Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 16:21, 18 August 2007

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Fair use on the main page

Just wanted to let you know a debate about fair use images on the main page has erupted again Talk:Main Page#Fair use image on the main page?. Since your removal of the scobby doo image () often comes up in discussion, thought you might be interested Nil Einne 13:19, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Please. We have an edit war going on over today's featured article otherwise. As you can guess, everyone involved is an administrator, some of long standing. It's embarrassing. --AnonEMouse 17:34, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

The edit war thankfully eventually died down but the debate has now moved to Misplaced Pages talk:Non-free content criteria exemptions#TFA/Main Page exemption, revisited if you're still interested Nil Einne 01:49, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for chiming in with your views, Jimbo — it's greatly appreciated. However, what would be really useful would be if you could go into a little detail about the reasoning behind your opinion. How is the Main Page different from article space? Aren't there some subjects — such as paintings — in which the encyclopedic value of including an image is so great that it supercedes the "free content" mission? The discussion at Talk:Main Page yesterday shows that a lot of Wikipedians believe that such subjects do exist. If you want to change that view, it would be extremely helpful if you could elaborate on your statement. Thank you very much. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 17:00, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

I'll second Josiah's question. Is your concern a legal one, or something else? ←Ben 13:55, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

Still no answer on this, as far as I can see. A few interesting points have been made at Misplaced Pages talk:Non-free content criteria exemptions#Jimbo's view, including the idea that the front page is part of Misplaced Pages's marketing, not part of our educational mission. I'd be very interested to see if Jimbo agrees with this assessment, and to understand his position better. —Josiah Rowe (talk • contribs) 03:47, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Appearnce on TV

Mr. Wales,

I saw you talking on CSPAN-2 the other day at what appeared to be a Commonwealth Club dialogue. I wanted to comment that you appeared very articulate and added a very personal touch to the rules on Misplaced Pages that many people unaccustomed to Misplaced Pages might find aggravating. It would be really nice if everyone understood the purpose of the rules and the mindset of editing Misplaced Pages as well as you. I hope you continue to work to make Misplaced Pages the way you envision it. 68.97.41.118 04:47, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

There's an idea: an introduction video for noobs, that might help. ←Ben 05:58, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

We already have a tutorial. People just don't give a damn --Lucid 07:09, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm sure it gets a lot of traffic, being linked from {{welcome}}, but I'm also sure more people would watch Jimbo read it than would click all those tabs, especially if there were illustrative screenshot animations. Without examples, Misplaced Pages:Tutorial is too inaccessible. ←Ben 07:21, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

If the video is too long though, I'm sure new users would be equally opposed to spending their time with it - no offense Jimbo, but that's what I can see happening. Lradrama 14:28, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages ia already sufficiently frustrating for those of us with no choice but to have dial-up accounts. Adding videos that are "required reading", as it were, or even adding videos at all, will drive away any user located outside of a major urban centre or too poor to afford the cable or high-speed options. If you want to link to videos off-wiki, go to. Just, please, don't incorporate them into[REDACTED] in anyway that makes viewing compulsory for understanding, or downloading compulsory for any reason. Bielle 15:20, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I agree, though, that a simple introductory video might be very nice. Certainly it could never be compulsory for a thousand different reasons. But a video can convey some of the sense of human emotion, of the sense that we are a charitable loving project of people trying to do something good in life, in a more direct way than text.--Jimbo Wales 19:09, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, you have a good point there. But it must only be a smallish one for all the reasons given in thus discussion. I'd also like to say that I really feel for users like Bielle who have to use dial-up connection, although I now use broadband, I used to have to put up with dial-up - it's horrible, it really is. Slow and expensive and unreliable. I hated it. Lradrama 19:13, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

(conflict)If you are in favor of it, then let's move forward with logistics. Where, when, who, etc... I think it would probably be easiest to do during a wiki-meetup. We probably would want to script it, and maybe we could have different wikipedians talk about different aspects of wikipedia. Suggestions/volunteers? —Cronholm 19:18, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages spinjobs.

What would you say to people (mainly, companies) that edit their Misplaced Pages articles to support their opinion, such as discussed here on SlashDot? I can think of how I'd tell them not to ("When word of it gets out , it will harm your PR far more than help it"), but I'd like to hear your opinion Lucid 03:48, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

It's against both WP:NPOV and not recommended by WP:COI and WP:AUTO. I assume it would be treated like standard spam or promotion, and reverted/removed. Matt/TheFearow (Talk) (Contribs) (Bot) 01:39, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm well aware that it breaks numerous policies, I'm curious about Jimbo's opinion on (major) companies that do this. --Lucid 03:48, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Corporations and individuals will edit here to enhance their public image. Das Ende, The end, Finet. 219.146.250.203 05:06, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for that insightful opinion, Jimbo-in-China-and-not-logged-in-for-some-reason! --Lucid 12:56, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if the Great Firewall will stay down after he leaves. ←Ben 00:23, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

It's worth noting that a company (or its representatives) editing their own article doesn't necessarily violate WP:NPOV (though it certainly represents a clear conflict of interest). It's possible for a company rep to write in a manner that is clear, factual, and balanced. It's important that we not confuse the need for our writing to conform to NPOV (as required by policy) with a need for all editors to hold or believe in a NPOV (if such a thing is even possible). TenOfAllTrades(talk) 10:57, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Which has what to do with the price of tea in China? I pretty clearly said to support their opinion in my first post, which is the issue here. I don't think anyone cares about someone Wikignoming their own article, Diebold removing criticisms from their article or Wal-Mart changing criticisms to seem like good things are very interesting situations, and I'd like to hear Jimbo's opinion on the corporations that do this, and what he would say to them if he could --Lucid 12:56, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Reminder: Your friendly intervention

We refer now to our last Issue to our topic and kindly remind to look what happened meanwhile to our reprimands to Demanding fairness for thousands dissidents, apologizing bad English of Germans (decades out of experiences and effects of my personal impedance). We kindly ask you to involve a bit elder more fair and serious acting user, mainly able to see unfairness and real censorship by admins consistently violating themselves especially WP:NOR by defending bare opinions priory put in articles shown as only one bad example (also ground for our actions, copied from original article Tired light) as seen in section in

Unfair administrators support of - here even prior to all - depreciating opinions of redactors to a theory

One evidence only how Wiki-admins themselves violate WP-RULES especially themselves WP:NOR in a related article, then to see how we tried in vain IP-hunted (proved by prior confession of admin) to correct that behaviours. We took instead seriously pure linked citations: At first taking official PNAS-papers, then citations of Feynman to blame - as here objected - such prior depreciating opinions in our related erased section Tired light in Fritz Zwicky by well known facts: Transparent matter as glass neither blur nor scatter, citing Feynman, resumed: It cannot be understood. We felt that Big bang proponents chased and erased us (they already formerly did so, we heard) and the acting Admin quasi confessed how he really did search us by falsely meaning that this is a WIKI-consent.

You can easily see that and how answers to clear fixed main topics are prevented (admin fleeing like a slippery snake?). It would be helpful if an "old physicist" could help instead of here claimed as sole valid "the mainstream" or "modern physics" and their proponents - sorry for us like more or less bad "modern clothes". We prefer an old good wine and need especially a more serious acting reader, an in serious redactions skilled, qualified user to interfere. Acting admin claims CONTROL ABOUT HIS PAGE; many evidences to prove rather poor admin's qualification are (in danger to be) erased.

Because evidences are furthermore erased I personally ask you to take my last version as shown in ] DeepBlueDiamond 12:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Does anyone understand what the request, complaint, or desired outcome is here? ←Ben 00:18, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Please look the first link. It is the same as the now second link, but it goes directly to the top of all instead. It is the last link now put to the top instead. 84.158.202.58 03:48, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes. He wants people to stop reverting the WP:POV and errors in physics that he keeps inserting into physics pages. He wants people to stop being so brutally insulting as to suggest that his insertions might be in any kind of conflict with[REDACTED] guidelines or with basic physics. He also wants to counteract the flood of errors and distortions being put about by modern physicists who show their ignorance and bias by thinking his ideas are in conflict with basic physics. He thinks anybody who reverts his edits is an administrator and acting falsely. (I think acting falsely means daring to suggest that he doesn't understand basic physics.) He uses a dynamic IP cluster, and is hugely offended that anyone (me, as it turns out) would go to the trouble of checking for edits in the IP range 84.158.*.*, or mentioning this IP range at the WikiProject Physics discussion page as a source of many errors in basic physics.

In all seriousness, my own personal judgment here is highly suspect, as over the last two weeks or so I have spent an inordinate amount of time trying to communicate with this editor, and suggest some of the reasons that his edits nearly always get reverted in short order by the next passing physicist who happens to notice the many errors in basic physics and English grammar he is adding. —Duae Quartunciae (talk · cont) 08:23, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

False pretentions continue:

* Errors in English, you're right! Sorry, we demanded help, not got. People like you should communicate in French, Spanish, German (partly Latin, Sweedish etc.). You pretended by no abilities in German e.g.: EN.WIKI says the same to photon's mass like DE.WIKI. You only contradicted by principle vehemently without any abilities in German (or in the matter). Then you was introduced in German: Both WIKI say the contrary! How can you realize old German physicists you need to reproduce something correctly? Learn to read seriously, then basic physics, not pretending only to know anything (reading makes no understanding). You are neither graduated in at least a similar matter but dare to reprimand serious knowledge of our old Fr. Professor, Dres.-physics and Univ.-graduated people. Some of them indirectly tried to teach you in vain to both a bit, linked. - Such behaviour of laymen is named hubris, ok?

* What would it matter - if really true (you could not prove only one) - to have perhaps even some little defects in physics?

* Much better than to need some (ten, until 30) "mysteries" for (your?) "modern physics" named Big Bang (BB). You confirmed at least: Dark energy needs a real "mystery"!

* Must physicists fulfil the bible confirming how God produced a Big bang, "there will be light and there was light" (we link following Original Big Bang section again to show that BB is mainly founded by the support of many religions, e.g how glad Pope Pius XII was)? Only a real God could make from nothing everything and a BB (by violating his own physics?), ok? Dobson meant this and reminded one little of many additional problems: How could time begin within a Schwarzschild radius of super-super-massive compressed BB if time stops at the Schwarzschild-radius of a black hole with much less super-gravity. He teach you at least real physics instead of all mysteries you need...

* In BB opposing articles dominate in Wiki pure OPINIONS of redactors (users, admins, e.g.: None-BB-physics are no more valid, obsolate, overruled by BB)! Meanwhile such impertinence is found even in prior sections. Shall such opinions induce pupils, students, laymen and experts by depreciating at first any non-BB-matter already by principle? That is WP:NOR supported by admins!

* Instead, fair criticism hs to be put in a last section CRITICS or CRITICISM as fairly in most other articles, that's ok! But obviously not exist any effective neutral control with such Admins WP-principles (any attempt to correct it was rv).

* Instead of our serious pure reproductions of papers, theories, links, biographies as we did, such unserious people try to violate the mind of readers by their own prejuctices' OPINIONS (meaning impertinently that their opinions are a fact and all have to believe). Unqualified tendentious depreciations dominate especially to opponents of BB-physics more and more instead of serious redaction - as shown in one bad example only, above.

* A mass-storage of a computer has an incredible capacity to store something. Is that not a big brain?

* The disk has no intelligence to proceed data. Only by real expert's programs make a computer work, by spending much time instead of only using (reading) an Computer. Beware beginners and laymen in programming. physics, medicine, chemistry... - please!!!

* What happens if such underqualified people get the of might to discipline real experts by steadily destroying their work here (a kind of mental torment abusing the little might to dictate the result? Abuse by hubris only?

* Readers of something dominated by any redactor's OPINIONS mean then to have understood the world but they haven't by ignorance. If you have read a theory you haven't really understood until having really worked with it in practice. Here, such laymen of physics meant only to have understood one and/or the other last real genius FEYNMAN or ZWICKY better than those who know that physics or even use their theories until now. But all with a here ignored real photons's mass (as known in the whole world, even by you, as you wrote us) have to invent many real mysteries - only to support a Big Bang? Poor believers of fashion... 84.158.202.58 03:48, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Albania Veneta

Dear Jimbo,

I appreciate very much what you are doing with your Misplaced Pages. It is a great gift to all of us. But there are some "points" that need to be improved, as you know.

One is the presence of nationalistic groups that in a coordinate way want to impose their points of view without regard of what write serious historians. They usually proceed to ask for help from "friendly to them" administrators and so obtain what they want. In Eastern Europe there are many of these groups (mainly ex-communists) and often are associated with hackers.

What do we have to do with these nationalistic groups? In my case I can pinpoint what is going on with the articles "Albania Veneta", "Zadar", "Istrian exodus", etc., where a group of known nationalistic fanatics (like one nicknamed in the english[REDACTED] as "Direktor") are erasing and damaging what write others with serious and proven references. They use the typical misinformation with "political pressure" of the Soviets in Eastern Europe.

May be you have a serious and impartial administrator, who can help? Regards.--Brunodam 23:48, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

This seems to be a dispute about naming conventions and reliable sources. Naming convention disputes should be solved by determining the names most often used by English speakers and using them without regard to ethnic sympathies. Disputes concerning reliable sources should be raised on WP:RSN. When different reliable sources disagree, they should both be represented in the article with a description of the differences in order to satisfy WP:NPOV. It seems likely that both sides of this dispute have relatively equally reliably sources which conflict. Welcome to the Balkans. ←Ben 00:17, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, but in the case of Albania Veneta there are only the sources confirming the existence of the venetian community in the area. Not one single source has been given from the other side. This shows the need of an impartial and experienced administrator (with knowledge on the topic) to deal with the problem, in order to forestall another possible edit war....Regards.--Brunodam 01:33, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Indeed, welcome to the Balkans conflict (yep, it just moved from CNN to Misplaced Pages)... Allow me to give you the grand tour. Here you will find every imaginable ideology and the very worst national and/or ethnic tension Europe has seen for 62 years, all crammed into a tiny little region. But wait, there's more! it looks like the neighbors would like to join in, notably the (mostly north-eastern) Italians, that feel they may get their way by SLANDERING PEOPLE BEHIND THEIR BACKS (mostly me ;). I would just like it on record it was not my idea to drag people into this mess, but after what was written I feel I must respond. First of all, I am no nationalist(!), understandably so since I find the ideology brainless and revolting. Second of all neither I nor the "view" I represent are Communist (note the lack of logic in the slander above, to them I am some hibrid Nazi/Communist, the "united evil of the world"...). Furthermore, it is important to note the striking numerical disproportion between the people representing the Slavic and the people representing the Italian view on things.

I have frequently over the last few months found myself in the position to have to explain to various Wikipedians what kind of editors we are dealing with in these Dalmatia-related articles. I know I have a personal interest in the matter but let me point out these objective facts: There exists a certain group of persistant Italian editors, with a strong interest in these matters, that do not posses a very good knowledge of English. Because of these traits they are heavily involved in every conflict of oppinion, but are unable to do much more than CONSTANTLY revert, copy paste, and occasionally write a couple of sentences. Because of this inability (or perhaps their unwillingness to work harder than most of us in order to write English) they nearly never constructively debate the issues, and when they do write something on the talkpage, it is not with the intention to improve the text, but to vent their anger at those who have dared to work on it. We hope you will find that Slavic editors I am associated with are a level-headed bunch that is predominantly trying to protect articles against severe degradation by right-wing Italians. I know this all sounds biased, but if you look into the matter I think you may find we are not the radicals here. Recently, instead of debating they started pestering a large number of Admins (notably User:Isotope23) in order to find someone to back them. In this they have slandered me quite frequently in a cheap attempt to biase these people against me personally, as well as other opponents of theirs (often not even making sense in doing so). DIREKTOR 01:20, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I believe the above post from Direktor tells it all about the mentality of these groups that do "Balkan wars" in the english wikipedia....and how it is impossible to write something with impartiality on the topic "Albania veneta", even with serious references. That clearly shows the need of an impartial and experienced administrator (with knowledge on the topic) to deal with the problem, in order to forestall another possible edit war....Regards--Brunodam 01:33, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

In case anyone is wondering, I too believe the first post from Brunodam says it all about the mentality of these groups that take part in "Balkan wars" on the English wikipedia....and how impossible it is to write something with such POV on the topic "Albania veneta" and with such biased sources, without encountering resistance. That clearly shows the need of an impartial and experienced administrator (with knowledge on the topic) to deal with the problem, in order to forestall another possible edit war.... Regards, DIREKTOR 01:51, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Let a serious and impartial administrator decide if the many references written in Albania Veneta are "biased sources". Regards

I can't believe it!! We actually agree on something!!!! DIREKTOR 02:10, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

OK.Let's forestall another possible edit war.--Brunodam 02:14, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Another one bites the dust

Hi Jimmy, just wanted you to know that you have lost another dedicated editor. If you care to know why, it's on his userpage. Thanks, and farewell. --Targeman 02:30, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi Jimmy, I also want you to know that I have put a report stating Targeman is leaving Misplaced Pages at Misplaced Pages:Stress Alerts. Greg Jones II 02:54, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

It's actually not unusual that people decide to leave Misplaced Pages, but the question is, can they actually stay away? Some can, some can't and some might even return under different usernames. It's sorry to see people go in this way, but it's not like the deathknell of Misplaced Pages, new users are cropping up all the time aren't they? I guess the main reason for people leaving is there are too many idiots operating on this website. It's sad, but that's the conclusion I've come to from what I've seen and witnessed in my 8 months working here. Lradrama 10:03, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

The fact that another user is leaving is not as important as the reason for which he is leaving. Gizza 10:56, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, as I said before - too many idiots and vandals in operation. :-( Lradrama 10:58, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

What is really sad is that it isn't that WP is too open, it is because too many editors are effected by the actions of vandals that is the reason for them abusing the system. If you don't want to deal with the idiots, then don't - concentrate on building the encyclopedia instead. There are those, bless them, that actively pursue and correct vandalism, there are those that deal with vandalism as it is found, there are those who ignore it, and there are those who are effected by it. I would hope that Misplaced Pages is large enough to allow all of the above to contribute according to their talents and preferences. I also regret any good contributor leaving, and I hope Targeman finds something else that rewards their skills and efforts. LessHeard vanU 12:40, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Many have left because of a few problems with Misplaced Pages. Read the essays they write on their userpages. Fix the problems, and Misplaced Pages will be a better place. Don't fix them, and Misplaced Pages will suck. --Kaypoh 01:44, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Your message is for all of us, Jimbo cant fix anything on his own, SqueakBox 01:48, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

I myself enjoy fighting vandalism. Look on the bright side. Some things they put are funny ;-). Even if it does get reverted. Service with a smile! Lradrama 14:27, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

I think you might want to place protection on your userpage

I saw the history of you userpage and there were about ten vandalsims in the last ten days. My my. Thanks. Marlith /C 04:09, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

And I didn't read that note at the bottom. Sorry. Marlith /C 04:13, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Food for Thought

How can Misplaced Pages be called an encyclopedia if you can not fully trust the information inside it? ComputerDude1010 13:16, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

How can ANYTHING be called an encyclopedia, by that standard? See WP:EBE --Lucid 13:18, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Tertiary sources, such as encyclopedias, are not reliable research tools. Unfortunately, a lot of people ignore this fact and rely on them for information regardless. Secondary sources are good, if it's from a reliable source. Primary sources are the best, if you can adequately interpret them. ~ UBeR 13:24, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

My point is that an encyclopedia is supposed to be a reference on various topics. Meanwhile, teachers in some schools my friend's children go to are calling Misplaced Pages a place for "unverified information not suitable for projects or reports". Therefore, Misplaced Pages is flawed in the fact it can't perform its main objective: To be a "💕" ComputerDude1010 13:26, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Also I have realized Targeman described Misplaced Pages perfectly. " a huge, inept and anarchic organization committed to political correctness more than to anything else, employing an unpaid, ill-equipped, badly trained and pitifully powerless work force." ComputerDude1010 13:29, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

It's your point that's flawed. Just because 'teachers in some schools' don't consider it reliable doesn't mean it isn't an encyclopedia (which, for reference, a teacher shouldn't be accepting as a source anyway, as mentioned above). A lack of trust does not mean something is not an encyclopedia. No source is perfect, and relying on a single source to be perfect goes beyond trust, and into stupidity. Also, for an explanation of why Misplaced Pages is able to actually keep up or exceed the much more professional opposition, see Linus's Law --Lucid 13:32, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

That's the best part of Misplaced Pages, we are doing it out of love, the good of humanity, and other Hallmark-esque reasons. Besides, no one is supposed to cite any encyclopedia as it is considered a Tertiary source, and as such not good enought for reference. As for validation, patience young grasshopper. Zidel333 13:35, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages is playing the Political game. In short, deception is at work here. In my personal opinion, Misplaced Pages, like the world as a whole, is majorly flawed. This reminds me to put up my "The world will end in 1952 days" userbox. (PS: That's 12/21/12 ComputerDude1010 13:39, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

So don't use it. Britanica is quite good. Use that instead. Theresa Knott | The otter sank 20:04, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

P.S. A disclaimer was made for the purpose of avoiding such vacuous arguments. ~ UBeR 22:41, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Open for anything...

We all know that Misplaced Pages is open for anyone to edit. But Jim, I'm sure that this (http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Misplaced Pages:Sandbox&diff=prev&oldid=151885238) really wasn't what it was intended for. Looking back at the Chris Benoit/Wikipedia controversy, although[REDACTED] was created so that edits like this are allowed to happen, should we take something like the above edit (as well as http://en.wikipedia.org/search/?title=Misplaced Pages%3ASandbox&diff=151887760&oldid=151886061) seriously? Socby19 19:45, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Eh? It'a a sandbox edit. You know, a sandbox, where people can play! Theresa Knott | The otter sank 20:11, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, and so is the rest of the internet. Like when Al-Qaeda, or any other terror cell makes serious posts about plots that actually follow through. I did say that I'm not sure what to think of it, but just in case, I have notified the FBI via their counter-terrorism tip submission forum. Socby19 21:02, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Are you sure it isn't just an odd joke about the movie Telefon? -85.210.30.61 23:31, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Honestly, I have no idea. From reading the Telefon[REDACTED] page, I don't see any references to Disney (park, nor company) at all. The only connection I see is that the distributor is MGM, which, through this year, Disney has a license for the name MGM (Disney-MGM Studios). Besides, the ride page (Snow White's Scary Adventures) doesn't mention the movie. The Disney World ride is in Magic Kingdom, not Disney-MGM. To me, it's just a bunch of loose ends that may or may not mean something. Socby19 00:22, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Please help with Misplaced Pages:Conspiracy theory titles

I would appreciate any help you could provide with the new Misplaced Pages:Conspiracy theory titles proposal/essay and also over on wiktionary's definition of "conspiracy theory" here. zen master T 23:33, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, it looks like nonsense to me. Some things actually are conspiracy theories and should be dubbed as such.--Jimbo Wales 10:25, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Possible police investigation by Frank Zampino

Also posted in Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents

Hello! I'm Not sure if you are aware of this but I've spotted this article (although in French) mentioning that the individual is threating to demand a police investigation because of users using some IP's from the cabinet office of Gerald Tremblay the mayor of Montreal that had made defamatory edits on Zampino's article - the IP mentionned that he was a former nazi supporter and a member of the Weight Watchers. Another article here mentionned that the incident occured on August 15 2006 at 12:19 PM (so 16:19 UTC). JForget 01:12, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

This is the one edit in question made by User:67.71.78.44.--JForget 01:50, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

It sounds like an issue for the police not for wikipedia. We dont have any fear of the police here cos we are law-abiding, SqueakBox 02:09, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Actually, the article was referring to a different edit, deleted 15:23, August 17, 2007 from a different IP, 142.243.254.239 that contained the same information. I've deleted the above-mentioned revisons that interestingly enough came weeks before (July 23) the ones mentioned in the article (August 15). Mr.Z-mantalk¢ 02:17, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Cool, we dont see enough of admins using the delete button for unacceptable revisions, IMHO, SqueakBox 02:19, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

And here is an article in English. City hall hunts for Misplaced Pages 'vandal'. Mr.Z-mantalk¢ 02:22, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the problem seems too serious. Just a case of vandalism that may or may not have come from the city hall. ~ UBeR 14:38, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Administrator

Hey Jimbo can you make me an administrator oh please!!!!--*VANILLA2 15:08, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

You make request for adminship (RfA), which then gets reviewed by other editors. If the majority vote support (for the candidate) you are made an admin / sysop. If the majority don't support you, you just have to try again another time. You must have at least a few months experience editing Misplaced Pages, and experience editing Misplaced Pages-project space. It isn't easy to pass - that's what I conclude through experience on RfA! See Misplaced Pages:Requests for adminship for more details. Cheers, Lradrama 15:16, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

If you would like to be an admin, I would recommend going to RfA as well. If you would like help/advice, I am happy to offer it; we cen continue this discussion on my talk page. Cheers, Neranei (talk) 15:17, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

People, the user is already aware of this process. See Misplaced Pages:Requests for adminship/Vanilla2. I think Vanilla2 wants to know if s/he can be made an admin by special appointment, outside of RfA.--The Fat Man Who Never Came Back 15:20, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

But is that possible? Lradrama 15:32, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Of course it is. Jimbo is a steward after all. But how probable that is... now that's another story... Миша13 15:40, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

One wonders if he ever intends to enact his "I'll just go around and randomly make some people who have been here awhile sysops" idea. --Lucid 15:45, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Heh. Well, note that being a steward gives one the ability in a technical sense to make someone a sysop, but gives no right to do so outside of normal procedures. So my being a steward is more or less irrelevant to the question. Now, under our traditional governance model, making sysops would be among my reserved powers, and I would imagine that the ArbCom would back me up on that, and indeed in some special cases they might even request me to do it. But this is clearly not a special case and in any event, I am well aware that in order for me to keep my traditional powers, it is best not to use them very much, and then typically only to resolve some kind of crisis in governance by cutting through some procedural dilemma to enact the will of the community directly. Not an easy matter, which is why I try as best I can to proceed slowly and thoughtfully.

So no, Vanilla2, as charming as the request is, I will not be granting you admin status. I rather doubt that I would ever directly grant sysop status to someone except upon the advise of the ArbCom. :) --Jimbo Wales 15:53, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Can you think of any situations where ArbCom would want you to give someone sysop where they couldn't pass an RFA? --Lucid 15:59, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

L, not heard of User:MikeGodwin? Anthere used her magical steward/board chair powers to appoint him sysop. See Misplaced Pages:Requests for adminship/MikeGodwin. This is clearly a special case since he is the foundation's legal counsel. This is the kind of situation Jimbo is referring to, I think. --Deskana (banana) 16:11, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

but Jim are you saying that I will never become an administrator?--*VANILLA2 15:56, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Adminship is like sand. "The tighter you grasp it, the more slips through your fingers" --Lucid 15:59, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

No, he's saying he's not going to specially appoint you to be an administrator. You can submit another request for adminship though I think everyone here would suggest you take several months to gain experience and learn morea bout the policies of Misplaced Pages more before you submit another RFA. Metros 15:58, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Vanilla2, don't be disheartened by the results of this discussion. Please, continue to edit Misplaced Pages, with particular focus on Misplaced Pages-project space, and provide sensible answers in your RfA, and there is no reason to suggest that you will not become an admin. Of course you will if you put the effort in. I wish you the best of luck in your future editing Misplaced Pages. Happy editing, Lradrama 16:08, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

It is possible that your adminship candidacy would be opposed by a cabal of POV-pushing admins who are trying to control certain articles, policies, or BLPs in Misplaced Pages for their own ends. But, certain recent events in the project appear to indicate that such opposition is probably not likely at the moment so I think the regular RfA process should work as it is supposed to, at least for the time being. Cla68 16:21, 18 August 2007 (UTC)