Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 02:27, 14 October 2009

NOTE: This page is unfortunately frequently protected because of vandalism. If for whatever reason you are an IP editor or newcomer who finds that he cannot edit this page because of such protection, please feel free to make any reasonable comments at User talk:John Carter/IP. Thank you, and my apologies for the inconvenience.

Template:Werdnabot

Beware! This user's talk page is monitored by talk page watchers. Some of them even talk back.

User:Jake Wartenberg/centijimbo

Have you taken a look at Portal:Scientology/Wikimedia?

The logo's for each image are extremely expanded. I saw that you were the first one to edit it; but it's been messed up since that time. I think you should take a look at it. Lighthead 0:21, March 25 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I'm not even part of that project but I was just browsing... Lighthead 0:32, March 25 2008 (UTC)

Time Times (2008-04)

	Time Times
Issue Two • April 2008 • About the Newsletter Written by FrankP and Template Designed by Diligent Terrier
News Recent Project News Article count on at 961! We now have 961 articles but, will have many more soon as only a few are marked as in our project. At least 803 are unassessed though, plenty of work for us to do. Project member count reaches 12 members! Keep inviting all your WikiFriends. Award offered—Since 2008-01-05, Sharkface217 has offered a Barnstar to the editor who can expand the article Timeline. It certainly needs it, now that it has been disambiguated from Chronology: Go to the Timeline listing on the Awards page to find out Sharkface's minimum requirements! From the Time Portal An IP added this funny comment to Portal talk:Time "I never though I would see the day mankind succeeds in creating a time portal." Recent Time News From the leap second article: in April 2008: ITU Working Party 7A will submit to ITU Study Group 7 project recommendation on stopping leap second. Calendars met on March 21. It was Good Friday (Western Christianity, 2008); Purim ends at sundown (Judaism, 2008); Naw-Rúz in the Bahá'í calendar, Benito Juárez Day in Mexico, World Poetry Day.
Archives • Newsroom
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thank spam

Thank you for voting in my RfA, which passed with 194 supporting, 9 opposing, and 4 neutral. Your kindness and constructive criticism is very much appreciated. I look forward to using the tools you have granted me to aid the project. I would like to give special thanks to Tim Vickers, Anthony and Acalamari for their nominations. Thank you again, VanTucky

Time Times (2008-05)

	Time Times
Issue Three • May 2008 • About the Newsletter Written by FrankP and Template Designed by Diligent Terrier
News Recent Project News Article count at 1074! At least 911 are unassessed though, plenty of work for us to do. Award offered—Since 2008-01-05, Sharkface217 has offered a Barnstar to the editor who can expand the article Timeline. It certainly needs it, now that it has been disambiguated from Chronology: Go to the Timeline listing on the Awards page to find out Sharkface's minimum requirements! From the Time Portal History of timekeeping devices reaches Good Article Status —On April 7 the history of time keeping article became a GA. This is our only top importance article to reach this prestigious status. This was only possible with the dedication of the Tzatziki Squad. They are continuing to work on the article to reach Feature Article status. History of timekeeping devices in Egypt was a DYK —The article appeared on the Main Page on April 8. With this text: "...that despite Herodotus's claim that the sundial was invented in Babylon, the oldest known example is from Egypt?" This also was only possible thanks to the Tzatziki Squad. Recent Time News None that I know of.
Archives • Newsroom
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WP:X Elections

Time Times (2008-06)

	Time Times
Issue four • June 2008 • About the Newsletter Written by FrankP and Template Designed by Diligent Terrier
News Recent Project News Article count at 1091! 979 are unassessed though, plenty of work for us to do. Project member count reaches 16 members! Keep inviting all your WikiFriends. Award offered—Since 2008-01-05, Sharkface217 has offered a Barnstar to the editor who can expand the article Timeline. It certainly needs it, now that it has been disambiguated from Chronology: Go to the Timeline listing on the Awards page to find out Sharkface's minimum requirements! From the Time Portal History of timekeeping devices reaches A-Class Status—On May 22 the history of time keeping article was promoted by User:Zginder to A-Class. This is our only article to reach this prestigious status. This was only possible with the dedication of the Tzatziki Squad. They are continuing to work on the article to reach Feature Article status. Merkhet was a DYK—The article appeared on the Main Page on April 28. With this text: "... that merkhets were Ancient Egyptian timekeeping devices that tracked the movement of certain stars over the meridian in order to ascertain the time during the night, when sundials could not function?" This also was only possible thanks to the Tzatziki Squad. Recent Time News The June Solstice takes place on 2008-06-20T23:59.
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Article about Khomeini

This article has been written by an agent of mullahs! There is not even one sentence on mass execution of political prisoners by Khomeini! There is nothing on violation of women's rights e.g. compulsory hijab. Female judges were forced to give up their jobs such as Shirin Ebadi...in islamic court, mullahs consider 2 women equal to one man! women can't even have an operation without the permission of their father/husband!

mullah even banned western music!

mullahs hang homosexuals & stone those who commit adultery!

those who convert from islam to any other religion will be executed!

Khomeini was behind the Cinema Rex fire, which led to the death (burning alive!) of approx. 500 people! most of your references are biased, they are taken from the islamic regime's sources e.g. poetry!! Khomeini couldn't even speak properly, let alone writing a poem!

List of heads of Serbian Orthodox Church

I rename this article and I will add references. I have some questionst about it: 1. does references on Serbian language are good as references on English. I ask it because there is much more literature on Serbian church on Serbian than on any other language. 2. how many references are best for lists (one reference for every line or something different)?

AfD nomination of Garrison Courtney

Garrison Courtney, an article that you contributed to, has been nominated for deletion. The nominator does not think that this article satisfies Misplaced Pages's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Garrison Courtney. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns.

Comment on WikiProject organization

Rather than post on the WikiProject I thought I would bring my comment directly to you. I have found that the better functioning projects have strong editors/administrators who actively work at organizing and maintaining the project. Military is a great example to use because they have coordinators assigned not just to the Project, but to each of its Task Forces/Work Groups. I think you may find yourself frustrated trying to set up a similar structure in the Christianity project with so many different opinions and personalities. I wish you all the best because it is long over due; I just hope you don't get frustrated in the effort. -- Absolon S. Kent , 12:49, Wednesday, January 22, 2025 (UTC)

lowercase people

Alright, I wont mess with it anymore. I just got a little upset that people categorized lowercase people as a "Christian" organization, which it primarily isn't.

Editing Barnstar

		100,000 Edits
		I, Bugboy52.4, award you for reaching 100,000 edits according to the List of Wikipedians by number of edits generated 11:45 pm, 24 February 2009. Keep up the good work!________________________________________________________________

Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Occupation_of_the_Baltic_states

Mentioned you at this ANI thread I opened on myself. Feel free to stay out of it, if you want to, but wanted you to know I had brought up your name. Hiberniantears (talk)

Charles G. Koch

Thanks for weighing in. If you peruse Bonewah's talk page, you will note regular accusations of opinion oriented editing. My sense is Bonewah doesn't like character assassination but such is difficult when the subject has no character. Quoting Palast is quoting one of the more reliable sources available but there is also reference to the story when it was carried by CBS News which I included. Bonewah specifically doesn't like the word "giggle", s/he said so. S/he also thinks Truthout is a "fringe" news outlet. Certainly it doesn't have the charm of Fox News but, not influenced by corporate interests, it is one of the few major news outlets we have left. I have asked Greg Palast to provide me with an ironclad reference to the "giggle" comment. I also asked him for permission to use the quote. Whether he will answer or not, I do not know. I believe that this information is important as a more complete portrait of a person who has put his name on a number of things with some pocket change and, as someone said on the talk page "How can we talk this way about a great American businessman." Sigh. Having money still means morally correct to a large number of Americans. As I pile proof on this, Bonewah will come up with even further out comments, I believe. I understand that you are very busy and have much on your plate but, even so, I ask you to actually investigate what Bonewah's objections really are and the comments s/he has received from others with the same complaint that I have. Thank you. I have included my Koch material below.

Coordinator Election

Hi John: you probably have this in hand, but can we do anything to drum up some more interest in the coordinator election. AFAIK we currently have 2 candidates (one for lead, one for assistant) and a total of 2 votes cast. NBeale (talk) 20:14, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Let me get the newsletter out, and with any luck maybe we can get something done. I'm not really optimistic about additional candidates myself, but we can hope and pray for the best. John Carter (talk) 22:49, 9 September 2009 (UTC)

Even if they don't want to be candidates it would be nice if people voted. It would give a warm feeling that people were supportive.NBeale (talk) 16:01, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Can I help in any way? NBeale (talk) 21:51, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Heads-up

Hi there. I'm shortly going to propose that this site be added as an WP:EL to both List of micronations and Micronations.

As the site includes the most extensive, up-to-date listing of micronations currently available from any source, I believe that it is directly relevant to the subject of those articles, and that its inclusion within them would significantly complement the existing content, and enhance their usefulness and the level of informativeness they communicate to the general reader.

However, before I iniate that discussion I firstly wanted to disclose that I'm the owner and primary author of www.listofmicronations.com. Secondly, in order to avoid any suggestion of WP:COI I intend to refrain from adding the link myself, should the eventual consensus support my proposal. --Gene_poole (talk) 02:58, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Template:WP Kuwait

Hi. This template has no paramters or programming. Would a delete and merger with Western Asia banner be better? Himalayan 18:13, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

Any sage thoughts?

John, noticed you hadn't commented yet at Misplaced Pages talk:Banning policy#Community discussion of topic-ban and page-ban procedure urged, I'm curious what your thoughts are?--Doug. 13:32, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Monitoring page

If you could watchlist User:Mattisse/Monitoring' you could help me in dealing with future problems. I hope not to disappoint you again. Thanks! —mattisse (Talk) 23:14, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Rating LDS-related articles

Thanks so much for rating the various Latter Day Saint related articles on Misplaced Pages that I've been working on lately! It's always nice to get feedback from another editor as to where the article is relative to the rating scale. I concur with your ratings, in all but one instance: might I ask you why, specifically, you rated the Church of Jesus Christ (Cutlerite) article as "start" class? Not trying to start any quarrels here at all, but I think this article is definitely more than a "Start" class article--it's at least "Class C", if not "Class B" material, given the length, inclusion of an image (about the only thing we have for a Cutlerite church, as there's only one in existence!), and number and variety of references. I'm wondering if perhaps a mistake was made here, or if there is/are some specific issue(s) that need(s) addressing? Thanks!! - Ecjmartin (talk) 01:19, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

References/ Sources

Dear John Carter,

The page Saint Dismas has a request for references / sources. I'v put these in but I do not know how to do the numbering to the sources cited? I'v asked OIEnglish, but he is away! Have I done this bit correctly? so far?

MacOfJesus (talk) 19:14, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Not user-friendly! Oh! for my pen and paper! MacOfJesus (talk) 21:13, 17 September 2009 (UTC)

Talkback

User:MuZebot will be ready to go in 5 hours time. MuZemike 00:57, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

Advice

Hi John, I'm a new editor here. I have been having some issues in my attempts to contribute to Misplaced Pages. I have been working with others to improve the Same-sex marriage article. Several editors there have accused me of biased POV edits (while Wikipedian User:David_Shankbone has said that I am "doing an admirable job of tempering bias"), which I would guess is not unheard of on controversial articles. I was recently blocked for breaking 3RR for reverting controversial edits that did not achive consensus before they were added (which I realise was a warranted admin action and next time I will be more carefull). More than one editor has made personal attacks on me, and I believe one is currently (borderline) Wikihounding me. Also, editors have attempted to block the inclusion of sources such as peer-reviewed academic journals because they disagree with the POV in the articles (I have seen blogs and Fox news used as sources here. In grad school peer-reviewed journals were great. Not here?). I'm not too familiar with the rules here yet. Any advice would be great. Thanks in advance.Ragazz (talk) 06:31, 18 September 2009 (UTC)

What are the policies regarding wp:agf on user talk pages? Also, are users allowed to collude to prevent another editor from contributing? Is there a line as far as which wild accusations can be made here?Ragazz (talk) 00:33, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

I am having trouble with constantly being signed-out accidentally, and my IP address showing after my edits and posts. Even when I still try to be careful, this sometimes happens. Is there anything I can do to avoid this? Also, is there some way to consolidate/transfer all prior posts/edits from my IP to my user profile? All of those posts/edits done after I created my account were intended to be done while I was signed in, but I keep getting bumped-off for some reason.Ragazz (talk) 21:31, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

There may be a sock puppet IP editor (24.6.46.170) at the pagesHistory of same-sex unions and Same-sex marriage. They are adding infammatory tags to their edits such as "Removed false statements by an apparently biased Christian."Ragazz (talk) 17:38, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

user:historyguy1965 has been consistently ignoring the consensus process. This has caused several edit wars apparently, at least one that I'm aware of. Here is a recent example where I attempted to point this out to him, with links to the example. Here are some comments he made that violated WP:CIVIL and WP:AGF. My problem is of course not with his edits per se, but the manor in which he is making them with total disregard to the consensus process. Please check out the situation. Thanks.Ragazz (talk) 01:53, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Do you have any advice as to how I could be handling things differently?Ragazz (talk) 00:01, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

user:historyguy1965 has accused me of harassment. Does this count as a personal attack?Ragazz (talk) 19:52, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Help with Project City of Rome

The project has been abondoned. No one is running or promoting it. I have taken on some duties to keep it going but i am terribly under qualified to run a project alone. How can I get this project kick started again to get others involved in the inner workings of the project?--Amadscientist (talk) 08:35, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Would do a head check on me?

John, would you take a look at Misplaced Pages:Administrators'_noticeboard/Incidents#Breakdown_at_Template:Infobox_Russian_inhabited_locality and let me know if you think I'm stepping on it. User:Tedder specifically refused to do exactly what I did on the grounds it would be wheel warring.--Doug. 20:05, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, I thought for a moment that I might have been a little over confident in the use of tools.--Doug. 20:31, 19 September 2009 (UTC)

Hello John

How have you been? Do you remember me?? :) Shahid • 11:55, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

I'm happy to hear from you and see that everything is five. I think your work is as great as always. I came to you because I missed talking to some old Wiki-friend. I will need your help in the future (when I update the Zinta article I will obviously want to ask for some prose suggestions from you :)). I've also done nothing special of late, except for reverting vandalism and for an instance re-formatting the Filmfare Awards categories. They look much more organised today.

Now that you ask me, I think I do need some admin help from you as you are more familiar with WP:FILM. I would want to ask you to protect two film articles: Veer-Zaara and Har Dil Jo Pyar Karega. One individual with different IP accounts keeps messing up the credits order in these two articles, swapping places between the film's supporting actor and leading actor (he seems to be a fan of this particular actor because he gives her higher billing in both articles, while she is clearly the film's supporting actress). He does that continuously through different accounts and now he did that again. I do not want to revert him again because my edits could be mistaken for edit warring. Could you please semi-protect these two articles for a few days? Shahid • 14:38, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

What I find funnier is that Veer-Zaara, where the title characters are Veer (played by Khan) and Zaara (played by Preity Zinta), has also been changed by this individual, although it's more than clear who the leading actors are. As you see, amazon.com, though I don't think it's the best way to go, does not even mention the film's supporting actress. Shahid • 15:02, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure this guy will keep reverting through other accounts, but well, it will only give a reason to protect the article. Thank you. Shahid • 15:06, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

I would like to ask you something. See the way I reformatted, for example the Filmfare Best Actress Award. It used to be like this and now it looks like this. I would want to change the lay out in the same way for Filmfare Best Story Award. But here I don't know what should be mentioned first, the writer or the film. For example:

• 2000 Honey Irani - Kya Kehna

Or

• 2000 Kya Kehna - Honey Irani

What do you think? Shahid • 15:18, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

From the way I see the nominees being presented here, the writer is nominated for a film. So I should use the first option, yes? I was confused actually because the article about the Academy Award for Best Screenplay mentions the films and the the writers. Shahid • 15:33, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Freemasonry and NRM category

Hi John, I note that you added Freemasonry to the NRM category (since undone by Vidkun). I would like you to think about the following question... is the category really appropriate?

I am not talking about the basic dispute over whether Freemasonry is or is not a religion in the first place. We both know the arguments for and against that... and I suspect we will disagree. No, I am asking whether Freemasonry qualifies as a new religious movement. Freemasonry dates back to at least the mid 1600s... which makes it as old or older than many Protestant denominations (Quakers, Southern Baptists, Methodists). To include Freemasonry in the Category you would have to expand the scope significantly. Blueboar (talk) 12:42, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Ownby's book

Could I ask you to please check the exact wording (p215) of his reading of 'Beyond the limits of Forbearance' which is cited in the 'self-immolation' article? I just want to make sure it is correct. Thanks, Ohconfucius (talk) 02:35, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

• John, An editor has commented on the review page that it's not clear who said what ("call to arms" quote). As I haven't read the book, could you please help to make the Ownby quote more precise in the article? Thanks, Ohconfucius (talk) 17:08, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Saint Augustine

Dear John Carter,

In the Saint Augustine article page, under the heading "Conversion", his conversion is defined as to "Catholic Christanity".

This is incorrect, as so many have referred to in its talk page.

I'v asked for comments. Request for Comments, on his talk page.

His conversion was from a bad life; desolate living, to a good life. His Confessions contain the famous phrase:

"Late have I lived you, O Beauty so ancient and so new; late have I loved you! For behold you were within me, and I outside; and I saught you outside and in my ugliness fell upon those lovely things that you have made....."

Confessions Bk 27.

May this be changed soon as, as it is, it is misleading.

Saint Augustine's page is a major entry.

MacOfJesus (talk) 17:57, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

Dear John Carter,

I'v left a suggestion at the talk page of Saint Augustine. (In my work situation I meet people who quite proudly claim Saint Augustine as their ancient ancestor! From his desolate life!)

MacOfJesus (talk) 17:00, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

Dear John Carter,

I'v left some pointers and suggestions on the talk page of Saint Austin. His conversion came in destinct stages. And unfortunately our predecessors deleated the "ugliness" phrase, for fear of insulting someone. So:

1. His conversion from a desolate life.

2. His acceptance of being "without the sweets of those toys!"

3. His finding the peace of an interior blessed life.

4. His becoming a priest and bishop.

I think there is great value in adding extra to the "Conversion" paragraph on the article page.

MacOfJesus (talk) 13:08, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Thank You

Thank you for the barnstar you awared me but I would like you to add it my own award page. I do not want to add it myself do to the fact my name would show up on the edit history page. --Mr. Unknown (talk) 18:42, 24 September 2009 (UTC)

Saint Sava

I will start to write in nexf few days. For great introduction in subject I suggest chapter (more than 80 pages) about Saint Sava in Six Byzantine Portraits by Dimitri Obolensky. Maybe there are this book or chapter on googlebooks.--Vojvodae please be free to write :) 19:12, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

I forgot to thank you for quich response :) --Vojvodae please be free to write :) 19:14, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

Uganda

Guten Abend Herr Carter. I was wondering if you do kind of what you used to do with Uganda and assess and project tag articles. I've noticed a high number of Ugandan articles like Kitgum are not tagged or assessed and when there are editors like User:Fsmatovu writing them it is difficult to keep. I don't know if your health will permit you to do so but your help in assessing Ugandan articles would be greatly apprecated. Hope you are well Himalayan 21:52, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

Sounds great, glad to hear you are better. I have been worried about you for a long time, same as SHahid has. Sarvagnya? LOL I'd forgotten he existed, low life nasty piece of work wasn't he! Yes the thing is though our coverage of Kuwait at present is a tiny percentage of what could or should be! I expanded an article on Al Jahra the other day, most of the other towns are one liners unfortunately. I've been managing to sort out svg maps though for places like this and Saudi.If you could put it on your todo list this would be awesome, it would probably surprise you more how many ugandan articles we now have! Himalayan 22:14, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

Looks interesting... Himalayan 17:51, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Talk:List of new religious movements

Please comment in the most recent thread here, "Companies Don't Belong On This List" it appears a user is ignoring WP:RS and WP:V, instead going by WP:IDONTLIKEIT to determine what should or should not be included on this list. Cirt (talk) 02:47, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Also, switched List of new religious movements to a pure alphabetical format, and removed wholly unsourced entries from the list. Could use your help adding some back, obviously only if properly cited. Cirt (talk) 03:00, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Additions to List of new religious movements

At List of new religious movements, can we please keep the additions to the same formatting - and also not add additions simply to the book's title, but also include page numbers for each entry please? Cirt (talk) 16:18, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

Sounds great! :) I explained a bit more at the talk page of why this is important, especially on a controversial topic like this one, to have individual cites, and page numbers. The current format allows for this. Cirt (talk) 16:33, 27 September 2009 (UTC)

Misplaced Pages:Requests for mediation/Occupation of the Baltic states

Hi!

Can you please restore the page of the rejected mediation cabal Misplaced Pages:Requests for mediation/Occupation of the Baltic states so it would possible to present it as evidence in the ongoing ArbCom case about the EE mailing list . Thank you.--Dojarca (talk) 20:37, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Moving discussion to your talk page, or mine if you wish

"

Ouch, sorry for misreading earlier. I guess the answer to that would be how much weight to give the various Chinese officials who have described it as a "cult". My guess is that, in the west, including academics, it is perceived primarily as a fringey new religion, but not necessarily as a cult. The question then becomes how much weight to give the allegations out of China regarding its effect there. One of the points in defining a cult is unquestioning regard for the words and actions of its leader, and certainly Falun Gong members seem to follow Li almost to the letter, according to what I read in Ownby, anyway. I think the defining characteristic of the term when it is used in a perjorative sense is whether being an adherent of the school is damaging to the individual. There are numerous allegations in China of such damage, generally put out by the government there. The devotion its adherents give it could be seen as being indicative of that as well. So, I guess, from what little I've seen, the people in the west apparently think it possesses some of the characteristics we associate with "cults", but not demonstrably to the degree that would justify use of that word. Most other religions fall in the same general grouping as well. I think the west also tends to discount the statements out of China in general, which I think throws out most of that data. So, probably, a group with uniformly highly devoted members, yes, a cult, no. John Carter (talk) 18:22, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

John I think you are not fair regarding "One of the points in defining a cult is unquestioning regard for the words and actions of its leader, and certainly Falun Gong members seem to follow Li almost to the letter, according to what I read in Ownby ... The devotion its adherents give it could be seen as being indicative of that as well." simply because if we were to generalize this broadly, we could just as well start to argue that we are cult members just because we spend over 2h almost daily on Misplaced Pages, and speculate that the editors must have an irregular family life, back problems, eye problems, etc...

Why would anyone in his right mind want to start speculation like that? For one we are not forced to edit Misplaced Pages, the same is true for the people who practice, we find it meaningful to edit here, so do they.

The Chinese governments label as a cult is not based on any science, cases of practitioners who died of illness is not correlated with the general illness factor in the country. This is something very normal when the label is used just as a propaganda tool. Based on that I would accord near zero academic value to what the PRC says. Of course, I might have a POV, but if you have better reasoning on why the PRC's label should be given more academic value, please state it. --HappyInGeneral (talk) 18:56, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Please read the cult page, where extreme devotion to the words or actions of a leader is in fact listed as being one of the characteristics of cults, in the "According to secular opposition" section. John Carter (talk) 19:03, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Please read it again. To be a cult is way more complex then that. To quote completely your source: "A cult is a group or movement exhibiting a great or excessive devotion or dedication to some person, idea or thing and employing unethically manipulative techniques of persuasion and control (e.g. isolation from former friends and family, debilitation, use of special methods to heighten suggestibility and subservience, powerful group pressures, information management, suspension of individuality or critical judgment, promotion of total dependency on the group and fear of leaving it, etc) designed to advance the goals of the group's leaders to the actual or possible detriment of members, their families, or the community." The point is that to be a cult it has to be coercive. Do you agree? --HappyInGeneral (talk) 19:35, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Also thank you for answering the question, now I guess this discussion is for the sake of broadening our understanding. --HappyInGeneral (talk) 19:36, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

You did see where I said at the end that it seems that it probably doesn't meet the definition of "cult", but that it possesses several of the characteristics of them, right? Most religions do possess several of those characteristics, but aren't cults. Personally, I think given the comparative newness of this group, and its circumstances, it is probably not unreasonable for an uninformed person to raise the question of whether it is or is not a cult, but that the evidence available doesn't support particularly well the contention that it is a cult. John Carter (talk) 19:55, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

" copy out from here .

Hi John, I think it is best to move the discussion, so we don't clutter that page. Basically what I don't understand is why do you insist on pointing to this cult like characteristics since that is such a broad generalization that even a chess club might satisfy it. As I see it the main characteristic, without which there is no point in comparing anything to a cult, is if it is or not coercive. Do you agree? --HappyInGeneral (talk) 21:17, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

LTNS!

Hey John, I gots a question. Do you know a quick way to find out if an article has been deleted? If so, let me know please. Joshua Ingram 22:19, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Mainstream Media. Could you look for me please? Joshua Ingram 22:34, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, man. Any reason you know of why there is someone reverting it after I've finished it? Look here when you get a chance. Thanks, bro. Joshua Ingram 00:17, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Nevermind, bro. It was my fault. Still, thanks for the help.Joshua Ingram 00:21, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

HELP

John, I'm in need of your admin services--I was searching for an article about the Roman Catholic Diocese of Ciudad Juárez, Mexico, without success, so I decided to create one. I found a fair amount of information and swatted one together, when(to my horror) I realised that I had misspelled the word Catholic in the title(Cathoic-I had input the wrong spelling in the search). I tried a move, but then discovered that there was a page titled Roman Catholic Diocese of Ciudad Juárez, all of about 4 lines worth. The one that I did( Roman Cathoic Diocese of Ciudad Juárez ) is infinitely better than the pre-existing article-Can you help? Muchas Graz,--Lyricmac (talk) 01:31, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

That would be best, since you had moved the narrative over to Roman Catholic Diocese of Ciudad Juárez. The mis-spelled article is rather superfluous now, I guess. Thanks a bunch.--Lyricmac (talk) 13:43, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

Just ..

Thank you! ;) — Ched :  ?  23:37, 3 October 2009 (UTC)

Yes. What he said. Lara 00:01, 4 October 2009 (UTC)

Don't normally do this, but...

Hello John Carter, Unitanode has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling at someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Go on, smile! Cheers, and happy editing!
Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.

Kazakhstan

I don't want to open up an old can of worms, but I'm not sure why you're suddenly toying with the WikiProject Central Asia template and adding material for a Kazakhstan WikiProject. Note that the WikiProject Kazakhstan you created has only three members (one of which is you), that no one has joined for over a year and a half, and that it is currently listed as inactive. Also, there was never a concensus reached that having a seperate WikiProject for Kazakhstan would be useful (as opposed to one for Central Asia in general, since so many articles/themes overlap with other countries in the region). If you feel the situation has changed, please start a new discussion at the talk page of WikiProject Central Asia, since, per the last discussion about this, such edits are you are doing now we deemed not necessarily helpful. Otebig (talk) 17:50, 6 October 2009 (UTC) +

WikiProject Zoroastrianism Notice!

Behavior Reply

First off, whether or not you believe this I do appreciate you taking the time to give me that advice on my page. I just have one problem, how do you deal with people who have such an obviously biased POV? The editor I'm usually at war with does things I have no idea how to handle. For example, when someone inserts a 'clarify' tag next to something like 'same-sex marriage' how else can you reply? What's worse is when they do this, say, 6 days earlier it may go unnoticed by other editors, however when I take notice and revert it to it's original wording all the sudden he'll revert it and say "take it to talk" - well excuse me, you MADE that change without going to talk first and now all the sudden I have to achieve a consensus on the previous consensus? I love[REDACTED] in so many ways, but I just hate the way that controversial articles are sometimes based on an editors POV rather than the facts at hand -- Historyguy1965 (talk) 03:38, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry to interupt here, but I can't resist.

1) I did consult the talk page. It's all there, although some of it's archived now. There is currently a careful discussion as to what the article should call "same-sex marriage" in ancient history. Were you unaware of this, or did you just feel that discussing the issue with others was a waste of your time becasue you're right?

2) A new anon IP editor came in and made all kinds of changes a few days ago without consulting talk. Because of how it was done with multiple edits, rebuilding the section was a headache. David and I had a dialogue going, that you didn't bother to check, evidently. There was a clear conflict between editors, so I inserted some temporary neutral wording, so as to not have to delete the entire passage. Your implication that I snuck in and made changes without consulting talk is 100% off base.

3) As for the citation tags, why do you constantly remove them without consulting talk? They should stay until there is a consensus to remove them. Once you removed a clarification tag, and replaced it with a reference to Webster's dictionary. Seriously? Was that sarcastic? You remove citation tags and give the reason "what are these doing here?" Why not take it to talk first? These actions are highly counterproductive.

4) The entire conflict is based on this change that you made without consulting the talk page. I have seen several editors call you on this behavior. Don't explain an edit in the tag on the history page (and obviously when it involves content, as it did here). Explain it on the talk page, before you make it. Especially on a highly controversial topic.

5) So you say I'm inserting biased POV everywhere. Then why is it that the serious editors on there (David, Nat, Yobmod, Tommy, etc.) have no problems working with me? Because I have learned to take it to the talk page and work towards a consensus.Ragazz (talk) 08:59, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks John, appreciate the reply. Apologies that he's brought the argument into your talk, he sort of has a tendency to follow me and simply disagree. I will not continue it here -- Historyguy1965 (talk) 18:39, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

RfC

- it is now ready if you want to certify so it can be official. Ottava Rima (talk) 03:52, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

• Please don't certify this nonsense, John. It's little more than drama-mongering. UnitAnode 05:30, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
  • Ottava's to be certified? Long overdue. --Joopercoopers (talk) 10:06, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

A bit confused, honestly. Users who certify a dispute are expected to have attempted to resolve the dispute ("at least two editors must have contacted the user on their talk page, or the talk pages involved in the dispute, and tried but failed to resolve the problem.") Could you define exactly what the "dispute" in question is, and what exactly you have done to resolve the problem, paying specific notice to the fact that the evidence section you have certified mentions the user in question but once, and only to show that they interacted with a sockpuppet. Hipocrite (talk) 17:28, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

I have contested your certification of the Bishonen RFC. As you may be aware, certifiers of an RFC are required to provide evidence that they tried and failed to resolve the dispute prior to the filing of the RFC. No diffs of your attempts to resolve the dispute were provided. If you cannot provide evidence of your attempts to resolve the dispute, I will strike your certification. Thanks. Hipocrite (talk) 18:00, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Please note that unless you or someone else can provide a diff of you (or them) attempting to resolve a dispute with Bishonen, the RFC will be deleted in 36 hours. Hipocrite (talk) 04:35, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Bad block

John, assuming good faith, it’s entirely possible that your recent display of incompetence and admin tool abuse was simply an oversight. Issuing a block so you could have the last word is a pretty shameful example of bullying. I hope you sure more maturity in the future.

Even though you refused to correct your action, egos are such fragile things, I’m willing to forgive and forget. To err is human.

Please keep an eye on Sarek and make sure he leaves Otter alone. Stalking and hounding from an admin involved in content disputes with a good faith editor when the same admin is engaging in enforcement actions towards the editor is totally unacceptable. That Sarek continued to flaunt common sense and decency immediately after the ANI report by pursuing Otter to a new venue is particularly outrageous.

If you’d like to help (instead of hurt) efforts to rein in the harassing trolling that goes on here, I encourage you to keep an eye on Tarc, Mathsci, and WMC. Take care. ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:21, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Xenu

Hi John, I would be grateful if you might be able to mediate between Cirt and myself at Talk:Xenu#Revert_regarding_what.2C_according_to_Hubbard.2C_is_designed_to_cause_pneumonia. For whatever reason, Cirt and I seem to be talking past each other a little. Cheers, --JN466 19:53, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

RfC shenanagins

The referral is to this which in turn refers to this and this. Fainites scribs 21:38, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

• Once you post there and ask, and you can ask why she defended Geogre when he was edit warring and the rest knowing that he had a sock puppet in the dispute, then there is beyond a doubt no more technical problems that they are using to justify their games. Ottava Rima (talk) 14:15, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Suggestion about the RfC

If you examine the requirements of certifying an RfC, you'll notice that you have to have been directly involved in trying to resolve the dispute. As you were not so-involved, you should probably remove your invalid certification. UnitAnode 20:07, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Which is 100% false, as John was involved in trying to settle the edit warring, which Bishonen contributed to. Ottava Rima (talk) 20:26, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

• Sorry about the "no email" thing, John. I can understand why you'd want to discuss it privately (see directly above me here), but I prefer to keep Misplaced Pages discussions on-Wiki. UnitAnode 20:29, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Why are you so rude?

Why do you keep on reverting me? Realist01 (talk) 10:56, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

I have just blocked "Realist01". -- Hoary (talk) 12:26, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Microstates wikiproject

Please think twice before adding the microstates wikiproject template to popes that predate Pius XI. Vatican City was only created in 1929. It's a bitch of a stretch to apply it to medieval popes, as you did here. Savidan 02:13, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

So are there any articles currently tagged with WikiProject Catholicism that you wouldn't tag with the microstates project? I'm fine with you tagging buildings and artworks within Vatican City, but tagging every pope, including some who probably reigned from the Lateran, not the Vatican, seems excessive. Savidan 14:01, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Canonical criticism

I saw that you made a comment a while suggesting that we have this article, which I've just started. StAnselm (talk) 03:26, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Xenu II

Hi, if you could look in again at the talk page of our favorite galactic overlord; I reworded the proposal following your comment. I think what we have at the moment is still a bit clunky, but I am open to suggestions. --JN466 12:35, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Edittools

What fixed your problem? ---— Gadget850 (Ed)  15:33, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Baasically, I copied the edittools page linked to into my own, blank, edittools page. And that seemed to have worked. I'm guessing the fact that the page was blank up until then might have had something to do with it, but I honestly don't know enough about this to be sure. John Carter (talk) 15:39, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

User:John Carter/edittools.js was not blank, it did not exist unit you created it. Even then, it is not called by User:John Carter/monobook.js, so it isn't doing anything. Did you try anything else? I'm thinking that we need a Help page on edittools, and I am in an information gathering phase. ---— Gadget850 (Ed)  16:33, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

You may have a point. What I did was copy the name tha the monobook page was copied from, and, then pasted it onto the equivalent name for my page and purged the cache. The only other thing I did was create a similar page at MediaWiki, because that's where the copied page was. That's it basically. I suppose it's possible purging the cache had something to do with it, but I can't imagine how, as I'd done that before regarding other matters after trying to change the edittools, and got no results. I wish I knoew more, and having an instruction page would probably help, but that's all I know. Sorry. John Carter (talk) 16:46, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Please

As I posted to Malleus to ignore your comments, please just ignore him. There is no way for it to go but down, and the comments were not worth enough on either side to merit the strife. Ottava Rima (talk) 02:07, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Commenting on Giano

Your comments about Giano on Mattisse's talkpage go beyond unhelpful. It feeds her perceptions of persecution and doesn't assist her in moving past her problems in any way. She needs blunt honesty -- not attacks, just honesty -- not coddling. UnitAnode 16:28, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Seeing as how your earliest contribution is 21 March 2009 and you weren't around for the disputes or the history, you really have no understanding of what Mattisse needs. Unless, of course, you want to claim that you had a previous account. Ottava Rima (talk) 23:46, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Your input here was completely unnecessary. I was addressing John, not you. UnitAnode 23:58, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

Your comment was about Mattisse, and it has been clear that you have crossed the line. Ottava Rima (talk) 02:03, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

As long as we're banning folks

Consider yourself banned from my page as well. I will direct all comments which I feel you need to see through a third party. Your behavior here is beyond erratic, in that you somehow think it's okay to allow Ottava Rima to comment about me here, but not for me to respond. Any further comments from you at my talkpage will simply be reverted without being read. Direct anything you feel I need to see through Sandy, Moni, or some other third party. This has been a truly surreal experience. UnitAnode 02:27, 14 October 2009 (UTC)