Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 05:57, 21 October 2010

Quotes applicable to my opinion that- Misplaced Pages's belief that "verifiable" trumps the truth is stupid

Some Wikipedian's beliefs that being verifiable is somehow more important than being the truth is dangerous. I am not the only one who believes this about "facts". Facts that are sourced and presented in[REDACTED] but that are not true are dangerous because they present themselves (since they are referenced) as the truth. This perpetuates things that are wrong, not only because of the proliferation of that information through "mirror-sites", but through other websites that use[REDACTED] for THEIR sources, and just through the people who look here and then go tell their friends. Most importantly it makes[REDACTED] unreliable to professors, teachers, the media, professionals/experts, and the general public. Misplaced Pages has a bad reputation not for having unsourced material, its reputation stems from just plain WRONG material. I am a strong supporter of Misplaced Pages:Use common sense and support the current push to strengthen it and make it an official guideline.

Feel free to add quotes you think that apply to this position or ones you make up yourself or just a comment supporting the position if you agree!

• In science, any compromise between a correct statement and a wrong statement is a wrong statement. user:Stephan Schulz; pulled from User talk:JzG
• I was provided with additional input that was radically different from the truth. I assisted in furthering that version. Colonel Oliver North
• A long habit of not thinking a thing wrong gives it a superficial appearance of being right. Thomas Paine
• Ignorance is preferable to error, and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing than he who believes what is wrong. Thomas Jefferson
• An age is called Dark, not because the light fails to shine, but because people refuse to see it. James Michener
• The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance -- it is the illusion of knowledge. Daniel Boorstin
• Three minutes thought would suffice to find this out; but thought is irksome and three minutes is a long time. A.E. Housman
• The greatest ignorance is to reject something you know nothing about
• The recipe for perpetual ignorance is: Be satisfied with your opinions and content with your knowledge. Elbert Hubbard
• The evil that is in the world almost always comes of ignorance, and good intentions may do as much harm as malevolence if they lack understanding. Albert Camus
• Truthiness is 'What I say is right, and anyone else says could possibly be true.' It's not only that I feel it to be true, but that I feel it to be true. There's not only an emotional quality, but there's a selfish quality. Stephen Colbert
• Per a blog, "William Faulkner wryly commented, 'Facts and truth really don’t have much to do with each other.'" a blogger, about William Faulkner

• Only facts can be mistaken, never so the Fuehrer! - Ironic diary note by Heinrich Mann after listening to a boastful radio speech by Adolf Hitler in the autumn of 1939. Mann, of course, is thinking of actual true facts, not fabrications! From "Zur Zeit von Winston Churchill", Mann's diary notes from the first months of the war (highly recommended if you know German and are interested in how that time appeared to an acute onbserver caught in the middle - Mann's elegant put-downs of Hitler, his discussions of the power games and his gradual shift of main loyalty from the Soviet Union to Britain are fascinating)

• He seemed as easy to read as an open book, but an open book really only shows two pages out of hundreds, doesn't it? - Sven Wernström, Swedish author.
• Thinking is dangerous here, especially for non-thinkers! - Lars Gustafsson saw a big signboard warning swimmers of perilous water currents in a lake on the fringe of then East Berlin, and just changed out the verb.

Barnstar

		The Half Barnstar
		I award you, Camelbinky, the left half of this barnstar for your excellent combined efforts with doncram for work on Capital District-related articles as of late. Note that had you stayed in retirement, you never would have been able to receive this. :-) upstateNYer 06:54, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Rapp Road Community Historic District

On May 2, 2009, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Rapp Road Community Historic District, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Dravecky (talk) 06:51, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

The DYK phrase, up now, is Did you know

• ... that during the First Great Migration, the majority of Shubuta, Mississippi, moved to Albany, New York, with some recreating a religious rural community in Rapp Road Community Historic District?

Hey, congratulations! doncram (talk) 10:10, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

Wow

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		I, Wadester16, award Camelbinky the Tireless Contributor Barnstar for his efforts at List of incorporated places in New York's Capital District, which is thorough, including images, and must have taken an insane amount of time to create and get right. wadester16 | Talk→ 05:16, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Realization

Just wanted to point out a recent realization: then → now = wow! wadester16 | Talk→ 20:42, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

thanks

For standing up, taking my question as a question, and insisting that others view this reasonably. Sometimes I feel pretty lonely here, tonight thanks to you and some others I don't and i appreciate that, Slrubenstein | Talk 21:14, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

I should have mentioned this too. Same author. People won't connect the dots ... Slrubenstein | Talk 21:40, 18 October 2009 (UTC)

DYK for Beeren Island

On January 5, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Beeren Island, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits your article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 12:00, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Re: This may be useful for you...

Thanks. And this may be of use to you. Transcribed for my research, but thought it may help you source some things. upstateNYer 01:33, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

I have two discrepencies with that source compared to French's Gazeteer, which itself is not always reliable. So I have been searching the actual colonial laws, and I have put on that page in small print the parts regarding Pittstown that I have been unable to verify. If you happen across more sources with more information backing up Pittstown's history I would be grateful for any changes to make the Timeline of town creation in New York's Capital District more accurate. Pittstown is one of those towns that seem to have multiple forms of spelling and capitalization format (Pitt's Town) the farther back you go so its hard to do a word search for it.Camelbinky (talk) 00:42, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

Plus even today, their government is just so small that there is no real "organization", if you will. Weird place. I'll keep my eye out. upstateNYer 01:59, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

What is the equivalent word for mass (liturgy) in Judaism? upstateNYer 02:58, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, I had to actually research exactly what the word mass meant before I could answer this! I assume you want a word refering to a "religious service" in the generic form since Jews dont celebrate "mass" (apparently a Roman Catholic term) under any word (whereas Orthodox Christians and some Protestants do but often use a different term). The most common terms in English I know of that are used by Jews are the generic terms like "service", "religious service", or "prayer"; especially among Reform Jews who are more assimiliated into US culture the sentence most likely to be heard is "I'm going to services tonight", often with the holiday mentioned. If you need a Hebrew word- tefilah is the hebrew word for prayer and avodah is the word for worship (or prayer service would be better I guess, I dont know if it really means to "worship" like as in "he worships money"). There are specific special prayers in the Jewish liturgy such as the Sh'ma and Kiddish; and the mincha is a religious prayer reading (or full service) for orthodox and conservative Jews done daily; the siddur is the name of the prayer book. I guess I cant really answer if there is a direct word for liturgy used by Jews... I would just use a generic term.Camelbinky (talk) 04:32, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Misuse of sources

See here and here. Gun Powder Ma (talk) 14:00, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

I'm confused as to what this is in regards to... My apologies for not being clear headed right now and not putting the pieces together.Camelbinky (talk) 23:10, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Ah, I believe these are specific instances that show what we've been discussing on the WP:V talk page regarding sourced information being false and ties into the quotes at the top of my talk page as well. Thank you for this. It is sad there are so many of these instances in which information looks to be well-sourced but in reality the information bears no resemblence to the source itself.Camelbinky (talk) 23:21, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Category fix

Category:People from Capital District, New York really should be Category:People from New York's Capital District. Same with Category:Television stations in Capital District, New York. Categories are a bit finicky, so I'm not sure if it's a simple move. Would you be willing to look into this? upstateNYer 02:37, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Sure, I'm just re-reading the Capital District article again for grammar and spelling and such. Once I'm done I can goof around with moving it, probably a simple move to a new name, though I guess I'll have to write down all the articles in each category and go back to change the category name because we dont want them categorized to a redirect...Are those the only two or are there more? (and Im sorry if I'm the one who created the categories and put the wrong name! ooops!)Camelbinky (talk) 02:48, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

There's a way to make a cat redirect to another cat, but it's not as simple as a regular redirect. Might have to ask around a bit. Not sure if you it's as simple as moving a category to a new category name, though. Again, will have to ask around a bit. upstateNYer 20:30, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

US News and World Report and the CMT

If you could give a few details about the article I'd like to track it down and see if it would add to the article. Eugene (talk) 17:53, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Not just one article, an entire special edition devoted to the entire subject. Should still be on the newstands; I got my copy at Walmart. I can get the actual magazine issue number and other relevant information if it is still at my work tomorrow and wasnt put out in the trash.Camelbinky (talk) 17:59, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Is it this one? Or this one? I might be able to get full text access online, if I can locate the exact issue. --Akhilleus (talk) 19:58, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

First one.Camelbinky (talk) 22:20, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll see if I have access. --Akhilleus (talk) 00:19, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Sadly, I don't seem to be able to access it online. --Akhilleus (talk) 02:06, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I dont recall USN&W being JSTOR but anyone with access to a college library (or a large public municipal library) can go to JSTOR for free and perhaps it is there; I'm sure there'd be lots of different articles from different journals on this topic anyways so it may be worth it. Its a shame there is (to my knowledge) no way for the Foundation to pay for a subscription and then allow all editors of Misplaced Pages to use the subscription. It truly would be an invaluable source, especially for topics like this that get lots work published in professional journals that are hard to access.Camelbinky (talk) 03:25, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

How do you want to handle this?

You posted some comments on my talk page. Do you want me to respond on your talk page or do you want me to respond on my talk page? How do you want to handle this? By the way, I don't consider you an enemy, in spite of my good faith comments regarding your accusations against Eugene. You simply made, IMHO, a slanderous comment. If that was not your intention, then I'm willing to assume good faith and ignore it. But if you really intended it to be slanderous, then we can discuss it in another venue. Please note that my comments on ANI were NOT meant as a threat, or as an attempt at bullying. I sincerely believe there is an injustice being done, and I simply want to give detractors the opportunity to reconsider their emotional outbursts so that we can all work together to create a great article. Thank you for your consideration. Bill the Cat 7 (talk) 23:21, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

How do I want to handle this? I want you and Eugene to drop the whole issue of Slrubenstein "being mean" to Eugene. Other than that I have no intention of continuing this or of apologizing for having my personal opinion that Eugene made poor choices in continuing to make comments that multiple editors told him MUST stop. You are not helping yourself, nor Eugene, by making the statement you made at AN/I or here on my talk page. Btw- slander is spoken, and it along with libel are legal concepts; as Eugene was warned at AN/I by multiple editors- please dont use such words when making accusations against other editors. I appreciate that you are fighting because you believe there is an injustice; however please appreciate and accept that the only injustice I saw was the analogy and comparison Eugene made and continued to make even after he was asked by many editors to stop. I have no intention of this being continued, respond wherever you wish, that wont change the fact that I dont care.Camelbinky (talk) 23:32, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. Thank you for frankness. But let me reiterate, I'm not your enemy, and I have no intention of treating you as such. We just have a difference of opinion. Bill the Cat 7 (talk) 23:47, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments in the Slanderous Accusations of Anti-Semitism thread. I don't think we met but thank you! jbolden1517 10:24, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Facebook/Wikipedia integration

Facebook has made a page for anything you want to put on your profile, so if you say you're from Albany, New York, it links to a Facebook page that currently defaults to an imported version of the article from here. Talk about pressure! That's a lot more eyes seeing our work! upstateNYer 01:16, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Well...that's going to definitely up our readership on the plus side! Its just such a large article with alot of work from many different editors already put in it... its not like when we did the Capital District article where we pretty much did it from scratch; I just dont know if I have it in me to help on an overhaul of an article so established with so much good sitting next to so much that needs cleaned up, there's multiple issues with it and articles that need to be spun off from it... still burnt out from my marathon of "creating something better than a stub" for every hamlet in Albany County that I could find something notable or interesting about; BUT I think starting tomorrow I can start working on it...Camelbinky (talk) 03:16, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Surge on Albany, New York

I think we should tackle this. Let's bring it to GA status. I think you were using NYC as a basis, but that's under WP:FAR right now, and honestly, it's not that great. However, Washington, DC is a recently elevated FA and also a capital city. I think the first step, along your expertise, would be to summarize History of Albany, New York for use in the main article, only noting general things (nothing too specific, is all I'm saying). Let's start the rewrite here. When DC made it to FA, it was covered by the Washington Post. I wonder what could happen to us. :) I'll also work on finding good/better images for use in the article. upstateNYer 22:19, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

Didnt know that about NYC, that's sad, lots of editors have worked hard on that article, but it probably suffered from too many cooks in the kitchen because it was such a popular article. Sounds good to start it in a sandbox first. Ill start the second I have can schedule a big block of time.Camelbinky (talk) 18:00, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Nice. On a very unrelated note, would you mind putting your 2¢ in here? Don't get too long winded or upset, please. :) But I'm sick of the conspiracy theories. You've seen my work, and I think you appreciate and respect it. Maybe you can impress upon them I'm not here to blow the place up and/or ruin someone's life? upstateNYer 21:41, 24 April 2010 (UTC)

Ignore the above comment. It has been taken as canvassing. While that was not my intent, I can see where they're coming from. Getting back to more productive matters, after reading DC a few times, I think we can hit this section by section, possibly even copying what they used there. I'm gonna start on the Media section I think. upstateNYer 02:17, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

GRRRRRRRR! After simply skimming the link you sent me (which is why you should delete things you dont want me to see instead of striking them through ;)) I must say I'm PISSED at how this is being handled and if it wasnt for so many editors watching my talk page hoping I say something uncivil... Lets just say I didnt like Rico's comments at ALL of the many places this Ely issue has come up with and I havent liked Delicious Carbuncles comments at pretty much any place I see him/her, this isnt my first go-around with that editor. I didnt see where they accused you of canvassing but if they said anything even remotely rude about me or towards you for doing it please let me know. As far as Rico's comment saying "Jimbo called it a hatchet job" that is taken out of context and let Rico come here and say it wasnt taken out of context because it was I was at the discussion and read first hand Jimbo's original comment and he had gone on and given you AGF and said the sources used already painted that picture, you were going by the sources, I did not see that Jimbo accused you of anything improper, though perhaps we should have him comment and see what he thinks of your work if they are going to throw around Jimbo's name like that. ARRGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH! One freakin article is ruining the overshadowing and ruining the reputation of the NYCD wikiproject, I think we've done so much good and now this....Camelbinky (talk) 05:25, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Yea.

We'll get over it. I need some citations at Albany, New York/Rewrite#Media. Has some great facts, but few sources. I got some in for newspapers, but that's about it. Once we cite all those statements, that section will be done. upstateNYer 05:54, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

I'll do my best on those sources tonight, though I'm probably going to hit the hay soon. You should consider it too, must be past 2am your time.Camelbinky (talk) 06:01, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Yup it is. Also, what's the name of the state office complex located here: 42°40′46.77″N 73°48′34.82″W / 42.6796583°N 73.8096722°W / 42.6796583; -73.8096722 Is there an article for it? upstateNYer 06:08, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Governor W. Averell Harriman State Office Campus; it was established by the said governor, predates the ESP and next door SUNY campus (both of which were constructed by Governor Nelson Rockefeller) by at least a decade or two. Pataki had plans to move just about all state workers out to downtown Albany, Schenectady, Troy and completely sell it off to a developer as a mixed use tech/office space with townhouses, hotels, parks, eliminate the ring road and demolish all but one or two state buildings, connect it to the surrounding communities and the university, Spitzer reworked the plans from scratch with little enthusiasm for the idea, and finally Paterson has killed it, there is currently plans of selling off bits and pieces and giving some to the university. The state police academy is there, squished between the ring road and the university campus. The portion along the top on the north side of Washington Ave was already sold two decades or more ago to a private company and is now the Patroon Creek Corporate Park.Camelbinky (talk) 06:18, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Would you be able to start a stub on the Harriman State Office Campus? Linking to W. Averell Harriman in the name of the office campus is kind of, well, I don't like it. If we could link to an actual article, even if it is a stub, that would be loads better. I have a couple pictures I can upload, too. Just let me know if/when you need them. upstateNYer 01:59, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Can probably do that tomorrow. It has actually been tough finding information on specifics of the campus as the number of employees, sq footage of office space, and even the acreage of the campus has changed constantly, I cant even guarantee that the info I put in the Albany rewrite is the most up-to-date there is.Camelbinky (talk) 03:01, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Even the amount of published information on the ESP is surprisingly low. How annoying. upstateNYer 03:12, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

For the ESP you may want to check European sources if at all possible, I was actually quite surprised when I was in Spain about 15 years ago and again about 11 years ago how many people not only knew Albany but actually knew Albany BECAUSE they knew of the ESP, apparently it got quite a bit of coverage across Western Europe during construction and many of the older folks still remember.Camelbinky (talk) 03:27, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Replies

How bout this?

Well what do you think about this charming cliché?! Admittedly, Tulip Fest hasn't started yet, but some of the flowers are up. I wish the rest of them were up during this, but oh well. upstateNYer 01:45, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

Good photo, but I'm not much a judge of what makes one photo better than another. I've gotten used to the one of the photographer with all the tulips and grape hyacinth. But this one may be of more encyclopedic value by being able to be tied into prose about the activities that go on at TulipFest (including artists like the one shown). Both should be on the TulipFest article no matter which you decide should be at the Albany article. I forget sometimes how far ahead Missouri is when it comes to the seasons and flowers, our tulips died off last week and its the almost the end of the season for irises as well, I didnt realize the TulipFest hasnt even begun yet. Related topic- I'm going to start getting sources for the state office campus, an article on it would be interesting.Camelbinky (talk) 03:17, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

True. Let's keep up with the rewrite of Albany, too though. We're off to a good start. upstateNYer 03:21, 28 April 2010 (UTC)

P:NYCD DYKs

Please consider adding some of your DYKs (or new ones) as suggestions for the DYK section of Portal:Capital District. We need a bunch. Thanks! upstateNYer 15:48, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Albany County maps

You probably already noticed in your watchlist, but ZooFari just created new maps for Albany County towns and villages, and one master map from the whole county. I put them in the articles. They are all located at commons:User:ZooFari/AlbanyCounty. We'll be moving on to Saratoga County sometime in the near future. Just an FYI. upstateNYer 02:57, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Oh, I also moved Coeymans (town), New York and Altamont, Albany County, New York to their correct titles. Also an FYI. upstateNYer 02:59, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Awesome work! Since I dont go on commons (other than when I'm downloading something to it) can you pass on to ZooFari my thanks? And I never understood why Altamont was disamb in that way in the first place, I could understand some logic behind Coeymans.Camelbinky (talk) 03:13, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

Random question

Are you aware of a statue of a Frenchman on State Street that would happen to have the title of Marquis? Or possibly a park or some other memorial or monument to a Marquis? upstateNYer 18:00, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

And apparently it can be any State Street in the Capital District: Albany, Troy, Schenectady, maybe even Saratoga has a State Street? upstateNYer 04:56, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Albany Rewrite

How would you like to take a stab at User:UpstateNYer/Albany, New York Rewrite#Neighborhoods? You are the expert, since you wrote the article on it. upstateNYer 15:51, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

I love the new photo on the cityscape section, minimizes the highways, shows the river in prominence, and includes the DEC building and 677 Broadway. The DEC building is probably my favorite modern building in Albany and rarely makes it into shots of the skyline. If you can ever get a photo of it I'd love to have one as you drive east on Sheridan Ave (one way so you have to) its a perfect shot to get the whole building and dome and spire. I'll get on summarizing the neighborhood article into a section. Three paragraph max? I'll also see about some of the citation needed for the architecture section, I think I have some of those handy.Camelbinky (talk) 16:20, 22 May 2010 (UTC)

Map of Albany neighborhoods

Can you give me the link to that map of the Albany neighborhoods you posted recently? And if you know of any others (maybe simpler ones?) that would be good too. I'd like to see if ZooFari can make us one. Realistically, the simpler the better. upstateNYer 23:10, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

and but these are the boundaries of only the neighborhood associations and therefore dont show all neighborhoods in the city, many overlap as well.Camelbinky (talk) 23:21, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

What do you think about taking that first link, downloading it, making it into a PNG, and putting in your own version of the neighborhoods, then ZooFari can base his map off of that. Interested? upstateNYer 01:29, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Might take awhile, I used to have Corel Draw 9 which would have been perfect for that, but havent found the disk to put it on the computer I have now; not sure if I have any programs that would allow to do any type of editing like that. I will work on it though. May have something on work computer or use one at the university.Camelbinky (talk) 01:41, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

You can use something as simple as Paint. We just need the general lines so ZooFari can know what to do. upstateNYer 02:21, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

I was just reading McEneny's book and he refers to Hudson/Park as Hudson-Park; his version looks nicer. Do you have any real affinity (or comparable source) for sticking the the slash rather than the dash? upstateNYer 01:30, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Photo request

Three questions — (1) Do you ever contribute photos? (2) Are you ever in the vicinity of Duanesburg in Schenectady County? (3) If the answers are "yes" for both of these, could you try to visit and photograph the Reformed Presbyterian Church Parsonage? I'd like to expand this article, since Doncram's found the NRHP nomination form and I have church-related sources that aren't available online; if you can get a photo, it would definitely improve the article. Nyttend (talk) 03:11, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunately the answer to both 1 and 2 is no due to the fact that I'm actually 1,000 miles away from the Capital District. I do love Duanesburg, beautiful scenery. Hopefully User:UpstateNYer will see this thread and can let you know if he can make it out there; he's the one with photography skills.Camelbinky (talk) 22:36, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Maybe. I've never been all the way out there before; I do have a friend that lives out there, so if I even end up going to his house, I'll be sure to take my camera along. Sorry for the disappointing answer. upstateNYer 01:55, 26 May 2010 (UTC)

Hmm, okay; thanks. I asked Doncram's advice and he suggested that I talk with you; I'd seen you around, but I had no idea that you were interested in eastern New York or that you weren't anywhere near it. Nyttend (talk) 00:31, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

I grew up in the Capital District for the vast majority of my life and have physically been to most places from that area with a Misplaced Pages article. Will be returning eventually soon. I do what I can from internet sources but once I move back I hope to do more physical research.Camelbinky (talk) 00:44, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

You're way ahead of me, as I've only been to New York three times — (1) going from Niagara Falls to western Pennsylvania when I was ten, (2) going to a family vacation in New England when I was twelve, and (3) coming home from said family vacation. We stayed in St. Lawrence County on the way up, and we did nothing but driving the highway from Hartford to Scranton on the way back, so I doubt I've ever visited the Capital District. Nyttend (talk) 00:54, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

The great thing about the internet is that you dont need to actually visit someplace to contribute great material to Misplaced Pages, in fact I think you learn more interesting things when your a "cyber tourist" (the famous saying about having lived someplace your entire life and still never having been to the most famous tourist place in the area (eg- the Statue of Liberty for New York City residents) comes to mind). I look forward to reading your work.Camelbinky (talk) 01:01, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, but the Internet doesn't help me contribute my own free pictures of faraway places :-) Most of my writing is about historic sites that I've visited, and I'm rather heavily biassed toward print sources that might be hard to find if you're not in the area, so I don't have as much use for the online sources. Admittedly, I've been in the famous saying position; except for being in college, I've always lived in the same place, but never visited the well-known twin chateaux in my county until last summer, and I never saw most of Beaver County, Pennsylvania until I was just almost done with college there. Nyttend (talk) 01:14, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Geography Barnstar
		For your efforts creating notable articles for tiny hamlets in New York state. Please continue your efforts. Firsfron of Ronchester 14:57, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. Very kind.Camelbinky (talk) 22:38, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Mayoral term

How long is a term for the mayor of Albany? Can you put that in the rewrite and include a source? I'm having trouble finding that information. Use a recent source, otherwise you could be using out-of-date information (or even the current city charter, though I can't find a full copy of it online). upstateNYer 22:02, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Would you believe that Don Rittner has a Misplaced Pages account (and an article for that matter)? upstateNYer 00:07, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

I would say he deserves having the article, especially since we've used at least 5 or 6 of his books as sources in probably at least two dozen articles. Sad we have not seen him around Misplaced Pages before, its one thing to get info from his books, its another to get it straight from the source that actually lived the history we are writing! Not only does the Pine Bush partly owe its continued existence to his archaeological work (which before him the King's Highway was mostly seen as mythological, he proved it was a real working road), but also several buildings still stand in Albany because of his access to the mayor (Corning). I always thought he was more involved in Troy and Albany, didnt realize he's actually Schenectady based! If we could get Rittner and Jack McEneny to edit "full-time" you and I could "retire" from Misplaced Pages. ;)Camelbinky (talk) 00:46, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Just so you know, I created Sports in New York's Capital District so we could put all the good info in the Sports section in Albany, New York somewhere after I rewrite it (because that section won't be very long, in the end). I stole the paragraphs from the sports section in Capital District and used that as the intro for the new article. The new article is now listed in {{Capital District}}, so there should be plenty of links to the thing. upstateNYer 03:03, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Im not well-versed on when minor-league hockey seasons run but I do believe the River Rats have finished out their last season in Albany and are playing in wherever-ville now. I can look it up and update the article once I find out.Camelbinky (talk) 20:42, 2 June 2010 (UTC)

Are you aware of two sources that will work to finish off the Transportation section of the rewrite? One is for the historical trollies/trains, the other is for the bus services. I'd prefer to have one source for the buses rather than sourcing to 3 or 4 different things. Have a read thru the section; I'd call it done, save for those two sources. upstateNYer 00:18, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm actually stopping for the night, but tomorrow do you mind me adding to the article some historical transportation significance to the section? Plank roads, turnpikes, stage coach lines, the Erie Canal and Albany Basin, and the Mohawk and Hudson railroad (oldest steam powered railroad in NY state)?Camelbinky (talk) 00:50, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Sure, sure. Go ahead. upstateNYer 01:51, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the NY Capital District barnstar! My knowledge of the area is next to nothing so if you're aware of any facts of local relevance that I've missed out, then please add them. Good work on all the New York places and points of interest you've created! Sillyfolkboy (talk) (edits) 07:42, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

You did an awesome job, I had just discovered that article and was amazed at your work, very detailed.Camelbinky (talk) 20:04, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

Dead TU links

I'm not sure why, but a lot of the TU references you're putting in articles (see your Wash Park article, for example) are dead and bring you to a login page for the Merlin One system. Also, this citation that you used at the Transportation section in the rewrite is dead. When I went looking for it in the TU archives, I couldn't find it. Can you re-find it or see if you can find it in one of the Albany books? Also, this is the way we should be citing the TU from now on. The publisher is Hearst and the work is the TU. Just FYI on that one. upstateNYer 02:08, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

• Cahill, Timothy (2003-08-17). "Trains in Albany: Once we built a railroad..." Times Union (Albany). Hearst Newspapers. Retrieved 2010-06-10.

They are not dead links, if you bring up the in a second tab then the link will work when you hit the link on your tab with Misplaced Pages, so you just have to have both Misplaced Pages and the TU archives up at the same time. That makes it inconvenient but wp:V does not require that everyone needs to verify, just that someone could; and online links are not required, if you would prefer we can remove the links and the citations would still be valid since I do make sure to put the page number and date, someone can go to a library and look it up on microfilm. When it comes to the TU references I feel a bit uneasy about always using the Hearst Corporation as the publisher since some of the older TU articles in the archives (and Knickerbocker News ones that are pulled from the TU archive page) may be before Hearst bought the papers, I am currently unaware of what year that occurred and if that makes it an issue. Do you know if it would be an issue?Camelbinky (talk) 11:24, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Addendum- the problem with the Trains in Albany one seems to be a server problem for now, I will check again later.Camelbinky (talk) 11:26, 11 June 2010 (UTC) Update- It used to be all I had to do was make sure I had the TU archives up at the same time... now it seems there is a bigger problem, I am unsure if this is permanent or not. For now when I using the TU as a source I will just not put an URL in at all and use cite newspaper instead of cite web.Camelbinky (talk) 11:46, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

I wouldn't go so far as to remove links. They seem to work for me, so I'm not sure why the ones you put up didn't work in the one article. But even if they do exist on paper somewhere, this is the internet and we want to err on the side of linking. upstateNYer 18:26, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I just checked a bunch of other articles I did, and everyone of the TU links I tried that were post-MerlinOne switch over are not working for me, all the ones pre-switch over to Merlin One and therefore have in the url achives.timesunion work fine... so its affecting just about all the work I've done and I'm out of ideas on what to do. Do you have any TU citations you've put in since Merlin One that are still working? If I can take a look at them maybe I can figure out what is different and fix the ones I put in.

On different topic- do you have any good biographies of Stephen van Rensselaer, I'd like to start History of New York's Capital District and I figure he's going to be quite prominent in it, the Erie Canal, Harmony Mills in Cohoes, RPI in Troy, the Mohawk and Hudson Railroad, and the Lumber District in Albany were all at least partially financed with his money/support (and on his land) plus the numerous hamlets built on land he sold to someone with a dream of a new community and then the Anti-Rent Wars because of his death; I figure I could get an entire section based just on what happened during his life.Camelbinky (talk) 17:37, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

I ran across something once (a full book), but I can't find it on Google Books now. Here's his obit, though. And I was working on it at User:UpstateNYer/StephenIII if you want a place to start. upstateNYer 22:12, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Albany rewrite history section

Are you planning on rewriting this section? There has been precedent where a history section for a city FA has subsections based on historically significant events. However, it can't be too long. So let me know what you plan to do, because if you're going to do it, I'd like it done reasonably soon. :) Much of the rest of the article is complete and other sections are quickly coming to a finish. Let me know what you think! upstateNYer 22:08, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

I think it best to probably leave it to you if you dont mind. You've done a great job on the rest and as you know I have trouble keeping things short. I can do a fact-check on whats there and help, but I have a couple different articles I'm interested in creating right now and spending most of my time finding sources for them. I'm sorry :(Camelbinky (talk) 22:21, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Sounds good; I'll keep chugging along. Can you start reading over what's already there and making comment/changes? A proof read would be good. I'm also looking for a source on the square mileage of the city (and water). The source given doesn't actually state those numbers. upstateNYer 01:50, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

I've put up some notes and have done some minor changes, and added a couple references today. Hope it helps, will continue to look and hope I come across some more refs for the citations needed.Camelbinky (talk) 02:05, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Yea that would be great. There are a few that have evaded me. I'm trying to get the general article done, leaving {{fact}}s when needed, with the hopes of clearing them up eventually. So far I think this is going swimmingly, though. upstateNYer 02:19, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Some serious referencing is needed for the neighborhoods section, too, btw. I'll start doing that when I finish the other stuff, but since you know most of this, I figure you know good places to get the refs? upstateNYer 02:21, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Largest employers in Albany

This citation link doesn't work. Do you know of a source that lists, say, the top five employers in the city of Albany (Capital District data is second best, but I'd like to stick to the city itself). upstateNYer 03:08, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

• "Capital Region Profile" (PDF). CB Richard Ellis and Schenectady Metroplex. p. 6. Retrieved 2009-06-03.

Hmmmm, I'll do my best to find a new link to replace that dead one... but when it comes to JUST the city that info is going to be a bit harder to come by... I have a few ideas of places to look and may get that info to you by 2am your time. Other info, if you want it, that I may be able to get since it will also be along the same places I will be searching is the number of people who commute to the city of Albany and the daytime population of the city (which is the total population of Albany plus the people who commute into the city minus the residents who commute out of Albany) which might be interesting to put in the Albany rewrite to compare to the census population.Camelbinky (talk) 01:01, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

Re: Commons

Hello Camelbinky. I'll take the request. Is there anything you would like to disinclude or add additionally? --ZooFari 22:12, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

No, I think whatever is labeled in the watershed map can be labeled on the Commons map. Thank you again! I think without you and Upstater I wouldnt have been able to do half the work I've done.Camelbinky (talk) 04:43, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Okay, but of course to avoid copyright infringement (unless the image is PD) I might change the icons a bit. Would that be okay with you? --ZooFari 05:20, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Oh, yea, I forgot that it had little icons representing something about where they did environmental tests, those you can leave out. I was just thinking about that you could keep the streams, the names of the lakes and streams, thats pretty much all I need. Sorry I should have looked at the map again.Camelbinky (talk) 15:02, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Have a look at these

Got a great photo of the Siena men's basketball team to add to Albany, New York and take a look at page 43 of http://content.yudu.com/A1i64y/09-10MBBYearbook/ Should look familiar to you. Though I got too much credit; they aren't all mine... :) upstateNYer 13:23, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

That's amazing! I feel bad you dont get paid for any of the multiple times your photos have been used for things. I definitely feel like I should be sending you a check every time you step up and provide me with a photo for an article.Camelbinky (talk) 21:03, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Hey, if checks start showing up at my door, I won't complain. :) Btw, have a look at the Sports section; what do you think? upstateNYer 23:17, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Sports section looks good, I wou����H��:GET http://0.channel38.facebook.com/x/9etball team (both the original and the recent) and their replacement, cant remember the team's name. I dont know if its technically a minor league team by definition, they play at the Armory and did pretty good this season.Camelbinky (talk) 00:15, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Also, can you finish the last paragraph of "Religious life"? I'm not well versed in Jewish culture/affairs in the area. There is at least one dead link. upstateNYer 23:23, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

I dont believe the link is a dead link unless you happened to have labeled the wrong link as dead. All Karaite websites, like many Orthodox (Jewish) websites, do not work on Shabbat, Friday sunset to Saturday sunset (I would personally say that's taking the "dont work on the Sabbath" Commandment a bit literal, but I dont get to make the rules). Perhaps you happened to click the link during the Sabbath? This can of course cause further confusion in the future with others clicking the link, perhaps an invisible comment explaining the problem, if of course you find the link does still work for you. Any other link I find to replace this one will continue to have the same problem as I can not find a reliable source about Karaites outside of their own community.Camelbinky (talk) 00:27, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

You are correct. I didn't see that one coming. upstateNYer 00:57, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Almost done...

I'm almost done with the map. I just need the locator. Can you inset the location on this map using annotations? --ZooFari 01:26, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm dumb, it's already on there. --ZooFari 02:07, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

 Done. I hope this is something you were looking for. Let me know if it needs to be tweak or something. --ZooFari 02:28, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

WOW! Amazing and thank you so much! Dont know how to repay you but when you find out let me know!Camelbinky (talk) 16:21, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

My pleasure. Did I get the file name and description right? If not, let me know since it's not too late to rename. --ZooFari 17:56, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Looks fine, both Normanskill and Normans Kill are both acceptable ways of naming the creek. The file name is very descriptive of what it is.Camelbinky (talk) 18:06, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Alrighty then, let me know (on my Commons page) if you need anything else. --ZooFari 18:25, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

Albany history

Hey, I know you said you wanted to stay out of it, but since you wrote the book, I was hoping you might help with my rewrite of the Albany history section. You would know better than me about the firsts, and important things that happened in the city. I'm good at sourcing. Just include whatever and I'll start whittling down. I'd really appreciate it! I'm very close to done on this rewrite! upstateNYer 22:35, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

I just added some stuff for you to look into concerning recent history (relative to a city that is 400 years old).Camelbinky (talk) 23:06, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Pile it on. I'll sort through. upstateNYer 00:14, 29 June 2010 (UTC)

When you cite a book on google books, use {{Cite book}}. While it may be on the internet, it's really the book you're citing. And don't include an access date. My theory on it is that the link is there as a bonus for a citation to a book, and you don't include an access date for if you were citing it as an offline source. Just my 2¢. Oh and if you see other jewels like that Albany Lumber District pamphlet, list them in the new Further reading section. That's perfect for people that want to know more about a very specific part of Albany history. upstateNYer 14:12, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Also, do you think that the first sentence of the history section, "Albany is the oldest surviving European settlement from the original Thirteen Colonies and the second-oldest chartered city in the United States," is true? Have you seen it elsewhere? I'm not sure citing a travel guide is in our best interest. What are your thoughts? upstateNYer 14:19, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Unfortunatley because Albany IS so old different sources will cite Albany as "the oldest..." or the "second oldest... " depending on the following- 1) definition used of city, a legal definition or just as a "settlement", if the first defintion then yes Albany is the oldest surviving CITY of the Thirteen Colonies, if you count places that are not cities TODAY (either dont exist anymore like Jamestown or places that are hamlets, villages, or towns) 2) "oldest city" as in oldest by date of incorporation as a city or oldest as in "oldest settlement that is today a city based on when first settled", either way I do not believe it is the second oldest chartered city in the US; 3) Based on when the source is written- many sources talk about Albany being one of the four oldest settlement in the US, behind Sante Fe, Saint Augustine, and Jamestown; if a source is prior to New Mexico becoming a state (1912?) then the source usually doesnt even count Sante Fe even though US territory; if the source is written prior to Westerlo Island (today's Port of Albany) being annexed from Bethlehem then Albany's date of settlement is listed as the construction of Fort Orange and not the earlier settlement of Fort Nassau (North) on the island as that was outside the city limits until (1934?). A source that simply states "Albany was one of the first and still one of the oldest European settlements in what is now the United States" that would be vague but still true.Camelbinky (talk) 14:42, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

The United States talk page has a list of FAQs. We should include that: "Is Albany really "the oldest surviving settlement from the original Thirteen Colonies and the oldest chartered city in the United States"? Then we give a sourced answer. I wanted to include a FAQ about the viewpoints we have here on Corning, which are mainly negative, explaining that, no this is not political, it is just the truth; he didn't do much. However, I'll word it a bit more professionally than that. Would you be willing to put together the answer for the oldest city FAQ? upstateNYer 16:03, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

I can do that, and worded the way you put it I would say yes to first part (if defining settlement to mean just European and not Native American in order to eliminate Hampton, VA, those editors have made their way to Albany in the past to protest Albany's claim); however finding a source to prove it will be difficult, bordering on impossible. Second part I would reword to something along the lines of "city with the oldest continuously used charter" (but less convoluted grammar), since the folks over at New York City claim previous Dutch charters as "city charters" making NYC a city prior to their Dongan Charter (a point I disagree with), either way NYC was in fact chartered a few months before Albany making it possibly the oldest chartered city in the US though not continuously since during Leisler's Rebellion they did forfeit their charter, whether other cities were chartered in VA or MA prior to Albany as well I can not answer right now.Camelbinky (talk) 16:21, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Okay, changed the wording to "oldest continuously chartered city in the United States". That should do it for that statement. upstateNYer 16:36, 2 July 2010 (UTC)

Parks section

I need a source for the Liberty park statements. I haven't found a reference to it any of the city websites (granted it is just a small piece of grass, so I wouldn't expect it). Do you have one? upstateNYer 20:52, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I never updated that, when I did research to confirm this blog's] story I came to the conclusion that I can not confirm its assertion without access to the book The Patroon's Garden and Liberty Park, Albany, New York by Paul R. Huey. The blog is the same one that brought me to the attention that 48 Hudson Avenue was in fact the oldest building in Albany so I assumed this story would have been just as easy to confirm as the other. Based on maps it is possible it is in fact the oldest park but I have no source that states this. I recommend removing it from the Albany article.Camelbinky (talk) 21:01, 4 July 2010 (UTC)

We'll just use that as a source. The nearest library with a copy is the NYS Librar. I'll make my way down there someday and find the page it's on. But since she's claiming the statements with this source, it's just like if we claimed any other off-line book source. upstateNYer 16:15, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm going to teach you how to get yourself a DYK. The state office campus article is awesome; I can't believe you expanded it so much already. Find the most interesting fact from it and put it here. We'll get it on the Main Page in a few days. upstateNYer 18:42, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

How about this: Did you know... that the W. Averell Harriman State Office Building Campus in Albany, New York, has an underground bunker designed to withstand a nuclear attack and assure continuation of the New York State Government? Camelbinky (talk) 21:32, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

That's perfect!!! I made some minor adjustments to it, mainly because DYK has a 200 character limit. Sorry to have to cut off the 9/11 reference, but I had to. upstateNYer 22:57, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Follow its progress at Template talk:Did you know#W. Averell Harriman State Office Building Campus. upstateNYer 22:59, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Very cool! I had always assumed the DYK process was more complicated. It was also interesting to read the other noms, a few actually did get me into reading the full article.Camelbinky (talk) 23:44, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Two things

There are three {{fact}} templates left in the Neighborhoods section of Albany, New York. Can you resolve these? Second, the last paragraph of the Architecture section pretty much mirrors the last paragraph of the History section. What should we do? I would presume we should combine them and put it in only one section, but which? Do you have other "History" stuff from the past 20 years that I could replace development stuff with in the history section? That would allow me to move the development stuff to the Architecture section. upstateNYer 01:17, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I merged them and put them in architecture. Now what to do with history? upstateNYer 01:53, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure, broad statements about rebirth of downtown (and other neighborhoods) and other large projects from the 1980s onwards? Demographic changes of increasing minorities? Political changes (and lack thereof) in the Democratic Party, the split of the city caucus from the county caucus due to the suburbs becoming a larger population center than the city and with the suburbs becoming increasingly Democratic versus Republican resulting in the city being less important in county-wide races.Camelbinky (talk) 02:31, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Some refs needed for Albany

I'm looking for an explicit ref that state that Albany became county seat in 1683 when the county was created. Also, the neighborhoods section needs some serious sourcing, and you're the expert. :) Care to tackle that one? Coming really close to peer review and WP:GAN time! upstateNYer 00:54, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Do my best when I can, I have some family in town so might not be on much, dont know if there would be a source that explicitly states Albany became the county seat at creation, best best would be the Albany Colonial Social History Project of the NYSM, most sources would take it for granted since in 1683 there wasnt exactly any other serious population centers than Albany itself in the entire county.Camelbinky (talk) 07:30, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Re: Mount Olympus in Troy

Sorry, forgot you asked about this. I have heard the term, mainly in older books (Weise maybe?), but they never actually tell you where it is. Book just assumes you know what the colloquial term means. Sorry I can't be of more help on that. You could email someone at the Rens Co historical society. upstateNYer 03:10, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

I found it on my own the next day so dont worry, and I wasnt all that impressed with what I found out, its basically that ridge between Middleburgh and Hoosick that Fifth Street (I think) cuts through, why it was even given a name, let alone one so grand is strange, definitely not notable as far as I can tell unless it has some history to it, even though older sources say that Mt Olympus and the hill that Prospect Park is on "are the two main geological features", which may have been prior to the annexation of Lansingburgh, South Troy, Sycaway, and Albia all of which include much higher ground than "Mt Olympus".Camelbinky (talk) 21:29, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Gotcha. Nice ref additions re Albany populations stats, btw. upstateNYer 02:18, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

DYK for W. Averell Harriman State Office Building Campus

On July 15, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article W. Averell Harriman State Office Building Campus, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 18:03, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Just so you know, the article got 1200 hits today. And Albany got 500 hits today. See how much DYK is? upstateNYer 02:56, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

Pretty cool! Thank you for setting that one up.Camelbinky (talk) 14:31, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

I checked the hit status of some other places linked to from that article and saw that Albany Pine Bush also got a significant jump that day, I think that may be the next overhaul I'll be working on when time permits.Camelbinky (talk) 00:05, 17 July 2010 (UTC)

Barnstar

		The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
		For an amazing rewrite of Albany Pine Bush, complete with dozens of sources. --Gyrobo (talk) 23:53, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Wow, thanks! It feels good to know people take notice so quickly.Camelbinky (talk) 23:58, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

Almost done!

Are you aware of any sources for the Nightlife and entertainment section at Albany, New York? Especially the 4am last call time? Only one more section and this article is ready for peer review! :) upstateNYer 02:26, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

I know from experience that last call is in fact 4am, but have no idea what kind of source would actually have that information, I can start with the websites of some local bars.Camelbinky (talk) 02:39, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

Do you remember which editor it was that put the current climate chart back in the article? I remember there being an argument, but I can't find that documentation. One of the links he uses as a source is dead and I want it fixed. upstateNYer 13:20, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

I believe it was User:Mathpianist93.Camelbinky (talk) 13:25, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

Nominate eligible articles at WT:DYK!

Hey, your rewrite of Albany Pine Bush is more than appropriate for a DYK nomination. I did it myself. Either you need to write a new article or bring an article to having 5x the amount of text in the last five days you've worked on it. You've done that. So I nom'ed that article for you. Keep it up yourself! upstateNYer 05:33, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

I already nominated it on July 19th. I also nominated Rensselaer Lake on the 22.Camelbinky (talk) 14:29, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Oh, good! I didn't even check. Removed my nomination. upstateNYer 18:39, 25 July 2010 (UTC)

Overlinking

Re this, you'll find the relevant guideline at WP:OVERLINK, as I made clear in my edit summary. --John (talk) 14:07, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

John, please read it again. New York in the article is not linked to at all, it needs to be linked to at its first mention, you may be getting confused from Albany, New York being linked right before it, but the New York part of that is hidden as I have it being shown as only Albany. Yes, there may be several links together but this is acceptable because words/phrases like New York are something that must be linked to, same with Scotland, Ireland, etc. Anything in a Geobox/Infobox like place names are to be linked as well.Camelbinky (talk) 14:15, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Really? Where does it say that? WP:OVERLINK has "What generally should not be linked; Unless they are particularly relevant to the topic of the article, avoid linking terms whose meaning can be understood by most readers of the English Misplaced Pages, including plain English words, the names of major geographic features and locations, religions, languages, common professions, common units of measurement, and dates". Is there a special reason this article should depart from the MoS guidance? --John (talk) 14:19, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Oh, your right do whatever you want, every single other settlement/city article is wrong. Thank goodness you came along because every other editor has been doing it wrong. Sick of this crap.Camelbinky (talk) 14:24, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I pretty much do the same thing. I've never read the MOS on linking in infoboxes, but common sense would say that you want the links in the "quick info" sections so readers need not search for the link in the text (which could literally be 5000 words down the page). I also always link relavent terms in image captions for the same reason. I've never read the discussions that led to the MOS guideline (nor do I plan to). Our process works and it's very common-sensical. In my opinion, these situations are separately governed, in a way. upstateNYer 02:11, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

We've always linked county name and state name in community articles, and United States has always been linked since it was added to the country-context-less original Rambot community articles. No reason to stop now. Nyttend (talk) 00:49, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Patroon Creek

Hello! Your submission of Patroon Creek at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Nsk92 (talk) 14:41, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

You might also want to think about archiving at least a portion of your talk page, as it is getting rather long. Nsk92 (talk) 14:41, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I also have an article that is a DYK contender. This is how I discovered you. I have a productive comment to make but prefer to do it by e-mail to prevent embarrassment. If you enable your e-mail (under "my preferences" at the top right), you can send a message to me and I will reply. If you have a "junk mail" e-mail, that is ok, as long as you check in a day or two. Good luck on the DYK! After hearing what I have to say, you can remove your e-mail from my preferences. Suomi Finland 2009 (talk) 01:22, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

McKownville

Afraid you're wrong with one thing; I'm not much of a fan of controversy, and thus I've done almost never anything with policymaking. Nyttend (talk) 00:48, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

No problem. I've only rarely encountered you, although if you look higher on this page you'll find a comment about the Duanesburg area. Nyttend (talk) 19:35, 29 July 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Albany Pine Bush

On July 30, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Albany Pine Bush, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 00:03, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Rensselaer Lake

On August 3, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Rensselaer Lake, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 12:04, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

		The Editor's Barnstar
		Nice job on expanding Rensselaer Lake. Bearian (talk) 17:43, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

Thank you! Could still use some work but at least with the publicity of a DYK I hope it will get copyedited and more, I make alot of grammatical and spelling errors! I just nominated Fort Orange too.Camelbinky (talk) 01:13, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Copy edit of History of Albany, New York

Take note. A table of mayors is not a good idea since it would be redundant of List of mayors of Albany, New York. Can you nix some of the less notable ones? upstateNYer 01:53, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

I would forget the table altogether. Other than Schuyler and Livingston the mayors of that time period werent very notable due to such short terms being appointed by the governor for usually a year or two or as long as he felt.Camelbinky (talk) 12:32, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Patroon Creek

On August 6, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Patroon Creek, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 12:04, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Fort Orange

Hello! Your submission of Fort Orange at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Radagast3 (talk) 05:40, 8 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Fort Orange

On 13 August, 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Fort Orange, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 18:02, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

Where did the Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents discussion go?

I strongly share the opinion that you raised in your most recent post to the discussion, but now I am unable to even locate the discussion. Do you have any idea what happened to it? It doesn't seem to have been archived, and the visible link to it does not work when I click it. Is it possible that the discussion has been somehow "hidden" from public view? If that were the case it would not help restore my confidence in the wikicommunity. Inniverse (talk) 21:48, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

		The Socratic Barnstar
		For the accurate and eloquent points that you made within the discussion: Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents: Admin Buckshot06 re-prodded article and displayed incivility when challenged Inniverse (talk) 22:00, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. I would have felt better if Buckshot had simply admitted his wrongdoing and apologized to you, but he did admit his re-prodding was wrong, that's a start. The unfortunate thing is someone with a bad-reputation also complained and that muddied the waters about how Buckshot treated you. If Buckshot hasnt learned his lesson then am sure there will be another instance where this will come up at AN/I again, in that case I suggest you keep an eye out and remind people that the next time wasnt the first time. The problem with the thread not showing up was that it was closed in a wrong manner technically, but that was fixed by Fences&Windows. There wasnt anything more that could have been done keeping it open anyways, but I hate how it was called "admin flogging". But what are you going to do?Camelbinky (talk) 23:34, 15 August 2010 (UTC)

barnstar material

You deserve a barnstar for noting in VP about disclosures.

There is a lot of knee jerk reaction. It seems, like I knew, that people want to be anonymous and along with that comes a bit of internet idiosyncrasies. Jimbo Wales wrote an op-ed piece about internet behavior (however, his article was more about nastiness).

I completely realize that the mechanics would be very hard to implement. However, the thought of it, which you seem to agree, shows that we are very mindful of our responsibility as editors.

I do not think any proposals for disclosures will pass but I think the idea of disclosures is an honest and ethical proposal.

Thank you! I agree it wont pass, but hopefully you put some good ideas into individual's minds and got them to think a bit more.Camelbinky (talk) 00:36, 27 August 2010 (UTC)

Non-breaking space

Ah, okay, I see what you've done on Albany Pine Bush. You're using   to separate refs from sentences that end in wikilinks. Do you think that's really necessary, since the punctuation marks aren't included in the links? It's not a big deal, I just didn't realize what you were doing there.
--Gyrobo (talk) 23:14, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

For most reviewers for FA (and some for a GA) they require non-breaking spaces to keep references from floating off on the next line from the sentence they are referencing. Some users automatically just put non-breaking spaces on every reference to keep it together with the punctation/last word of the sentence; I simply check both Firefox Mozilla and Internet Explorer and if either renders the page with a floating reference I put a non-br space on it. That's all it is, to keep references from being on the next line separate from the sentence it references.Camelbinky (talk) 23:50, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

Okay, that's cool, I was wondering if it was an actual rule somewhere or just personal preference.
--Gyrobo (talk) 23:56, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I dont think it is a rule anywhere, but ever since I had a GA where one of the reviewers demanded it I've always erred on the safe side of putting them in ahead of time so I have it covered. I mean it doesnt hurt anything to have them in.Camelbinky (talk) 00:16, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Woodlawn Preserve

Hello, your nomination of Woodlawn Preserve at DYK was reviewed and comments provided. --NortyNort (Holla) 11:33, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

I dont think I can expand Woodlawn Preserve enough to meet DYK :(Camelbinky (talk) 23:46, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Woodlawn Preserve

On 1 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Woodlawn Preserve, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 06:02, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

two things

I think the index article is a fine idea. I'm also working on this, which may be of interest to you. upstateNYer 02:12, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Very nice. 48 Hudson Avenue has some sources that might be useful for you, like how the ACC has (at least preliminarily) said they want to preserve the building as some sort of museum/greeting center, and at least from what I can see in the proposed drawings they are keeping their word. McEneny had proposed at the last minute a fourth possibility (besides the two proposals downtown and the State Street site), that of putting it at the ESP in the grassy area with the giant cisterns, which would be right next to the existing pedestrian bridge to the Pepsi anyways. Hope that helps you find more sources and information.Camelbinky (talk) 02:50, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

I didn't see anything about the fourth proposal. Anyway, I'm pretty much done. I have a copyedit request in so it will get read through by an expert. upstateNYer 21:29, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Im pretty sure you ARE an expert! If I can find the TU articles on McEneny's proposal would you like them?Camelbinky (talk) 02:25, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Woodlawn, Schenectady, New York

On 3 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Woodlawn, Schenectady, New York, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

The DYK project (nominate) 00:03, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Template on commons

Note. upstateNYer 23:32, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Your input requested

Albany, New York is a current featured article candidate. Your input and a review would be appreciated as I try to get this to the Main Page! All comments, criticisms, praise, etc. are welcome! upstateNYer 23:30, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Input

Is the map at right correct for Schenectady County? Could you fill and label the towns and villages? I don't know Schenectady that well. The borders also confuse ZooFari. You can just click and drag the image to your desktop, open it in paint, and fill with representative colors (for villages, fill them with a lighter version of the color used for the town they are in). Put some text to label, then upload. Hopefully ZooFari can work off that. Also, it might be time to archive your talk page! :) upstateNYer 02:10, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I would love to do that... but what map?Camelbinky (talk) 02:22, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Ha! Minor details: File:SCRATCH.svg. upstateNYer 02:29, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I can still do what you said with that, but if this works it would be easier and quicker than me editing that one. On that link Schenectady County is obvious, Schenectady inside that county is the city (of course) and the two italicized names (Delanson and Scotia) are the only two villages, the other names labeled are towns. Delanson is in the town of Duanesburg and Scotia is in the town of Glenville. Let me know if it isn't clear enough and I still need to do the editing.Camelbinky (talk) 02:33, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Addendum: Actually editing that map would be a bit difficult as it shows the city, towns, and CDP's but does not show either of the two villages and my drawing of the boundaries of the two villages would be sloppy at best.Camelbinky (talk) 02:36, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

We just want towns, cities, and villages. Can you send ZooFari a map to base the borders off of? I don't want CDPs. upstateNYer 20:04, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Hamilton Hill

On 10 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Hamilton Hill, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 00:02, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Cmt

In an effort to trim the Albany, New York article, I've created Architecture of Albany, New York. I need something DOWNRIGHT FASCINATING to propose at DYK. Any ideas? Also, do you still use that aol account? upstateNYer 20:03, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Mont Pleasant, Schenectady, New York

On 11 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Mont Pleasant, Schenectady, New York, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Materialscientist (talk) 00:03, 11 September 2010 (UTC)

Kingston corporate history

You're right, I forgot ... Kingston wasn't a city until the villages of Kingston and Rondout merged, along with a nearby hamlet, around that time (I wrote as much in Kingston City Hall, after all). But did Kingston have some sort of grandfathered legal status as of 1777 or so that would be analogous to a village? Daniel Case (talk) 13:57, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Interesting. One thing I've always found interesting is that the Town of Kingston is not coterminous with the city. I wonder if the Town of Ulster was founded at some later point out of most of the Town of Kingston. Daniel Case (talk) 17:14, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Rochester is actually considered part of Western New York as well. Daniel Case (talk) 07:22, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

No, they wouldn't be. Go ahead and put it into "Metro NYC" or whatever you want. Daniel Case (talk) 21:14, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

I refer the honorable gentleman to the reply I gave some moments ago. Daniel Case (talk) 03:18, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Reply from Commons

Thanks Camelbinky. So would this be correct now? --ZooFari 23:47, 13 September 2010 (UTC)

Want another DYK?

Template:Albany, New York only has one red link. Care to make it blue? upstateNYer 00:00, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

User:Camelbinky/Normans Kill unfortunately is not going along as well as I had hoped, but will continue to plod away.Camelbinky (talk) 00:17, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. Feel free to add to the template. upstateNYer 02:50, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Bellevue, Schenectady, New York

On 14 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Bellevue, Schenectady, New York, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

Calmer Waters 18:03, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Do you have a virus?

I keep seeing these weird links showing up when you leave messages. It's not happening while you edit articles, is it? PS, Albany currently lacks the info on Joseph Henry. Care to fit it in? upstateNYer 03:07, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

After looking at my user contributions it seems to be my home computer, so I will be only editing at work as time permits until I can figure out what exactly is wrong with my home computer. This will constrain my ability to respond to anything but those links definitely are a cause for concern and I definitely dont want to be responsible for any damage!Camelbinky (talk) 17:59, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

DYK for Downtown Schenectady

On 18 September 2010, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article Downtown Schenectady, which you created or substantially expanded. You are welcome to check how many hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, quick check ) and add it to DYKSTATS if it got over 5,000. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

— Rlevse • Talk • 06:02, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

Map of Albany wards

Are you aware of an online map showing the boundaries of the common council wards? upstateNYer 14:38, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

Not off-hand... I do recall seeing one of the county wards after they were redrawn from the 2000 censusbut I do not recall ever seeing any city ward maps. There are 15 wards, and they would be altered after the 2010 census anyways, might be worth waiting a year or two, but I will start searching for any ward boundary maps dated from after 2000 anyways, I might get lucky.

Side-note of interest- If I am remembering correctly because of court challenges regarding minority representation it wasnt until 2002 or 2003 when the county wards were last redrawn and finalized, actually very interesting because apparently lumping part of Arbor Hill with part of Loudonville was considered racist by some (ironically by those who also tend to be Democratic voters) but the whole reason they were lumped together was to dilute the White-Republican-suburban vote by using minority Democratic urban votes thus making more Democratic safe-seats but making less minority-as-the-majority seats (rule of thumb is that minorities need to make up at least 80% of a voting district in order to elect a minority, thus making it a minority-majority district), some groups sued claiming since the city was one-third African-American then one-third of the county ward seats from the city should be African-American as well. The motive of the gerrymandering for racist motives of diluting minorities would have made it unconstitutional but doing it for purely political gerrymandering reasons to dilute Republicans actually was perfectly legal and constitutional, but since the Democratic-controlled county legislature couldnt come out in court and explicitly state their reason because it would be bad-form and bad press the court had no choice but to err on the side of it being racist and order redrawn lines based on minority-majority districts of a more representative number.Camelbinky (talk) 02:17, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Ha, that is interesting. upstateNYer 01:59, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Map requested

Hey Camelbinky. I'm close to finishing the map you requested earlier. I don't know what the underground pathway is, assuming you refer to the map on pg.25 rather than pg.24. Also, I saw only one other tributary, which is the one directly east of the 6-mile reservoir. I'm having trouble reading the label, it looks like it reads "unnamed tributary" or something like that. And one more question: do you want Loadonville Reservoir included as well? If you can clarify these then I'll be ready to upload in no time. --ZooFari 20:18, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

BTW, see Upstate's talk. --ZooFari 20:57, 18 September 2010 (UTC)

{re from COM) The quality is not a big deal I would think. I'm not sure how the underground trails are labeled (the map key does not specify it). Is it the yellow line, the green one...? . --ZooFari 00:12, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Here you go. I added the extra reservoir so the map would not look too empty. If you find the map with the underground paths, just drop a note at my Commons talk and I'll make the addition. Let me know if this works. --ZooFari 03:09, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

Albany Pine Bush review

I just thought I'd tell you that I reviewed your article on the Albany Pine Bush, and that I put on hold. There's more information on the review page. Bernstein2291 20:34, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Congrats on GA! upstateNYer 18:18, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. I hope to get Washington Park Historic District (Albany, New York) and Dongan Charter promoted and once those are done then Tech Valley and SUNY System Administration Building.Camelbinky (talk) 18:30, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

I didn't even realize this happened! This is great!
--Gyrobo (talk) 18:46, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks

For your simple but true and logic words on my talk page, I have no idea why Noleander keeps pushing his POV on a number of articles he has created, including inserting again and again the "Black Hebrews" section in Racism and ethnic discrimination in Israel even though it so much contested on the talk page.RS101 (talk) 21:51, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

Is Albany an interior city or a coastal city?

You probably laughed at that header. However, somebody is legitimately asking the question, and a lot about the Port of Albany-Rensselaer is coming up. You wrote that article, care to weigh in? upstateNYer 14:58, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Talkback

Ref on APB

I know you've got a lot on your plate right now, but I can't seem to find a certain Times-Union article. I'm looking for "For 30 years, Save the Pine Bush has fought for ancient barrens", but the only complete version of that article I can find is the one up on the Save the Pine Bush site. We're trying to remove/supplement Save the Pine Bush references, per the fac discussion. You seem to have the gift of finding any Times-Union article, so I was hoping you'd work your magic.
--Gyrobo (talk) 21:41, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

Done.Camelbinky (talk) 00:02, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks again. I just wanted to point out a few things, though. {{Cite newspaper}} gets redirected to {{Cite news}}, so you may want to just save yourself the keystrokes. Also, you've been including the newspaper name under the |work= parameter, but there's a |newspaper= parameter specifically for newspaper names. {{Cite news}} doesn't specify |work= in its documentation. I just wanted to let you know that, because your research and citations have been excellent.
--Gyrobo (talk) 00:35, 21 October 2010 (UTC)