinked ] without worrying too much about it, sure in the knowledge that Senra would be on the case. And what do you know? &#9786; Checking, it does appear to be ], yes. Welcome to the world of those of us who have no JSTORrery, Tex-Mex Lexus, or Main Beaming.<p>Black Kite ], by the way.<p>] (]) 15:55, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*****For those of us who live in a country with a history prior to 1776, er specifically the UK, a local library card may give you access to {{cite book|last=Farmer|first=David Hugh|title=The Oxford Dictionary of Saints|edition=5 (Online)|date=2011|publisher=]|isbn=9780199596607}} which may be useful in this context. For example "'''Non''': mother of David of Wales. Almost all that is known of her comes from Life of David. According to this source (11th century), she was a nun at Ty Gwyn, near Whitesand Bay (Dyfed), who was seduced by a prince called Sant: David was their son" --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 16:44, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Oh my oh my. ]s ] nuns. ] (2004&ndash;12) says "Rhigyfarch's narrative begins thirty years before David's conception with the prophecy of his birth by an angel to his father, Sant, king of Ceredigion (''fl''. 6th cent.), and to St Patrick. The angel warned Patrick against settling at St David's (here given the Latin name ''Vallis Rosina''), while Sant received a dream in which symbols of David's virtues appeared. Thirty years later he was sent by divine power to Dyfed, where he raped a beautiful nun, '''Non''' (''fl''. 6th cent.); as the mother of St David she became known as Non Fendigaid (Non the Blessed). Miracles attended the pregnancy, and David was born during a thunderstorm, supposedly on the cliffs near St David's" --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 17:30, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*(ec) Well, well, well! I am not sure that Hope is to be trusted. He confuses ] with ]&mdash;Hope even misspells it ''Ellely''. For those who do not know the area, Eltisley and Ely are over 25&nbsp;miles apart. In under the heading of {{Smallcaps|Ely: Pandonia's Well}}, Hope quotes Leland as saying
**"At Ellely was sumtyme a nunnery, where Pandonia, the Scottish virgin, was buried, and there is a well of her name yn the south side of quire".
*Leland (Vol.&nbsp;'''1''', p.&nbsp;1) actually says
**"At '']'' was ſumtyme a Nunnery wher ''Pandonia'' the ''Scottiſh'' Virgine was buried. and there is a Well of her name yn the South ſide of the Quire".
*Hope also says on page&nbsp;5 that "St. Audry's Well is situated southward of Cratendon about a mile from the city of Ely"! Well I never! If there is/was a document locating ]'s Well about a mile ''South'' of ] we would perhaps be able to locate Cratendune.
** {{cite book|last=Leland|first=John|title=The Itinerary of John Leland the Antiquary: Publish'd from the Original MS. in the Bodleian Library, Volumes 1-3"|date=1768|url=http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=gk8GAAAAQAAJ}}
*I accept the above dismissal of Hope is a little parochial but for me, those two errors call into question the rest of his treatise.
*--<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 15:07, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
**I ''knew'' that you'd know these from holes in the ground. &#9786; For what it's worth, there ''is'' other stuff written about the Nun's Wells in Pelynt, Altarnun, and Sedgwick Castle (such as {{plainlink|1=http://www.megalithic.co.uk/article.php?sid=10458|2=this}}). There isn't just Hope to rely upon. If you look at {{harvnb|Orme|2000}}, for example, you'll see a lot more about Pelynt, chapel and well. I didn't check, or mention, the Nun's Well at ], also described by Hope {{harv|Hope|1893|p=164}}. ] (]) 15:55, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
*]. ] (]) 16:27, 22 December 2012 (UTC)
** &hellip; and, as you can see, ] goes onto this disambiguation. &#9786; ] (]) 18:29, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

== Nadolig hapus ==

</div> </div>
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:red; background-color:lightgreen; border-width:1px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">]
]
]<sup>]</sup> wishes you and yours<br/>
<br>
'''"Nadolig Llawen a Blwyddyn Newydd Dda"'''<br /><br>
----
May the true spirit of Christmas bless you with warmth and peace ....
{{clear}}
</div> </div>
<small>Sent by ] on behalf of The Misplaced Pages Library team --17:32, 10 January 2025 (UTC)</small>
<!-- Message sent by User:Samwalton9 (WMF)@metawiki using the list at https://meta.wikimedia.org/search/?title=The_Wikipedia_Library/Newsletter/Recipients&oldid=28051347 -->


== Banned cease-and-desist photographer ==
== Holiday cheer ==


I am really frazzled now. Someone is . I can not find any trace of that. You should expect some traces of that on ENWP, Meta or Commons, but no.
{| style="border: 3px solid red; background-color: #FFFAF0;"
|rowspan="2" valign="middle" | ]
|rowspan="2" |
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 0; vertical-align: middle; height: 1.1em;" |'''Holiday Cheer'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; border-top: 2px solid blue;" |''']''' '']'' is wishing you Season's Greetings! This message celebrates the holiday season, promotes ], and hopefully makes your day a little better. Spread the seasonal good cheer by wishing another user a ] and a ], whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Share the good feelings.
|}


Do you (or your stalkers) know anything about this? It sounds a bit fishy to me right now. <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 14:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
== ] ==
*No clue. I'll add to your note. Thanks, ] (]) 16:10, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
**Thanks, seeing the edits of this account, the editor did this wiki-wide. <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 16:50, 13 January 2025 (UTC)


:(stalker comment) I don't really have anything conclusive to add, but from what I see, the user who uploaded the images is not banned or even warned from either enwiki or Commons. He appears to be a professional photographer who uploads many of his images to commons, and then Misplaced Pages, replacing lower-quality existing ones if necessary (I guess there is a small chance its all a big copyright misuse but you'd have thought that would have been picked up upon, particularly as his work involves famous buildings and peopel so probably gets a lot of views). You can see on his talk page there is a message from an IP user in 2019 (who stopped editing in the same year) regarding 'excessive use of own images'. I'm unsure if any such rule actually exists, but in my opinion it was not applicable anyway as the use of the images improved the site, were not self-promotional in terms of including watermarks or anything to overtly identify the contributor, and was not excessive proliferation of photos within individual articles. The reverting user has only made 92 edits, half of which were reverting the photographer today. Not sure why they would even take this course of action, expect perhaps they noticed an image (one of their own?) replaced by the photographer editor, read their talk page, decided the 2019 message was something official and unilaterally decided it justified reverting all recent additions (in the same style as the 2019 user, which is suspicious too). ] (]) 17:45, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
Since you seem to have done a wonderful job with another recent problem, how about devoting some admin electrons to this? cheers. &mdash;]''']''' 05:21, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:], thank you for doing some of that leg work--I had looked at various things but managed to miss that IP comment. And that IP comment: well, "excessive" use is a thing frowned upon but you laid out the (common sense) practices pretty neatly; thank you for that as well. ] (]) 18:08, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
*Don't torture poor Drmies with prose that will make xyr fingers twitch! Even in Indian English, the pronoun "her" needs an antecedent, in the singular and feminine. Similarly, "the accused" is not a pronoun. And that's overlooking those awful and completely unnecessary section headings, and the ridiculous navbox that purports to place a crime with victims of ''both'' sexes into a "series about violence against women" which it clearly isn't a part of since it isn't in the navbox and isn't in the series. And am I the only one who has spotted the false citation, where the article cited has a quite different headline and content if one checks, about intestines? ] (]) 09:35, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:{{tl|tps}} That photographer's license terms seem to take a strict position on the exact way credit must be given in off-wiki uses of their work. I'm not sure if they have pursued settlements against good-faith reusers or in other ways headed into license-trolling. I, like others, cannot find discussion about it on enwiki or commons.{{pb}}There was a previous case (long ago, different license-holder) where consensus formed that the ''effect'' of mass use of a certain creator's content on-wiki was to induce innocent/good-faith but not "strictly by the not-quite-expected license terms" use off-wiki, enabling forced legal settlements. There was thought that the creator themself was actually intentional about using wiki in this way, and that all of this exceeded the community's tolerance and good-faith. ] (]) 18:02, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
**I haven't edited the article yet (tbh, I haven't even read it properly, just skimmed through), I just came by as it's linked from Google News (which typically doesn't happen for India events) and have so far only tackled copyvios, one source misrepresentation, and one change of a quote. I don't like editing current events so I'm only "adminning" it right now, but I believe another admin in a different time zone is required; the copyvio problem has to be addressed immediately -- semi protection won't help as it's coming from autoconfirmed accounts. If you say there are more source misrepresentations I won't doubt you, there are likely to be many, I just haven't had the time to sift through -- and if I get to that point, I obviously can't use the admin tools. &mdash;]''']''' 10:20, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::], yes, thanks--I remember a case too and I think it played out on Commons, that guy who posted videos of himself ejaculating and stuff, and there was a guy who sucked his own ****. But more to the point, I also remember a case of a photographer who, it was judged, was basically here to promote their own business and I think an ANI post led to removal of some of those images. But I can't see what practical guidelines ] is supposed to have broken. ] (]) 18:10, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
***If you want something to use your edit tool on, try rescuing {{On AFD|Quantifier shift}}, a nice calm article about a well-known and well-documented concept in philosophy and logic that has no current events, Indian English, or anything. &#9786; As noted on ], if you are prepared to delve into the philosophy side, and be one of the very few article rescuers that tackle philosophy articles (compare {{On AFD|Illusionism (philosophy)}}), there are examples from Aquinas, Aristotle, and Locke to bring into the article. If I'm going to be tackling Indian English, the least other people can do is rescue philosophy articles.<p>The copyright violation problem is the perennial one, of course: people who cannot write their way out of a paper bag "write" by filching the work of others. I notice the influence of tabloid journalism rearing its ugly head in the article, too. People are "rapped". Police make "probes". Gah!<p>] (]) 11:06, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::I have no idea if there is off-wiki evidence of actual legal actions against re-users, or claims that WP sites are inducement. But I also assume anything I'd find by googling I couldn't mention here for OUTING anyway. ] (]) 18:15, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
****Apparently "being forced to eat shit which the jail wardens denied" is very important to the article. At least now the denial is there, earlier edits included only the first part which have denials in the media. I promise to look at, and edit one of those two articles within the next couple of days (it appears that the first is going out of AfD now anyway). As far as getting on to philosophy articles -- my to do list is ever piling up as there's a lot on women's cricket and Carnatic music that I have left undone for almost two years. cheers. &mdash;]''']''' 12:05, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Thinking of you, whilst correcting the bylines, headlines, newspapers, and agencies of most of the others, I have left the citation of ''CricketCountry'' entirely in its original link-rotting bare URL form. &#9786; ] (]) 14:58, 23 December 2012 (UTC) ::::Yep, and any kind of case should be either discussed on-wiki or submitted privately if there's some privacy concern, rather than signaled (if that's even the word) with a boilerplate and vague edit summary. ] (]) 18:18, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
:], I have reverted those edits. Thanks for bringing it up. ] (]) 18:13, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
******That one actually has to go, ESPNcricinfo should be used for the man of the match while why that tweet is highlighted over all the others is beyond me. These will probably have to wait a while as it's just going to waste talk page time right now (something that the good doc has immense patience for). The reactions section is overly pop-culture oriented with little real information presented -- ''The Hindu'', ''Times of India'', ''Hindustan Times'', ''Salon'', ''The New York Times'', etc have loads of more relevant information. &mdash;]''']''' 15:13, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::Your welcome. I hope the editor just made a mistake. <span style="border:1px solid green; padding:0 2px">]&nbsp;]</span> 02:43, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
*******Would that I'd been able to get to the actual content! I've spent hours so far simply fixing the citations. Most of them were erroneous. A goodly fraction had incorrect headlines, even. ] (]) 21:53, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:For every one who's interested, please see ]. ] (]) 21:42, 13 January 2025 (UTC)


== Just to clarify posts on Miijumaaru talk page ==
== This showed up at DR/N ==
], and the history of the article (which seems to show a long standing slow revert war.
I am not sure if it is even a content matter as it is looks like edit warring back and forth. If you could take a look and see if a hammer is need for anyone...be great. If you feel the soft touch is appropriate I will let another DR/N volunteer decide whether to close or not. I reverted the last blanking as unexplained and the talk page looks like an argument but is not extensive enough for a DR/N filing at the moment.--] (]) 07:21, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*It's an edit war that has been going since June 2012, over content that in one form or the other has been in the article since {{oldid|Moxie Marlinspike|310361269|August 2009}}. Talk page discussion has only dealt with one of the two sections, ironically the one making the extraordinary claim about airport watchlists. Personally, I wouldn't have put that section back in, especially since the only source for it is the subject talking about xyrself, directly and indirectly, which isn't adequate for extraordinary claims like that. The content dealing with <code>sslstrip</code> and the NUL attacks, in contrast, can be found supported by books on computer security and cryptography written by other people, with a quick Google Books search. It's daft to lump the two together. Once again we have edit warriors who only use the undo tool, and don't confine themselves to editing ''only the bits that they actually disagree on''. ] (]) 09:11, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
**Thanks Uncle G. I reverted my revert.--] (]) 09:34, 23 December 2012 (UTC)


The conversation I pinged you in at was a continuation of the post right above at . The editor broke it into two parts for some reason and I wasn't about to correct the nesting issue since the conversation turned turbulent. Since they did multiple changes to articles I thought it would be good to let them know that <nowiki>{{main}}</nowiki> is never used in the lead per the template itself. This was made aware to Tennis Project awhile back and several of us have been slowly fixing tennis articles to comply. A daunting task. I hope this helps you understand the situation I encountered. ] (]) 20:01, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
== Again ==


== On a side note to above template talk ==
*
*
*
*
Thanks. ] (]) 15:00, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*No, thank you. See ]. ] (]) 18:48, 23 December 2012 (UTC)


While template "main" should not be used in the lead, the template "further" is less clear on placement. I just looked and the template "see also" also says not to use in the lead and is used only at the top of sections. "Further" says nothing about placement and I can't help but wonder if that should also say not to use in the lead. Where best to bring that up? On the narrow Template:Further talk page? Or is there a more general template talk page that it should be talked about? Thanks. ] (]) 20:18, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
== PC protection of ] ==
*That's a good question, and I don't have an answer for that--but I think ] is the first place I would go to. I don't know that that page gets a lot of traffic, though... But if, as you say, there is a consensus for the other one, you might could ping some of the editors who discussed that. ] (]) 21:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
*:I posted at Manual of Style/Layout first to see if anyone knows the answer. Thanks. ] (]) 22:06, 13 January 2025 (UTC)


== AfD sock ==
Hi.


There's something seriously wrong with {{noping|OhNoKaren}}. The account is about a week old, and she's already created many AfDs. That's pretty much all she's done. I vaguely remember some deletion socks, although I don't recall that they had problems with the procedure as she does. Even if she's not a sock, I'm thinking her editing is disruptive enough to block, but I have to go eat dinner. Can you check if you're still around?--] (]) 01:59, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
I have started at discussion at ] about the protection of the article on ]. Your opinion would be appreciated.
*Well, we did just block an AfD troll, a few weeks ago, but this one has a clean record, from my perspective. I need coffee, BTW. ] (]) 13:04, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
**Thanks. Later, after logging out, it occurred to me that the new user's name is similar to {{U|Ohnoitsjamie}}, not similar enough to block for impersonation, but I wondered if the user's conduct rings any bells, Jamie?--] (]) 15:05, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
***Sounds like a "sour grapes" account, someone upset that their vanity bio/company page was deleted? Not sure what the specific case would be. I suspect a sock check would turn up multiple accounts. <b>] ]</b> 15:07, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
****Sorry to disappoint you. ;) ] (]) 16:17, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
****See analysis on ] - she did nominate multiple vanity bio/company pages, and I think those will actually get deleted. --] (]) 16:17, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
*****If many of the nominations have merit, it makes her less disruptive, but not less suspicious.--] (]) 16:34, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
**** CU would probably be stale, but ] comes to mind; after I deleted a page they created, they became very active in AfD; some of the noms were good, but many were not and they were eventually blocked, unblocked, then reblocked for violating terms of their unblock. <b>] ]</b> 17:01, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
*****HOW IN THE WORLD DO YOU REMEMBER STUFF LIKE THAT ] (]) 17:03, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
****** That's a great question; there's plenty of more useful stuff I wish that I remembered. <b>] ]</b> 17:07, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
*******The two users don't write at all the same. Light2021 doesn't sound like a native English speaker. Drmies, was a check ever run against Light2021? Looks like they were accused of socking (their block log is, um, busy)?--] (]) 17:13, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
********Yep--by ] and, to stay on the topic of memory, by you. ;) ] (]) 17:34, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
********It's documented here, ], and Jpgordon checked after an unblock request in 2018. ] (]) 17:39, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
*********Ha! If you remember, my memory is almost non-existent, and as far as CU-related stuff, I repress all of it as bad memories. That said, I suspect that if you were to check the CU log of Light2021 vs. the data on Karen, you might find that they edit from different continents, pretty much ruling out that she's a sock of Light2021.--] (]) 18:05, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
**********Hmm no I don't remember that. ;) ] (]) 18:11, 16 January 2025 (UTC)


== A barnstar for you! ==
Thanks.


{| style="background-color: var(--background-color-success-subtle, #fdffe7); border: 1px solid var(--border-color-success, #fceb92); color: var(--color-base, #202122);"
] (]) 15:03, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
==Winter Wonderland==
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''The Editor's Barnstar'''
]{{quotation|'''Peace is a state of balance and understanding in yourself and between others, where respect is gained by the acceptance of differences, tolerance persists, conflicts are resolved through dialog, peoples rights are respected and their voices are heard, and everyone is at their highest point of serenity without social tension.'''}}
::<big>Happy Holidays to you and yours.</big> ```]<small>]</small> 15:56, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks Buster. If you want the opposite of serenity, spend Christmas with us and my mother in law. If you can take over for me, that'd be great. I'll be somewhere else--anywhere else. ] (]) 23:34, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

==Talk:Breast cancer awareness 2.0==

Drmies: You are far more experienced than I. How should one reason with an ] who has a when, it appears to my inexperienced eye, {{gender:WhatamIdoing|he is|she is|they are}} at best not ] and at worst may even be displaying signs of ]? For example, I do not see a coherently supported rebuttal from {{gender:WhatamIdoing|him|her|them}} either or . In the first case, {{gender:WhatamIdoing|he has|she has|they have}} since my and in the second case, I have taken the unusual (for me) step of following what I thought was --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 16:27, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:Welcome to the wonderful world of ]. You are very brave to be discussing anything on that talk page. As for the supposedly annoyingly high IQ, it's irrelevant, except maybe it explains the presumptions. In any event, ignore it, and treat her as you would any other editor.--] (]) 16:48, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:I poked around, and they are very, very active, but seem to support lots of other people's ideas as much as their own. I didn't see anything problematic, and they seem to support their idea with specific examples and diffs. Maybe I just missed it but it looks like a pretty normal discussion with occasional mild heat. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 16:55, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::If Drmies pops in, Dennis, I think he might disagree with you (see and ).--] (]) 17:06, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::Dennis, I'm sorry to (indeed) disagree with you. That article and its talk page are a mess and the attitude of that one editor is, in large part, the cause of it. I think Bbb and I are on the same wavelength here. I will check in a moment, but what Senra indicates is par for the course. I had asked both editors to back off. But let me check and I'll get back. ] (]) 17:34, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::Well. Let me make a few small observations as an editor. I fully support a change in the referencing format. I'm a big fan of MLA style in-text parenthetic citations in my own writing, but not on Misplaced Pages. I use a footnoted variant thereof; if I were smart enough (my IQ is merely annoying, not annoyingly high) I'd use that sfn template that established quality editors like MF and Uncle G use. Charles35's point about the one sentence and all has nothing to do with that basic question. The term "universal" is a rhetorical one; we don't know if breast cancer occurs elsewhere in the universe and while it's accepted hyperbole, I suppose, in some of the sources it should not be used here, especially not since it only adds to the advocacy flavor of the article.<p> I'll repeat what I said earlier: I think the article will be much better off if the two main editors stay away from it, and by "two main editors" I mean Whatamidoing most of all. That's kind of a sad statement, and one I make reluctantly, since those two main editors seem to have some knowledge but there is too much zeal in their edits. Moreover, Whatamidoing's attitude on the talk page makes moving the article forward a practical impossibility, and both suffer from TLDNR-itis (that is, they cause it in others). I would fully support ] to have those two editor back away from the article and its talk page. ] (]) 17:53, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::::Breast Cancer Awareness article!? *Backs away slooooowly* *closes door quietly* *Runs the opposit direction fast* But seriousy...while still running in the opposit direction...good job Drmies! {{Like}} --] (]) 19:57, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

::::All I've done since your warning was make a few (4) ''concise'' (1 small paragraph), factual, non-controversial, and well-mannered points to the discussion lead by senra (ie I backed off). And my contributions to the article were ''solely'' removals of harmful and ''very'' poorly sourced original research (which I have now completed). They weren't challenged at all which I hope goes to show that they weren't controversial edits. I hope you give me the opportunity to keep this up.

::::I also hope you consider what I said about (1) responding to stress more poorly than others but editing properly in absence of those stressors, or ceasing problematic general/aimless/TLDR discussions (which I am currently doing) and (2) penalizing innocent editors that have good faith in order to be fair to both sides, especially when those editors have stopped being disruptive and/or wouldn't be disruptive if the environment was less stressful. And please consider that much of that disruptive editing (eg TLDR & aimless edits) occurred when I was naive about how[REDACTED] worked.

::::Please give me the opportunity to "continue in the same vein" unless/until I regress. For example, I am going to stop complaining about other editors and leave that in the hands of the admins. From this point forward I plan to focus on adding new material. Please don't block me from doing that. ] (]) 21:19, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

=== citations ===
Senra, getting hyperlinks in whilst preserving the Harvard parenthetical cross-linkage style is dead easy. Just replace <source lang=html5 enclose=none>(Levine 2005)</source> with <source lang=html5 enclose=none>{{harv|Levine|2005}}</source> everywhere and ensure that the citation for Levine begins <source lang=html5 enclose=none>{{Cite news|ref=harv|</source>&hellip;. That's it. ] (]) 22:08, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*Thanks Uncle G, but I believe Senra is actually proposing a switch to footnotes.--] (]) 22:24, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
**Like I said, I'm not smart enough to be of much use here. I think any change would be a start already. Parenthetic citations are distracting in non-academic writing. ] (]) 22:28, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*** What Drmies says. Erm, except the not smart enough bit. Any acceptance by the current editors of any reasoned change is a large positive step towards more collaboration at that difficult page --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 23:06, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
****The "not smart enough" bit is one of many that is turned on when one becomes an admin.--] (]) 23:15, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*****I would have to just take your word for that.... ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 23:18, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
******Yup, my IQ dropped precipitously. I'm still trying to find it on the floor, but I think it rolled underneath the desk and became ensnarled in dust balls. I now refuse to vacuum under the desk for fear my IQ will disappear completely.--] (]) 23:42, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
*****(]) If we use the definition of smart as: "Cause a sharp, stinging pain"...then yes, I agree....Drmies isn't all that "smart". ;) LOL! But don't let that fool you. They can be both "quick witted" and "intelligent".--] (]) 23:25, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
**Actually, Senra is proposing a means to an end, not the means itself, and on the talk page, if you look, xe is discussing WhatamIdoing's "non-standard solution". The aforegiven is the ''standard'' solution, in contrast. And it is simple to execute, in contrast to WhatamIdoing's proposal. There's a lot of distraction going on in that discussion. ] (]) 06:12, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*** At the macro level Uncle G, I was indeed proposing a ''means to an end''; at ] any consensually agreed changes are for the better. At the however, I was a specific ''means itself''&mdash;] using {{tl|sfn}}&mdash;though of course, as in any arbitration, achieving the same end would be just as acceptable. On another matter, what does '''xe''' mean in the fragment "... '''xe''' is discussing WhatamIdoing's "non-standard solution"? This is a code I am unfamiliar with --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 11:41, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
**** ], ], ]. ] (]) 12:18, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
{{od}} Seriously, I don't understand the ins and outs and pros and cons of sfn and a bunch of other things. I have tried to read those pages and defenses of it on talk pages (MF's and others), and I just don't get it. Also it bores me terrifically. I understand how the older generation (MF, Uncle G, Dennis B) finds some attraction in those technicalities, but they don't see, I believe, that we, the others (Bbb and myself, for starters), are young and beautiful and have so much to live for. We can't be bothered by your persnickety detail--we want to LIVE. Oh yeah, I just opened up a rad beer, "Lucifer", by ]. Someone should give them a decent article one of these days. ] (]) 23:29, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:Woohoo, I'm not "the older generation"....although I am certain my "young and beautiful" days are pretty much behind me. (hey...I was a hoty! LOL! ;) )--] (]) 23:35, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::Sorry Amadscientist, I --I'm not ''that'' young, contrary to public opinion. Meh. ] (]) 23:42, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::You know.....I have never actually read that. The pretty birds are always more distracting than the tiny text. Can I giggle like a schoolgirl with a happy face? =)--] (]) 23:51, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
::::I used "Meh" on Facebook the other day and my spouse asked what it meant. <sub>I am laughing inside (that's not what it means of course, but what I am actually doing)</sub>.--] (]) 23:53, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

=== neutrality ===
By the way: Professor Gayle A. Sulik, who has been proposed as the {{diff|Talk:Breast cancer awareness|529469866|529469593|"highest quality academic source"}}, is a sociologist at ]. Of the next most often used, ] is a professor of history and Samantha King is a professor of the Sociocultural Studies of Sport, Health and the Body at ]. Sulik's viewpoint is very clear in {{harvnb|Sulik|2011|pp=1104&ndash;1105}}. One of the things to counter that reliance on one viewpoint is to use {{harvnb|Klawiter|2008}}, which is languishing unused in the Further Reading section. Marin Klawiter was a professor at Georgia Tech and is now at Yale Law School, and the cited book points out ''the at least two viewpoints on the subject''. Page 174 et seq. of the book discusses the conflicts between the screening activists and the feminists over the issues, and why they clash. Here's a quotation: {{bquote|The culture of empowerment and feminist breast/cancer activism thus took shape, in part, through conflict with the culture of screening activism.|||{{harvnb|Klawiter|2008|p=176}}}} One wouldn't know ''any'' of the history from the article at hand. Such a lot of the waffle on that talk page could be eliminated if editors knew what they were about and pointed out that the neutrality issue is that ''there are several major viewpoints'' in the history of breast cancer awareness. Kirsten E. Gardner, assistant professor of history and women's studies at the University of Texas at San Antonio, isn't even mentioned on the article and the talk page, yet her book {{harv|Gardner|2006}} documents the ''historical shifts in breast cancer awareness'', setting the post-1970s feminist viewpoint in historical context showing how it came about and how it challenged the viewpoints that preceded it. The answer to the person only using the single academic source is a whole lot of other academic sources from ''historians'' rather than sociologists, putting Sulik's views into historical context.<p>Get the history in, and you'll discover that we didn't even know that we didn't have ] {{harv|Mansel|Sweetland|Hughes|2009|pp=16&ndash;20}} and didn't mention the Amanda Sims Memorial Fund (that Bloodgood founded) anywhere in the encyclopaedia at all. I thus leave Drmies' talk page lurkers with a present:
:'''Did you know &hellip;''' that ''']''' was the first U.S. surgeon to insist that all members of a surgical team wear rubber gloves at all times?
:'''Did you know &hellip;''' that the Amanda Sims Memorial Fund for the Protection of Women from Cancer by Correct Information, founded by ''']''', was promoting cancer awareness in the 1930s?
:'''Did you know &hellip;''' that the ASCC's Women's Field Army, also promoting cancer awareness in the 1930s, was inspired by the Amanda Sims Memorial Fund?
:'''Did you know &hellip;''' that on 1931-11-18 in a lecture ''']''' told the Bronx County Medical Society: "Without doubt annual examinations of all women and semi-annual pelvic examinations of mothers during which the breast will be carefully surveyed, should increase the protection of women from death by cancer of the breast."
No, we don't have ] {{harv|Mansel|Sweetland|Hughes|2009|pp=12&ndash;14}}, ] {{harv|Mansel|Sweetland|Hughes|2009|pp=14&ndash;16}}, or ] {{harv|Mansel|Sweetland|Hughes|2009|pp=20&ndash;22}}, either.
* {{cite encyclopaedia|ref=harv|article=Pink, Advertising and|encyclopedia=Encyclopedia of Women in Today's World|volume=1|editor1-first=Mary|editor1-last=Zeiss Stange|editor2-first=Carol K.|editor2-last=Oyster|editor3-first=Jane E.|editor3-last=Sloan|publisher=SAGE|year=2011|isbn=9781412976855|first=Gayle A.|last=Sulik}}
* {{cite book|ref=harv|title=Early Detection: Women, Cancer, &amp; Awareness Campaigns in the Twentieth-Century United States|chapter=Screening Technology, Feminist Health Movement, Cancer Critics|first=Kirsten Elizabeth|last=Gardner|publisher=University of North Carolina Press|year=2006|isbn=9780807856826}}
** {{cite journal|ref=harv|journal=Journal of the National Medical Association|year=2007|month=July|volume=99|issue=7|pages=853&ndash;854|pmc=2574354|title=Review of ''Early Detection: Women, Cancer, and Awareness Campaigns in the Twentieth-Century United States''|first1=Jennifer|last1=Shambrook|first2=Debbie|last2=Bryant|first3=Brenda|last3=Nickerson|first4=Anthony J.|last4=Alberg}}
** {{cite journal|ref=harv|last=Kay|first=Gwen|year=2007|title=Review of ''Early Detection: Women, Cancer and Awareness Campaigns in the Twentieth-Century United States''|journal=Collected Book and Web Reviews|publisher=Alexander Street Press|location=Alexandria, VA|url=http://womhist.alexanderstreet.com/S10019880-D0032.htm}}
* {{cite book|ref=harv|chapter=History of benign breast disease|title=Hughes, Mansel &amp; Webster's Benign Disorders and Diseases of the Breast|editor1-first=Robert E.|editor1-last=Mansel|editor2-first=Helen M.|editor2-last=Sweetland|editor3-first=L. E.|editor3-last=Hughes|edition=3rd|publisher=Elsevier Health Sciences|year=2009|isbn=9780702027741}}
* {{cite journal|ref=harv|journal=New York State Journal of Medicine|volume=32|issue=5|date=1932-03-01|publisher=Medical Society of the State of New York|authorlink=Joseph Colt Bloodgood|first=Joseph Colt|last=Bloodgood|title=About Protecting Women from Death from Cancer of the Breast|page=259 et seq.}}
] (]) 06:12, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*I admit, I am confused by this.--] (]) 06:39, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
** In discussing content, Uncle G is much . Excellent subject analysis Uncle G. I hope the current editors see it the same way --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 11:09, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*** At least two of them have been reading this user talk page, so I hope so. (This is familiar territory for me. I keep mentioning ]. It, too, is an article that's missing historical context. There's history that goes back to World War ''One'', according to history books. The current article barely mentions World War ''Two''.) I've added a second present above.<p>Enjoy ], by the way.<p>] (]) 12:13, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
**** (ec) I hope you don't mind Drmies. I sent a notification of this discussion to the current editors of ] who I took to be {{User|WhatamIdoing}}, {{User|Charles35}} and {{User|WLU}} --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 12:39, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::As I have said many times, I have no opposition to additional reliable sources being added to the page. Adding these would be excellent, provided someone takes the time to integrate them. I'm planning on reading Sulik over the coming weeks and integrating it into the page, and if I have the time will read the suggestions on this page as well. Most of the disputes were over the phrasing and current sources, in very few, possibly no cases, were missing sources proposed for integration. Had these been proposed, I would have heartily endorsed them. Consider this my contribution to the ] to use them. ] <small>] ] Misplaced Pages's rules:</small>]/] 13:57, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

:::::The reason I posted here earlier because senra linked this page from the BCA talk page. My "agenda" up to this point was to take care of non-source-related issues first, and then remove the original research that I suspected was present under Sulik citations (and it certainly was present), and finally add new material. I guess that little 3-stage approach wasn't optimal and may have indeed played a part in the escalating problems, but either way I have given up on correcting non-source-related problems, and I have completed removing original research under Sulik's name, so my main objective now is to add new material. WLU said how he welcome's new sources. Of course, I agree with that, but I thought that article needed something more than new sources, which is why I took the approach that I did. But this is in the past, I just wanted you to understand that. ] (]) 14:51, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::I think this is good timing anyway because there's a lot of talk here about adding new material. One of my main objectives was to get admin(s) involved anyway because I felt things over there were not going to budge without them. So basically from this point forward, as I said, I will not be leading aimless discussions, I will let you all lead the way and focus more on adding sources that I have found than on disagreements and maybe chime in when I think there's something valuable I can add. I hope I am not prevented from doing this.
:::::Oh, and like amadscientist, I had a very difficult time following Uncle G's post. But it looks like good stuff to me. ] (]) 14:48, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::UPDATE: I know I said I will ''only'' be adding more material. I wasn't lying about that. But I just got Olson's book and the amount of original research in the article behind these citations disturbs me. I am going to verify all of Olson's citations and might do King as well. But as I said, I am nonetheless not going to partake in aimless talk page disagreements and the like. I just wanted to let you all know this so you don't think I was lying. ] (]) 19:00, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::Sorry, I follow Uncle G completely. I just wish I had time to really follow him, but Christmas is getting in the way of my work here. ;) ] (]) 00:44, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::It took me some time and following the replies etc. but I got the jest of it. I think Uncle G is a fabulous editor and intend to follow them a bit. Not too difficult as prolific as they are.--] (]) 05:11, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

==Page Move Request==
Hey Drmies, could you move ] to ]? "Cozi TV" is the new name for the network as of December 20, 2012. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 20:09, 23 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
:Just lighting this up again. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 21:22, 23 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
::Needlessly, Homer. I did it hours ago, including a merge of the histories. Happy days, ] (]) 23:30, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::Thank you, Sir. :) Much appreciated. :) - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 23:52, 23 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
::::(Almost) anytime, Homer. ] (]) 23:54, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::Yeah, there are those times where it is best not to bug people. Birthdays, anniversaries, Easter, Thanksgiving, Christmas, New Year's, etc. :) - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 01:28, 24 December 2012 (UTC)</small>

==Merry Christmas==
{| align=center style="{{Round corners}}; font-family:Trebuchet MS, sans-serif; border: 3px solid Green; padding: 6px; background: white;"
|]
|<font color="Red">{{BASEPAGENAME}}, I hope you have a Merry Christmas and hope your day is full of the true spirit of the day.<br>Plus, good food, good family and good times. :) Have a Great Day! :) - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 07:20, 24 December 2012 (UTC)</small>{{{2|}}} </font><br />

<font color="Black"><small>Spread the joy of Christmas by adding <nowiki>{{subst:User:Neutralhomer/MerryChristmas}}</nowiki> to their talk page with a friendly message.</small></font>
|}

== The Next "Article on Individual Twitter Accounts" ==

]. Happy holidays!&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 12:47, 24 December 2012 (UTC)

== Merry Christmas! ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''Merry Christmas'''
|- |-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Hey Drmies, hope you like all the eggnog. We need bacon-nog next, get on it! Keep safe over the holidays, and hopefully I can see you at the next Wikimania! Merry Christmas for you and yours!&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 16:26, 21 December 2012 (UTC) |style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Thank you for helping reduce the use of "served as", "serves as" and such like for what are not public service roles. In those two examples, "was" and "is" would be preferable (this last sentence is obviously not for your benefit, but might help someone else who reads this). ] (]) 12:21, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
|} |}
*I appreciate that--but I'm even stricter than you are: I think it's almost always a euphemism for "work"... ] (]) 13:00, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
**Thanks. I would like to be stricter, but encounter too much pushback from other editors. I think at most it should only be for unpaid, genuinely altruistic activity. As an example, and without wishing too be too cynical, far too many politicians are self-serving. And of course, we need to take into account that some reliable sources often still use the term for state sector jobs, military and politicians. Perhaps once it is removed from more business bios, we can start an RfC. ] (]) 14:20, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
***], thanks--I thought I'd be careful, since I didn't want to butt heads with you after you sent me this nice message, but I agree with you completely. If you get paid, it's not service. If you get underpaid, it might approach service--but if you are underpaid and still make a fair amount of money (like, for instance, as president of the US), "service" is a bit of a euphemism. As far as reliable sources go--yeah, but in "serve as president" the operational part is "president", not "serve". I teach at a state university: is this service? I like to think so, for various reasons, but it's ludicrous to pretty much equate that with philanthropy (another item we see in ALL those articles), as if it didn't come with a paycheck and possibly health insurance. No Christmas bonuses, of course. ] (]) 16:16, 16 January 2025 (UTC)


== Merry Christmas - 2012 == == ] ==


Thanks for your edits at ]. I had prepared this for a COI report, but was waiting for that editor's response:
Christmas Greetings. ] (]) 14:48, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*On November 30, 2023, that editor stated : "this account is not a business account, anyone using this account will be doing so with direct supervision of the account owner, ie. I will be standing behind them any time the login is used".
:*I hate to do this, but... non-free image removed.&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 15:16, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*That editor then made a number of edits at ] that removed content sourced by secondary sources, and added content of a promotional tone, sourced by primary sources.
::*That's funny--I was just looking to see if I could use a Norman Rockwell illustration and decided I couldn't, for the same reason. Thanks Crisco, and Kierzek, thanks for the greetings! ] (]) 16:00, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
*That editor wrote a lengthy declaration of their purpose , stating, "I kindly request that any changes avoid undermining the hard work and dedication of many business owners and community members who have strived tirelessly to erase the stigma and stereotypes associated with the region."
*A Google search of "invise" and "Mike L." adds depth.


Certainly seems like a single-purpose editor trying to cleanse the article of well-sourced negative content. Cheers. ] (]) 12:05, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
== Question ==
*Oh, I feel the same way. Did you see what they tried to post on your talk page? See the filter log. But the problem with the article (I'm sure you saw my pruning) is, in my opinion, much bigger than just that. The negative information isn't about that organization, as far as I could tell from that confusing article. But they're p-blocked from the article now; who knows, maybe they'll figure out how to gain consensus for anything on the talk page. I will reiterate that the argument "it's negative stuff and it shows up in a search" is completely inappropriate here. ] (]) 17:30, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
::I'll try to add some well-sourced content back to the article. Cheers. ] (]) 17:38, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
:::Sure. You think, ], the subject is notable, that organization? Cause all I see in a quick search is some promotional BS. It may be better to consider . ] (]) 17:44, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
:::Wait. I'm wrong: I should have figured that there was more in the history, including a lot of you. The article ''was'' about a region and for now I'm going to go back to ; hope that's okay with you. Then we can take it from there. ] (]) 17:48, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
::: is where it got messed up. ] (]) 17:54, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
{{quote frame|quote=Utah's tech community has been nicknamed Silicon Slopes, a reference to California's world famous Silicon Valley high tech commnity.|source={{cite book|title=Utah: Third Edition|series=It's My State!|edition=3rd|author1-first=Doug|author1-last=Sanders|author2-first=Lisa M.|author2-last=Herrington|author3-first=Kerry Jones|author3-last=Waring|publisher=Cavendish Square Publishing|year=2015|isbn=9781627131780|chapter=Making a Living|page=73}}|width=100%}}
{{quote frame|quote=Increasingly a growing technology sector&mdash;the so-called Silicon Slopes&mdash;has developed around the Salt Lake&ndash;Utah County line.|source={{cite book|title=Utah Politics and Government: American Democracy Among a Unique Electorate|series=Politics and Governments of the American States|author1-first=Adam R.|author1-last=Brown|publisher=University of Nebraska Press|year=2018|isbn=9781496207852|page=48}}|width=100%}}
{{quote frame|quote=In Utah Valley, the coinage "Silicon Slopes," invented by Google in 2013 upon announcing that Provo would be the third city in the nation to receive a Google Fiber network, has been picked up eagerly by business leaders |source={{cite journal|journal=Utah Historical Quarterly|volume=82|issue=3|editor1-first=J. Cecil|editor1-last=Alter|publisher=Utah State Historical Society|year=2014|page=188|title=THIS WAS THE PLACE: The Making and Unmaking of Utah|author1-first=Jared|author1-last=Farmer|doi=10.2307/45063063|url=https://jaredfarmer.net/s/Farmer-This-Was-the-Place-Making-Unmaking-Utah.pdf}}|width=100%}}
The non-advertorial independent sources strongly disagree with that first paragraph, Doktoro.
Personally, I am inclined to take the word of the {{plainlink|1=https://www.history.upenn.edu/people/faculty/jared-farmer|2=Walter H. Annenberg Professor of History at the University of Pennsylvania}} published in a state historical society journal over what is said in a self-published corporate blurb.
] (]) 07:42, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
*], I don't know what I did wrong: that is NOT the version I wanted to restore. Thank you. And it's nice to see you again. Keep your distance: I got something from my boy and I don't want to pass it on to you. ] (]) 17:24, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
**Take out your mask and pass {{harvnb|Gustin|2013}} along to ], Doktoro. That, in addition to the history professor, will get you the ] connection. ] (]) 09:06, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
***{{cite magazine|title=‘Silicon Slopes’: Google Fiber Planned For Provo, Utah|author1-first=Sam|author1-last=Gustin|date=2013-04-18|url=https://business.time.com/2013/04/18/silicon-slopes-google-fiber-planned-for-provo-utah/|magazine=]}}


== Email ==
Merry Christmas! I have a question for you (or any of your stalkers) regarding a question I got at the ]. Can you link to a category within an article (e.g., There are many ])? I had never really thought about that, but I figured perhaps you'd come across a situation like that in one or two of your 100000+ edits. Sorry to bother you on Christmas Eve, I told the asker it may take a few days to get a response, but I didn't even know where to look for something of that nature. Thanks in advance. ] ]] 21:15, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
: Merry Christmas to you too. I prefer to be labelled a lurker, he he. Consider ] for example <nowiki>]</nowiki> leads to ] --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 21:53, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
::Mr. Lurker, I think you misunderstood my question. I am asking if, when in article space, it is good practice, acceptable, etc. to link to a category. ] ]] 21:54, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
::: Just realised that and was about to undo --<span style="font-variant:small-caps;">]&nbsp;(])</span> 21:57, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
::::I have seen it happen but really only (AFAIK) in a "See also" section. The problem with doing it in an article is interesting--Misplaced Pages articles shouldn't cite Misplaced Pages, and by the same token they shouldn't refer to themselves as Misplaced Pages articles. Now, there isn't an external source in the world that would ''mention'' a Misplaced Pages category, so inserting it in an article is a kind of original research. Anyway, it's probably not a good practice in article writing. Is the Teahouse serving cocktails for Christmas? We're sampling Christmas beers: the ] is tonight's winner. ] (]) 00:40, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::You'll have to consult our current Maitre d', ] for information on our beverage selection. ] ]] 04:16, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

== Season's Greetings ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
|style="font-size: x-large; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''Merry Christmas'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Wishing you a Merry Christmas and all the best for 2013. ] ] 22:43, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
|}

== To you and your family! ==

Have a happy holiday and a great new year!--] (]) 00:46, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

== Home ==

I have been allowed to escape and Malleus now knows of the wotsit and seems to be agreeable, so thanks for the thoughts etc relating to both of us. I need to catch up on talk page replies and will do. On a totally different subject, I've mentioned you towards the end of the thread at ]. My gut feeling - and my gut is one of the few bits of me that have so far escaped medical interest - is that this is a pretty significant subject and that it would be useful to involve people who have or have access to specialist knowledge. I'm not sure whether Chomsky etc really figure in what you do but, hey, you understand non-English English and that makes you better than me. - ] (]) 01:28, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
*Don't ask ] for language advice. Remember: {{gender:Drmies|His|Her|Xyr}} species evolved beyond the need for consonants many aeons ago, although they do use the letter ] and other things from Code Page 437. And don't go tempting {{gender:Drmies|him|her|xem}} with your {{plainlink|http://poundland.co.uk/product-range/a-z/wotsits-wafflers/|Wotsits}}, either. ] (]) 09:48, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

== 'Tis that season again... ==

{| style="background-color: #fdffe7; border: 1px solid #fceb92;"
|rowspan="2" style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 5px;" | ]
|style="font-size: 20px; padding: 3px 3px 0 3px; height: 1.5em;" | '''Happy Holidays!'''
|-
|style="vertical-align: middle; padding: 3px;" | Hope you and your family are enjoying the holiday season, Drmies! ]&nbsp;<sup>]] ]]</sup> 06:06, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
|}

== Table of results in ] ==
So, I looked at this article in preparation to do a DYK review. In the original version, each time a candidate was mentioned his exact vote count was included in parentheses. I thought this was distracting from the prose, so I removed these parentheticals in favor of a couple of vote-count summaries.

What I'd really like to do is to include a table of results with the precise vote count. Such a table is included in the google books source by Zuwiyya on page 19.

I seek advice. All the information in this table was included in the previous version of the article, just in an annoying and hard to read manner. Is it legit, though, just to reproduce this table? And if so, would it be okay to re-order the table to group the Sunni, Shiite, and minority candidates separately? And if not, is my general summary of vote-counts okay with folks, or would people prefer the exact count appearing after each candidate's name?

And oy, reading election tables from Lebanon 1968 is far preferable to listening to my motherwhomIlovedearly ask repeatedly whether it's safe to let Amazon.com know her credit card number... Thanks! (P.S. I can't for the life of me figure out how to get this message out of Ed's greeting, so I'm sorry, Ed, and those who have the knowing of the wikitext please reformat for me!)] (]) 22:08, 25 December 2012 (UTC) <small>Thanks, Dennis!</small>] (]) 23:59, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
*Your mother is always right, Moishe. I had a quick look at the article and it seems fine to me, but I don't know if there are standards for such articles that yours might deviate from. So, I guess I'm not really qualified to answer your question. An additional table would be fine, I supposed--there is no requirement that we represent every bit of information, but then again, "folks" might feel differently. Same applies to a grouping by denomination/persuasion. Did you check if the WikiProject Politics has any guidelines? I'd check--but I have my mother-in-law here, and well you know, maybe. ] (]) 03:11, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

==..==
]<br>''Seasons greetings to you and yours''<br> ] (]) 13:55, 25 December 2012 (UTC)

{{clear}}
== happy holidays ==

Happy holidays to you and everypony. /)(\ ] (]) 21:56, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
*Muy excellente, as Dora might say. The best to you and yours as well. My youngest daughter is pleased as punch, playing with her new MLP mermaid set. Yes, they're merponies too, I learned! ] (]) 05:06, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

== Pecan pie ==

I broke my usual habit of avoiding wheat, sugar and corn syrup to have some of my wife's pecan pie. Best. Pie. Ever. Wish I could have shared some with you. She baked 6 for the family get together, but held one back in case she needed it as a gift for a family or friend that was in need (Mrs. Brown is very thoughtful that way, one reason I completely adore her). If you lived nearby, it would have been yours. Of course, since you ''don't'' live nearby, I just might have to sneak in the kitchen, make a half pot of decaf and carve me up a slice. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 22:58, 25 December 2012 (UTC)
*Sounds like a plan, sir. I snuck off after everyone went to bed and I'm polishing off a (big) bottle of ]. Sounds like Mrs. Brown had a busy day! I did too, with roasting root vegetables, making ambrosia, and slicing up a pork loin that I turned into a rollade with duxelles in it. I'm stuffed. Cheers, Dennis, and happy days to you. ] (]) 05:04, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
**You two have me salivating here. However, I need a disambig for "ambrosia" because in the UK it is a brand name for a ]. I am sure you were not working in a cannery, nor could you possibly descend to making the poor substitute that is UK Ambrosia, which is nothing like my ma's ] that has a thick, slightly charred skin and holds a spoon upright. Being a singleton etc, my usual Xmas Day meal is a ] with ]. My poncy dog has more spent on him than I spend on myself ... but I do sometimes plug the gimmick 3-inch Christmas Tree into my USB port while continuing the endless clean-up of, well, Indic stuff. And I think that the dog does a better job of cleaning up his bowl than I do cleaning up WP. - ] (]) 00:56, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
***I should clarify the mushy pea reference. I soak and then boil a ham beforehand, then save the juices and some carvings. The carvings are broken up and added to the dried peas in the reserved juices. That is a pretty classy and very thick ], I guess, rather than mere mushy peas. But the pie comes from a factory 'cos ma (whose 'tater pie is also a work of art) is elsewhere. - ] (]) 01:01, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
****And now I've just had to amend the ] disambig. It is unsourced but sod it. I've never fully grasped the limits of disambig pages: Doncram goes to one extreme, I would go to the other and my guess is that somewhere in the middle is probably right.. - ] (]) 01:20, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
*****Growing up, "ambrosia" was a fruit salad with stuff like pineapple, grapes, apple and orange slices, etc. that is sweetened with honey or mixed together with ] or whipping cream. Mini ], shredded coconut, mango or just about any fruit is optional. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 15:44, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
{{od}}], yes--but I got a pretty decent recipe, involving fresh citrus fruit and pineapple, whipping cream mixed with orange zest and powdered sugar and sour cream, and toasted sweetened shredded coconut. My guide for this and many other recipes from ] is ] (the magazine), besides '']''. ] (]) 17:12, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:Thanks, guys. I'm not fond of fruit salad but since you are then indeed it is living up to the description of food of the gods ;) - ] (]) 17:27, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::I'm obviously from an entirely different social milieu, as Ambrosia to me is a rather disgusting tinned rice pudding. ] ] 17:38, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::I called it "vaguely acceptable" above. If you've had nothing to eat for a few days ... - ] (]) 17:42, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::I'd rather go for a few more days without eating, and then more likely eat the paper label on the tin than its contents. It reminds me of everything I hated about school diners: tapioca, cemolina, and other stodgey monstrosities. ] ] 17:52, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::The fruit salad kind is really not bad--the recipe I use calls for fresh fruit, and lacks Cool Whip (a US monstrosity). Cemolina: semolina? I kind of like that. I discovered that one of my Dutch childhood favorites, ] (a porridge/pudding you love or hate) is not unlike the American ], but a bit grittier (and yellow) and usually served with a raspberry or other coulis. Tapioca...yum! Rice pudding...yum! I suppose I'm a grain junkie, or really a carb junkie. ] (]) 18:05, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::IIRC, Malleus is not a fan of porridge either. I'm no fan of tapioca or semolina but was always the odd one out at school in really enjoying ], which everyone else called frog spawn. - ] (]) 18:15, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::I'd forgotten about sago, which was the worst of the lot as far as I was concerned. Despite having a Scottish mother and being brought up in Scotland until I was 12 I absolutely refused to even try porridge. For all I know it may taste OK, but I set my face against it. My English wife likes it, but I won't touch it even today. ] ] 18:42, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::I always liked oatmeal (which is similar to porridge, isn't it?). Oddly enough, I've always much preferred it to grits, which are the Southern US analogue, despite being nominally Southern myself. The secret is brown sugar and cinnamon, and plenty of it; as people "fondly" say when they watch me eat, I like a little oatmeal with my cinnamon sugar. ] ]] 18:48, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::As Drmies points out, if it is done with fresh fruit and either honey or fresh whipped cream (ie: US style) then it is very, very good. Crunchy and sweet and tangy and sour and crisp and fresh and...okay, now I want some. It is actually a very good summertime meal, and goes very well with white wine or champagne. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 18:49, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::Writ Keeper, "gries" = "grit" -- it's a word denoting some size measurement. I'm talking out of my butt, of course, while I'm getting access to the OED. Ah yes. Same word as in grit-gruel, also as in girt-brew. And if so, it must be the same as Dutch "grut" and "gort". I wish I had access to the Dutch equivalent of the OED, the ]. Wait--apparently access is free? That's crazy. Shoot, I think Flash isn't working in my Firefox. Anyway, my theory is that these words for size (very coarse, like tiny pebbles) in their respective languages have come to stand for the grain product most often used in that format. In the south, that's grits from corn; in NW Europe, it's gries from wheat. FWIW, I don't really much care for grits, and when I first ran into it I ate it with sugar. Now, will someone write up ] please? ] (]) 21:35, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::::Grits are like tofu, no flavor, but great when you add something to them. I prefer a crumbled piece of bacon and an egg over easy mixed in, and/or maybe some ]. American cheese is also good. Sugar and cinnamon is rare but acceptable seasoning as well, but those are better over rice and milk. You uppity types just don't appreciate quality 'merican cuisine. ;) I fixed Griesmeel for you as well. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 21:55, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::::::::::It's the texture that weirds me out about grits. Too...well, too gritty. I have had grits that I like, but it was so finely ground as to basically be corn cream, so I'm not sure it really counts. As I recall, it had sausage gravy with it, which was delicious. ] ]] 22:01, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
::::::::::::Then you probably would like ]. Same thing without any grinding. I like it drained, then fried in real butter. ] - ] ] <small><b>]</b></small> 23:28, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

== Redoing a deleted article ==

Dear Drmies, would it be possible to redo a little article on a retired now "emiritas" prof of economic history that you deleted. The old afd is here ] and my current version is here:].

Best wishes,(] (]) 12:41, 26 December 2012 (UTC))
*Hi Msranw, I'm sorry but the only difference I see is the addition of for that Cliometrics award--the rest is the same, down to the flag in the infobox (which should be removed). At any rate, you don't need ''my'' blessing to restore the article, but the problem is ]: any editor can slap that tag on it and right now I would have no choice but to delete it again. Other admins may feel differently--though honestly I don't see why. You will probably have to address the issues signaled at the AfD, ]. ] (]) 00:09, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

::Dear Drmies, thanks anyway. Perhaps I will try to introduce it later and see what happens. I had hoped the ''Clio Can'' might be the thing that makes a significant difference. To my mind anyway is a venerable retired old notable Economic Historian of the French Agricultural Revolution but my mind is obviously not enough! Best wishes anyway. (] (]) 08:38, 27 December 2012 (UTC))
:::The thing is, that was there already in the deleted version. A new version really needs to be a new version, significantly different. But you know what, there's smarter folks to ask: try DGG or even Randykitty. DGG is pretty nice, and Randykitty is pretty mean, and both of them know lots about those indices that were brought up at the AfD. Good luck with it, ] (]) 15:24, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:::: Thanks I'll leave it a bit - I think the I understand the indices OK - and can see he is marginal by that criteria - but when you have studied an area a bit (Econ Hist and Development) and think you know the notable people in it - it is funny when they don't get accepted perhaps by those who are going on metrics rather than on knowledge of specific content. No worries and best wishes (] (]) 10:42, 28 December 2012 (UTC))


{{ygm}} ] (]) 15:17, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
==Hollisz again==
*{{U|Yamla}}, yes--go for it. Thank you. ] (]) 17:14, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
On the ] front, ] has, once again, posted more "poor edits" and . These are the first two edits after coming off a 31 hour block by you. I will post this information to the SPI page and have alerted ] (the clerk on the SPI). - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 16:21, 26 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
*Yeah, DQ had a point at the SPI: no overlap, no abuse. Dianna blocked them for the same old thing again. ] (]) 23:42, 26 December 2012 (UTC)
**Yeah, I took them to AIV (per your previous instructions) and she gave a manual warning, the user continued, she blocked 'im. I figure we will see Hollisz back in 60 hours up to the same ol' tricks as before. - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 01:08, 27 December 2012 (UTC)</small>


== Tits or GTFO == == Just got back from a weekend trip ==


Where's your lovely pair of tits? I feel like life has lost all meaning...&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 22:51, 26 December 2012 (UTC) Is there something pressing I should be looking at this eve? ] (]) 01:39, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
*They're back. Now, excuse me while I pull . ] (]) 00:13, 27 December 2012 (UTC) *Haha I don't know. Can you make OSU ''and'' ND lose? I saw MidAtlanticBaby was at it again, yawn. ] (]) 01:40, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
**I saw the AN was protected from move. So somebody's active. I imagined today's DC stuff might create a bunch of new pages. I've been traveling all day and wanted to look around before I hit the sack. ] (]) 01:45, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
**Hmm, the Wikilawyers'll be after you in drove. "He didn't use rollback!"&nbsp;—&nbsp;] (]) 00:25, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
***''Evil chortle.'' As you were, as you were. —'''<font color=#232323>]</font><font color=#4F4F4F>]</font>''' 14:55, 27 December 2012 (UTC)


== Ye Guofu ==
== Help with vandal edit on ] ==


Thanks for catching that. It was a misclick. Things happen. ] (]) 20:38, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
Hello, doc! Someone has stuck in a stupid phrase ("singapore fucking sux !! they have no future !! singaporeans are total bitches !!!! sg sux !!! never go there") in between the topics at the bottom of the article. It's not visible when I try to edit the article itself, so it seems to be coming from elsewhere. I haven't been able to find it in the topic templates or anywhere else that is obvious (to me). Can you help? Thanks and a belated Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year! Cheers! ] ] 00:55, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
*Interesting. I was going to tell you I was going to look through the templates... well, I am doing that anyway. ] (]) 01:05, 27 December 2012 (UTC) *I caught something? Yeah, some awful bug--been coughing and wheezing and sweating for days now. {{U|Kudpung}}, how are you doing these days? I would love to see where you live. Time is running out, isn't it, for all of use. ] (]) 15:47, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
*Found it--after clicking through a bunch of templates I figured it might be a template in a template or something, and then found that was the fastest way. Problem is corrected. I wanna look at those templates, but it's dinnertime. Thanks Geoff, ] (]) 01:13, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
:And thanks - and now I know another way (too obvious so I missed it) to find these fiendish imps!. Just sitting down to a nice breast of turkey and a Zaca Mesa Viognier, myself. Enjoy your dinner and cheers, salut, slainte and prosit! ] ] 01:21, 27 December 2012 (UTC)


== Adam Lanza protection == == Article assistance ==


Well, given what you said above about being ill (sorry), I'm not sure you'll want to do this, but perhaps it would be a distraction. A new editor added unsourced material to ]. I left the editor a warning, and they re-added the material, this time with sources. The sources are unverifiable (by me at least), and there are various other issues, copy editing if nothing else, and I think you'd be much better than I at reviewing the material. My knowledge of long-deceased foreign epidemiologists is nil. Besides, articles about disease are not ideal for a hypochondriac. If not up to it or uninterested, I understand. Regardless, I hope you get better soon.--] (]) 18:57, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
I understand why this page was full-protected at the time given the mistaken identification of his brother as the perpetrator, but at this point there appears to be no reason for keeping the protection as Adam Lanza has been confirmed as the perpetrator. History tells us that individuals involved in spree killings of this magnitude will have enduring notability and be mentioned in detail for many years to come in scholarly papers and books. Already there is talk of .--] <sub>] ]</sub> 17:30, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
*I'm not a hypochondriac--in fact I'm an inveterate optimist, unfortunately. Yes, I'm ill, and I think I have some infection that's also making an infected tooth unbearably painful: I need this root canal done quickly, but everything here has ground down to a halt because of two inches of snow. ] (]) 21:14, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
*I didn't protect it because of identification issues. From the talk of the shooting article it seems clear to me that there is as much speculation and disagreement about him as there was about the shooting (at least initially). The section "Schitzophrenia claim" speaks volumes: I am not ready for us to have yet another article that needs constant supervision because of editors rushing to insert every bit of information filtered (or not) through the media. You are welcome to seek another venue, of course; perhaps a discussion (between administrators) at AN is a next step. Thank you, ] (]) 21:27, 27 December 2012 (UTC)
**Pretty normal in the South. I remember once being at work, a few flakes of snow fell from the sky, and there was a mad dash for the exit.--] (]) 21:20, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
***Yup. But this cold/flu/whatever I have delayed me: by the time I got to Blockbuster there were no copies of any of the ''Die Hard''s left. ] (]) 21:34, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
****Even when you're sick, you're funny.--] (]) 21:36, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
*****I do what I can on a budget, Bbb. So this guy was indeed a badass--I got a bunch more from the source that was already cited, but there should be English sources as well for someone like this, and I'll have a look--and polish up my Ukrainian. ] (]) 21:56, 22 January 2025 (UTC)


OK "badass" is not enough credit. He worked with ] during the ] which killed maybe 15 million people. Have a look at --I was confused because I didn't see a thumbnail, but this lengthy description accompanies a photo of him and Strong in full moon suits. Amazing. Can we use it? I'm about to plow through , and there's . These are just the first couple of hits; we need to do better. Talk page followers, get to work! Papa is actually sick! You shouldn't let him do all the work! ] (]) 22:04, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
== Could you or a friend handle this? ==


== Your AN request ==
]. You seem like someone with clue who isn't already involved in the debate. Thanks. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 03:27, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
*That's high praise. I'll have a look. ] (]) 03:30, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
*Sorry MBisanz. You are correct that I'm not involved in the debate, and one of the reasons is that it's a bit above my (intellectual) pay grade. Sorry, ] (]) 03:35, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
:*Haha, ok, thanks. ''']''' <sup>]</sup> 03:37, 28 December 2012 (UTC)


{{U|Voorts}} and I , ], and fell to the floor.-- ]<sup>]</sup> 23:54, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
== ] ==
*So who got the ten bucks? It's $10 for legal threats, right? ] (]) 23:58, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
**My standard retainer is $50K and your first born child. ] (]/]) 00:07, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
***Her retainer was only $5000. Are we talking about the same thing? ] (]) 00:13, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
****You get what you pay for. ] (]/]) 01:03, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
*****{{smalldiv|1=I'm not sure what we're talking about anymore. ] (]/]) 01:03, 23 January 2025 (UTC)}}
******I was talking about teeth... When I became admin we had a list of what kind of block was worth how much, with money transferred from the Foundation's San Francisco office via PayPal. I believe that well has dried up. ] (]) 01:16, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
*I just want to see what kind of letter these guys wrote and who they sent it to. ] (]/]) 23:58, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
**As a member of Drmies' legal team, I'll try to remember to send you a copy.-- ]<sup>]</sup> 00:02, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
***Shoot I got it all wrong: it's ]'s team who should be getting the letter. Seriously, I don't get it. I'm dealing with something similar at ]--first there's the edits made in complete ignorance of what we are and what we do. Then there's the combative responses and the complete lack of the editor reading what was actually said and linked. Then there's one or two or three more editors saying the same thing, and the persistence on the disruptor's part, and then it's over, and no one feels good about it. ] (]) 00:07, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
****As I understand the threats, it is clearly a case of ] ] &#124; <sup> ]</sup> 00:27, 23 January 2025 (UTC)


== Hayden Miller Productions/ActuallyHayden ==
I notice you closed ] because you were moving the article(s) to userspace. Would you be able to move ] as well? It was also included in the AfD. ]] (]) 08:28, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
*On a related subject: StAnselm, please read ] and see what you can do with ], a composer whose life and works are documented in quite a few other encyclopaedias. The situation of our not even having as informative an article {{oldid|Elizabeth_Maconchy|476001992|as we had in January 2012}}, let alone anything even approaching the quality of other encyclopaedias, thank to eight months of misapplication of content policy and a destructive rather than collaborative approach, is patently ridiculous. ] (]) 11:06, 28 December 2012 (UTC)
**Hey St Anselm--I'm sorry I missed that one. It was a tedious exercise, and it's only halfway done. Thank you Uncle for taking care of business. ] (]) 15:33, 28 December 2012 (UTC)


Hello - when I noticed , I opened an ] for these users, but I see now that you've already blocked both, so there might not be much point to the case. Is it helpful to keep the case open? And if not, is there a way for me to withdraw it? (I couldn't find a way to do that.) Thanks! ] (]) 01:46, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
==Hollisz/Zimmermannh1997, Part 2==
*Yeah, it's all too obvious, isn't it. Let me have a look and see what's best. Thanks, ] (]) 01:48, 23 January 2025 (UTC)
Well, looks like there is officially some crossover between the two named accounts and ]. What should I do? - <small style="white-space:nowrap;border:1px solid #900;padding:1px;">] • ] • 15:07, 28 December 2012 (UTC)</small>
*I've blocked both the IP and the Hollisz account for a month. Will you drop Dennis a note? He can make something out of the SPI now, maybe. ] (]) 15:31, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

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A barnstar for you!

The Original Barnstar
Happy New Year, Drmies! In 2024, other editors thanked you 1093 times using the thanks tool on the English Misplaced Pages. This made you the #11 most thanked Wikipedian in 2024. Congratulations and, well, thank you for all that you do for Misplaced Pages. Here's to 2025! Mz7 (talk) 19:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)
story · music · places

Advice needed

How can I convince user:Sky258 that, per WP:AIRPORT-CONTENT, airport connections need independent sources? Nearly all his/her additions are unsourced and reverted. Warnings did not help but blocking seems over the top. Do you have any ideas? The Banner talk 17:46, 3 January 2025 (UTC)

CS1 error on B. J. Hollars

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CS1 error on B. J. Hollars

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User:Pinzunski/User:SukunaZenin

Returned to Francisco Trincão AGAIN, with that nonsensical ref about a BENFICA match for a SPORTING championship win (reverted it on the spot)! I guess the rest can stay (should you see that the sources are appropriate, if not remove it), will duly compose it (i.e. Style of play section) when i get home.

Attentively RevampedEditor (talk) 19:44, 9 January 2025 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 66

The Misplaced Pages Library: Books & Bytes
Issue 66, November – December 2024

  • Les Jours and East View Press join the library
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Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Misplaced Pages Library team --17:32, 10 January 2025 (UTC)

Banned cease-and-desist photographer

I am really frazzled now. Someone is reverting edits by a user claimed to be a "Banned cease-and-desist photographer". I can not find any trace of that. You should expect some traces of that on ENWP, Meta or Commons, but no.

Do you (or your stalkers) know anything about this? It sounds a bit fishy to me right now. The Banner talk 14:26, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

(stalker comment) I don't really have anything conclusive to add, but from what I see, the user who uploaded the images is not banned or even warned from either enwiki or Commons. He appears to be a professional photographer who uploads many of his images to commons, and then Misplaced Pages, replacing lower-quality existing ones if necessary (I guess there is a small chance its all a big copyright misuse but you'd have thought that would have been picked up upon, particularly as his work involves famous buildings and peopel so probably gets a lot of views). You can see on his talk page there is a message from an IP user in 2019 (who stopped editing in the same year) regarding 'excessive use of own images'. I'm unsure if any such rule actually exists, but in my opinion it was not applicable anyway as the use of the images improved the site, were not self-promotional in terms of including watermarks or anything to overtly identify the contributor, and was not excessive proliferation of photos within individual articles. The reverting user has only made 92 edits, half of which were reverting the photographer today. Not sure why they would even take this course of action, expect perhaps they noticed an image (one of their own?) replaced by the photographer editor, read their talk page, decided the 2019 message was something official and unilaterally decided it justified reverting all recent additions (in the same style as the 2019 user, which is suspicious too). Crowsus (talk) 17:45, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
Crowsus, thank you for doing some of that leg work--I had looked at various things but managed to miss that IP comment. And that IP comment: well, "excessive" use is a thing frowned upon but you laid out the (common sense) practices pretty neatly; thank you for that as well. Drmies (talk) 18:08, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
{{tps}} That photographer's license terms seem to take a strict position on the exact way credit must be given in off-wiki uses of their work. I'm not sure if they have pursued settlements against good-faith reusers or in other ways headed into license-trolling. I, like others, cannot find discussion about it on enwiki or commons.There was a previous case (long ago, different license-holder) where consensus formed that the effect of mass use of a certain creator's content on-wiki was to induce innocent/good-faith but not "strictly by the not-quite-expected license terms" use off-wiki, enabling forced legal settlements. There was thought that the creator themself was actually intentional about using wiki in this way, and that all of this exceeded the community's tolerance and good-faith. DMacks (talk) 18:02, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
DMacks, yes, thanks--I remember a case too and I think it played out on Commons, that guy who posted videos of himself ejaculating and stuff, and there was a guy who sucked his own ****. But more to the point, I also remember a case of a photographer who, it was judged, was basically here to promote their own business and I think an ANI post led to removal of some of those images. But I can't see what practical guidelines User:Arne Müseler is supposed to have broken. Drmies (talk) 18:10, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
I have no idea if there is off-wiki evidence of actual legal actions against re-users, or claims that WP sites are inducement. But I also assume anything I'd find by googling I couldn't mention here for OUTING anyway. DMacks (talk) 18:15, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
Yep, and any kind of case should be either discussed on-wiki or submitted privately if there's some privacy concern, rather than signaled (if that's even the word) with a boilerplate and vague edit summary. Drmies (talk) 18:18, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
User:The Banner, I have reverted those edits. Thanks for bringing it up. Drmies (talk) 18:13, 13 January 2025 (UTC)
Your welcome. I hope the editor just made a mistake. The Banner talk 02:43, 14 January 2025 (UTC)
For every one who's interested, please see User talk:RAL1028. Drmies (talk) 21:42, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

Just to clarify posts on Miijumaaru talk page

The conversation I pinged you in at Annoyed at rule changes was a continuation of the post right above at Please do not use template main in the lead. The editor broke it into two parts for some reason and I wasn't about to correct the nesting issue since the conversation turned turbulent. Since they did multiple changes to articles I thought it would be good to let them know that {{main}} is never used in the lead per the template itself. This was made aware to Tennis Project awhile back and several of us have been slowly fixing tennis articles to comply. A daunting task. I hope this helps you understand the situation I encountered. Fyunck(click) (talk) 20:01, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

On a side note to above template talk

While template "main" should not be used in the lead, the template "further" is less clear on placement. I just looked and the template "see also" also says not to use in the lead and is used only at the top of sections. "Further" says nothing about placement and I can't help but wonder if that should also say not to use in the lead. Where best to bring that up? On the narrow Template:Further talk page? Or is there a more general template talk page that it should be talked about? Thanks. Fyunck(click) (talk) 20:18, 13 January 2025 (UTC)

AfD sock

There's something seriously wrong with OhNoKaren. The account is about a week old, and she's already created many AfDs. That's pretty much all she's done. I vaguely remember some deletion socks, although I don't recall that they had problems with the procedure as she does. Even if she's not a sock, I'm thinking her editing is disruptive enough to block, but I have to go eat dinner. Can you check if you're still around?--Bbb23 (talk) 01:59, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

The Editor's Barnstar
Thank you for helping reduce the use of "served as", "serves as" and such like for what are not public service roles. In those two examples, "was" and "is" would be preferable (this last sentence is obviously not for your benefit, but might help someone else who reads this). Edwardx (talk) 12:21, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
  • I appreciate that--but I'm even stricter than you are: I think it's almost always a euphemism for "work"... Drmies (talk) 13:00, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
    • Thanks. I would like to be stricter, but encounter too much pushback from other editors. I think at most it should only be for unpaid, genuinely altruistic activity. As an example, and without wishing too be too cynical, far too many politicians are self-serving. And of course, we need to take into account that some reliable sources often still use the term for state sector jobs, military and politicians. Perhaps once it is removed from more business bios, we can start an RfC. Edwardx (talk) 14:20, 16 January 2025 (UTC)
      • Edwardx, thanks--I thought I'd be careful, since I didn't want to butt heads with you after you sent me this nice message, but I agree with you completely. If you get paid, it's not service. If you get underpaid, it might approach service--but if you are underpaid and still make a fair amount of money (like, for instance, as president of the US), "service" is a bit of a euphemism. As far as reliable sources go--yeah, but in "serve as president" the operational part is "president", not "serve". I teach at a state university: is this service? I like to think so, for various reasons, but it's ludicrous to pretty much equate that with philanthropy (another item we see in ALL those articles), as if it didn't come with a paycheck and possibly health insurance. No Christmas bonuses, of course. Drmies (talk) 16:16, 16 January 2025 (UTC)

Silicon Slopes

Thanks for your edits at Silicon Slopes. I had prepared this for a COI report, but was waiting for that editor's response:

  • On November 30, 2023, that editor stated here: "this account is not a business account, anyone using this account will be doing so with direct supervision of the account owner, ie. I will be standing behind them any time the login is used".
  • That editor then made a number of edits at Silicon Slopes that removed content sourced by secondary sources, and added content of a promotional tone, sourced by primary sources.
  • That editor wrote a lengthy declaration of their purpose on the article talk page, stating, "I kindly request that any changes avoid undermining the hard work and dedication of many business owners and community members who have strived tirelessly to erase the stigma and stereotypes associated with the region."
  • A Google search of "invise" and "Mike L." adds depth.

Certainly seems like a single-purpose editor trying to cleanse the article of well-sourced negative content. Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 12:05, 18 January 2025 (UTC)

  • Oh, I feel the same way. Did you see what they tried to post on your talk page? See the filter log. But the problem with the article (I'm sure you saw my pruning) is, in my opinion, much bigger than just that. The negative information isn't about that organization, as far as I could tell from that confusing article. But they're p-blocked from the article now; who knows, maybe they'll figure out how to gain consensus for anything on the talk page. I will reiterate that the argument "it's negative stuff and it shows up in a search" is completely inappropriate here. Drmies (talk) 17:30, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
I'll try to add some well-sourced content back to the article. Cheers. Magnolia677 (talk) 17:38, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
Sure. You think, Magnolia677, the subject is notable, that organization? Cause all I see in a quick search is some promotional BS. It may be better to consider treating it as an economical "ecosystem". Drmies (talk) 17:44, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
Wait. I'm wrong: I should have figured that there was more in the history, including a lot of you. The article was about a region and for now I'm going to go back to this version; hope that's okay with you. Then we can take it from there. Drmies (talk) 17:48, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
This is where it got messed up. Drmies (talk) 17:54, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
Utah's tech community has been nicknamed Silicon Slopes, a reference to California's world famous Silicon Valley high tech commnity.
— Sanders, Doug; Herrington, Lisa M.; Waring, Kerry Jones (2015). "Making a Living". Utah: Third Edition. It's My State! (3rd ed.). Cavendish Square Publishing. p. 73. ISBN 9781627131780.
Increasingly a growing technology sector—the so-called Silicon Slopes—has developed around the Salt Lake–Utah County line.
— Brown, Adam R. (2018). Utah Politics and Government: American Democracy Among a Unique Electorate. Politics and Governments of the American States. University of Nebraska Press. p. 48. ISBN 9781496207852.
In Utah Valley, the coinage "Silicon Slopes," invented by Google in 2013 upon announcing that Provo would be the third city in the nation to receive a Google Fiber network, has been picked up eagerly by business leaders
— Farmer, Jared (2014). Alter, J. Cecil (ed.). "THIS WAS THE PLACE: The Making and Unmaking of Utah" (PDF). Utah Historical Quarterly. 82 (3). Utah State Historical Society: 188. doi:10.2307/45063063.

The non-advertorial independent sources strongly disagree with that first paragraph, Doktoro. Personally, I am inclined to take the word of the Walter H. Annenberg Professor of History at the University of Pennsylvania published in a state historical society journal over what is said in a self-published corporate blurb. Uncle G (talk) 07:42, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

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Yamla (talk) 15:17, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

Just got back from a weekend trip

Is there something pressing I should be looking at this eve? BusterD (talk) 01:39, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

Ye Guofu

Thanks for catching that. It was a misclick. Things happen. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 20:38, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

  • I caught something? Yeah, some awful bug--been coughing and wheezing and sweating for days now. Kudpung, how are you doing these days? I would love to see where you live. Time is running out, isn't it, for all of use. Drmies (talk) 15:47, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Article assistance

Well, given what you said above about being ill (sorry), I'm not sure you'll want to do this, but perhaps it would be a distraction. A new editor added unsourced material to Danylo Zabolotny. I left the editor a warning, and they re-added the material, this time with sources. The sources are unverifiable (by me at least), and there are various other issues, copy editing if nothing else, and I think you'd be much better than I at reviewing the material. My knowledge of long-deceased foreign epidemiologists is nil. Besides, articles about disease are not ideal for a hypochondriac. If not up to it or uninterested, I understand. Regardless, I hope you get better soon.--Bbb23 (talk) 18:57, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

  • I'm not a hypochondriac--in fact I'm an inveterate optimist, unfortunately. Yes, I'm ill, and I think I have some infection that's also making an infected tooth unbearably painful: I need this root canal done quickly, but everything here has ground down to a halt because of two inches of snow. Drmies (talk) 21:14, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

OK "badass" is not enough credit. He worked with Richard P. Strong during the Third plague pandemic which killed maybe 15 million people. Have a look at this here--I was confused because I didn't see a thumbnail, but this lengthy description accompanies a photo of him and Strong in full moon suits. Amazing. Can we use it? I'm about to plow through the "First Report of the North Manchurian Plague Prevention Service", and there's this article. These are just the first couple of hits; we need to do better. Talk page followers, get to work! Papa is actually sick! You shouldn't let him do all the work! Drmies (talk) 22:04, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Your AN request

Voorts and I ran through the door at the same time, bonked heads, and fell to the floor.-- Ponyo 23:54, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

Hayden Miller Productions/ActuallyHayden

Hello - when I noticed this edit, I opened an SPI case for these users, but I see now that you've already blocked both, so there might not be much point to the case. Is it helpful to keep the case open? And if not, is there a way for me to withdraw it? (I couldn't find a way to do that.) Thanks! Wburrow (talk) 01:46, 23 January 2025 (UTC)

User talk:Drmies: Difference between revisions Add topic