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Right, that's enough for now. I’ll be back. Right, that's enough for now. I’ll be back.
{{reflist-talk}} ] (]) 20:35, 9 June 2023 (UTC) {{reflist-talk}} ] (]) 20:35, 9 June 2023 (UTC)

:The rationale for my changes is above, {{reply|119.157.101.51}}. You have not advanced a single argument, whether relating to Misplaced Pages policy or the substance of the changes, to the effect that my changes amount to 'vandalism' or should otherwise be reverted. The only action approaching vandalism is that of reverting without discussion after an explicit invitation to above; as ] says, {{tq|o help other editors understand the reasoning behind your edits, always explain your changes in the edit summary. '''If an edit is too complex to explain in an edit summary, or the change is contentious, add a section to the talk page that explains your rationale. Be prepared to justify your changes to other editors on the talk page. If you are reverted, continue to explain yourself'''; do not start an edit war.}}
:I note that the user {{replyto|Fiction2Facts}} also displays the habit of reverting ‘vandalism’ (whether ‘mala-fideditors must not use alternative accounts to mislead, deceive, disrupt, or undermine consensus. This includes, but is not limited to…ontributing to the same page or discussion with multiple accounts}} (]). If this pattern continues, I shall submit a checkuser request. ] (]) 21:53, 11 June 2023 (UTC)

Revision as of 21:53, 11 June 2023

Good articlesIshaq Dar has been listed as one of the Social sciences and society good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.
Review: June 19, 2017. (Reviewed version).
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Missing Background & Early Life

This article does not discuss any early life, childhood and background of the person. Even his father name is not mentioned in a single time. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 119.152.36.109 (talk) 16:06, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

Bias

This article is ridiculously biased in favour of Dar and his policies. "leading financial-cum-economic expert", "From his enviable educational record to professional acumen, and from his peerless political career to holding various important portfolios, Senator Dar stands out par excellence", "Dar was once again called upon to rescue the nose-diving economy". And those are just the lede. I don't know very much about Dar and his work in Pakistani politics but this is really clearly over the line. Therequiembellishere (talk) 18:42, 10 June 2013 (UTC)

These are simply excerpts from Dar's published profile in the Senate Newsletter. But coming from your point of view; totally understand where its coming from. Will try not to duplicate the published profile into main content and try to keep it neutral. Thanks for your input.Pakistani88 (talk) 08:21, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
If you dont know much then do your research. No one is stopping you to add any controversial reported material on Dar. Make a new heading "Controversies" and list them with references. writing only the positive does not make it wrong or bias. And for God sake stop removing the political offices, "plethora of minor unneeded offices" are NOT MINOR. Clearly Federal Commerce Minister and Leader of the Opposition in the Upper House of a country is NOT MINOR. Its just good information for people to know; why does it bother you! I dont want to get into an edit fight with you so just make useful contributions! I left you a message on your talk page but clearly you just ignore!Pakistani88 (talk) 16:26, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
I agree, Ishaq Dar is a credible man. Writing facts with references does not make it bias! The more information there is, the better! Dude the political offices are at the bottom, no one even looks there! leave it as is! Economicchange (talk) 16:44, 11 June 2013 (UTC)
I agree with Therequiembellishere; terms like "leading financial-cum-economic expert", "called upon to rescue the nose-diving economy of Pakistan" and "tenure was unfortunately cut short" should be converted to "leading financial-cum-economic expert", "called upon to rescue the nose-diving economy of Pakistan" and "tenure was unfortunately cut short". These are all words that are not allowed under the WP:PEACOCK guidelines. Therefore, I put up a Peacock template on the article context — Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 08:07, 22 December 2013 (UTC)
I have fixed the article's lead and a few paragraphs in the article. There are still quite a lot of issues with the article and I would be fixing them later. I urge authors and editors to not just straight-forwardly undo the revisions and first discuss why they are not happy with the edits – Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 06:54, 23 December 2013 (UTC)
Fixed the article in its entirety. — Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 02:03, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Plagiarised content

This article features content from various news stories in the papers and are a stark example of blatant plagiarism, thereby violating the WP:PLAG guidelines. Article content must not be copy-pasted from various URLs but need to be written in a comprehensive manner usually including citations to those sources in that particular context. If there is no change in the text and if the article is not correctly resolved, there would be no better way than to delete this information in its entirety. — Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 08:26, 22 December 2013 (UTC)

I have taken out all the copyvio content from the page. Most of it was not even related to the Ishaq Dar but the fiscal budget. — Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 01:55, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

Consistent vandalism

This article has been receiving its fair share of vandalised content. This cannot be tolerated under Misplaced Pages guidelines. I might just request for this page to be protected if the vandalism continues. Meanwhile, we will stick with this revision until things settle down — Arun Zaheeruddin (talk) 23:14, 16 March 2014 (UTC)

Birth year

Dawn (newspaper) has at some point been used as a source for Dar having been born in 1950. User:Mewulwe objects to this, saying that the 1950 date has been in the Misplaced Pages article since 2009, that the Dawn article cited was published after this, and that Dawn's reputation is such that it is most likely that the article merely took the year from the Misplaced Pages article.

Dawn (newspaper) has been discussed at WP:RSN before.

How do people feel about whether this birth year should be accepted based on this evidence, or not? MPS1992 (talk) 20:27, 15 October 2016 (UTC)

Actually I'm not expressing a particular opinion about Dawn. I don't know any newspaper that could be trusted not to use Misplaced Pages. This happens all the time. The probability that such sourcing would be circular is certainly significant enough, therefore what's needed is either a source predating the original Misplaced Pages addition, or an official or primary one (a personal site of his, a government or parliament site, etc.). Besides, is it common in Pakistan to be at university at age 16? http://www.senate.gov.pk/en/profile.php?uid=765 says "Senator Dar has had renowned institutions among his alma maters, including Government College (now Government College University), Lahore, and Hailey College of Commerce, University of Punjab, Lahore (1966-69)." Mewulwe (talk) 02:03, 16 October 2016 (UTC)
User:Mewulwe: This report by PILDAT says Dar was born 13 May 1950, I wonder if repot of PILDAT is reliable enough to cite here? --Saqib (talk) 09:31, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
No. You can see for other persons they give citations even for a birth date, not for Ishaq Dar. Practically certain they took that from Misplaced Pages. Mewulwe (talk) 09:44, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
@Mewulwe: You need to understand that we've plenty of RS which states Dar was born in 1950 so I object to your removal because Misplaced Pages:Verifiability, not truth. --Saqib (talk) 10:21, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
Doesn't apply. Potential circular RS don't verify anything. If he was actually born in 1950 and someone was able to add this in 2009, there would have to be a pre-2009 source. When all available sources are from after that time, it is almost certain these sources took it from Misplaced Pages. Mewulwe (talk) 10:30, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
Misplaced Pages:Verifiability applies. I found at least three RS which states he was born in 1950. --Saqib (talk) 11:22, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
Any such fact that is in Misplaced Pages for a certain length of time WILL appear in multiple "reliable sources." If Misplaced Pages itself is the oldest source to be found, it must be considered the origin of the others. Mewulwe (talk) 15:07, 10 September 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 15 December 2016

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.

Copyright image removed

(talk) 06:23, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

 Not done you have not made a request, but I have removed the image you linked to as it was a copyright violation - Arjayay (talk) 08:49, 15 December 2016 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 13 August 2017

This edit request has been answered. Set the |answered= or |ans= parameter to no to reactivate your request.
Frankmister2 (talk) 17:00, 13 August 2017 (UTC)FM2
Not done: it's not clear what changes you want to be made. Please mention the specific changes in a "change X to Y" format. DRAGON BOOSTER ★ 17:04, 13 August 2017 (UTC)

Bias

Is it just me or is the editing on this page pretty biased? No references to the corruption cases against him, including ongoing ones. No reference to the collapse of the Pakistani currency under his time as Finance Minister, Crickharte (talk) 17:03, 29 March 2023 (UTC)

Puffery

I’ve made a few recent changes.

  1. businessman & investor—ampersands? really?
  2. veteran is puffery.
  3. a philanthropist mainly focused on child welfare & protection—more ampersands, and not everything belongs in the lede on pain of imbalance. Indeed, the lede is already crowded; cut ‘former member of the National Assembly’ and former ministerial posts too.
  4. Born in 1950 and grew up in Lahore, Dar was educated—did an illiterate write this?
  5. He was highly regarded for his innovative, prudent & fastidious financial management, discipline and control in the corporate world resulting in cost-savings & improved bottom-lines. The same was noticed & admired by the royal families of Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain, etc. He was soon advising the royal families on large-scale investments & business ventures across the globe to their advantage.—more poorly written puffery! And it wasn’t even in the source.
  6. making him one of the most prolific men of crises and decision-makers in the country; when it came to macroeconomic issues, balance of payment crises, energy security, bilateral & multilateral debts, food security, diplomatic crises, parliamentary politics and international disputes settlements for Pakistan.—incoherent. Some of these sources don’t even mention Dar.
  7. In March 2018, he was re-elected to the Senate of Pakistan as the returning senator from Punjab on a technocrat seat and the Election Commission of Pakistan (ECP) has also reversed the suspension of his victory notification and restored his victory notification on 9 January 2023. It suffices to mention this in the body of the article; the lede need only state that he has been a senator since 2003.
  8. Interestingly, Nawaz Sharif had been his batch mate at Government College University Lahore from 1964 to 1966.—no need for synthesis.
  9. He was one of the youngest Pakistanis at the time to have passed the esteemed professional qualification.—more hagiography.
  10. and, since then he has remained one of closest aides of Nawaz Sharif & a key federal cabinet member of Nawaz Sharif in all of his three governments.—nearly criminally vague.
  11. Later on, in the first government of Shehbaz Sharif; the 23rd Prime Minister of Pakistan.…what does it mean? &c
  12. After receiving recognition at the national level in 1990 for his suggestions on provincial & federal government budgets, he became the top advisor to Nawaz Sharif on monetary, fiscal, taxation, industrial, trade and national debt management. Is this a joke? I was beginning to tire of having to read these sources until I noticed the rather amusing use made of this source.
  13. Ishaq Dar also facilitated Sharif Family to obtain a PKR 100 million line of credit, under the Islamic finance principles of Modarba; which is a special kind of partnership where one partner gives money to another for investing in a commercial enterprise. Not in source. Also, if this is entirely innocuous, why is it even encyclopædic to mention a minor business arrangement?

Right, that's enough for now. I’ll be back.

References

  1. Peshimam, Gibran Naiyyar (2022-12-13). "Pakistan expecting Saudi financial help – finance minister". Reuters. Retrieved 2023-04-01.
  2. "Multilateral donors assure Pakistan of support". The Express Tribune. 2022-10-16. Retrieved 2023-04-01.
  3. Desk, BR Web (2023-01-04). "Saudi Arabia expected to beef up its deposits in Pakistan: Ishaq Dar". Brecorder. Retrieved 2023-02-11. {{cite web}}: |last= has generic name (help)
  4. Akbar, Agha (2018-04-16). "Why Ishaq Dar deserves bouquets and not brickbats". Profit by Pakistan Today. Retrieved 2023-02-15.
  5. Report, Recorder (2023-02-10). "Cabinet approves rules, regulations for corporate farming under CPEC". Brecorder. Retrieved 2023-02-11.
  6. Reporter, The Newspaper's Staff (2022-01-11). "ECP restores Ishaq Dar's victory notification as Senator". Dawn. Pakistan. Retrieved 2023-01-23.
  7. ^ Farooq, Asad (2 February 2017). "What did Ishaq Dar 'confess' to during the Hudaibiya Paper Mills reference in 2000?". DAWN. Archived from the original on 27 November 2017. Retrieved 28 November 2017.
  8. Shahbaz Rana (14 May 2013). "Right man for the job?: Senator Ishaq Dar tipped to be next finance ministe". The Express Tribune. Archived from the original on 29 October 2016. Retrieved 7 October 2016.{{cite news}}: CS1 maint: bot: original URL status unknown (link)
  9. Shahzad, Asif (2022-09-28). "New Pakistan finance minister vows to tame inflation and cut interest rates". Reuters. Retrieved 2023-02-21.
  10. "Pakistan's Sharif picks Dar as finance minister to revive economy". Reuters. 2013-05-13. Retrieved 2023-02-21.

Docentation (talk) 20:35, 9 June 2023 (UTC)

The rationale for my changes is above, @119.157.101.51:. You have not advanced a single argument, whether relating to Misplaced Pages policy or the substance of the changes, to the effect that my changes amount to 'vandalism' or should otherwise be reverted. The only action approaching vandalism is that of reverting without discussion after an explicit invitation to above; as WP:RCD says, o help other editors understand the reasoning behind your edits, always explain your changes in the edit summary. If an edit is too complex to explain in an edit summary, or the change is contentious, add a section to the talk page that explains your rationale. Be prepared to justify your changes to other editors on the talk page. If you are reverted, continue to explain yourself; do not start an edit war.
I note that the user @Fiction2Facts: also displays the habit of reverting ‘vandalism’ (whether ‘mala-fideditors must not use alternative accounts to mislead, deceive, disrupt, or undermine consensus. This includes, but is not limited to…ontributing to the same page or discussion with multiple accounts (WP:ILLEGIT). If this pattern continues, I shall submit a checkuser request. Docentation (talk) 21:53, 11 June 2023 (UTC)
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