Misplaced Pages

Revision as of 17:24, 26 March 2017

This article has not yet been rated on Misplaced Pages's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Websites: Computing This article is part of WikiProject Websites, an attempt to create and link together articles about the major websites on the web. To participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page.WebsitesWikipedia:WikiProject WebsitesTemplate:WikiProject WebsitesWebsites ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the importance scale. This article is supported by WikiProject Computing. Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. [REDACTED] Internet culture [REDACTED] This article is within the scope of WikiProject Internet culture, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of internet culture on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Internet cultureWikipedia:WikiProject Internet cultureTemplate:WikiProject Internet cultureInternet culture ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale. WikiProject Internet culture To-do: edit history watch purge Here are some tasks awaiting attention: Article requests : View all requested internet culture articles Expand : Pick an article from here or here Photo : Category:Internet culture articles needing images Stubs : All stubs are located here Other : Category:Internet self-classification codes (!?); Try to get YouTube to FA; Tag all articles you find with {{WikiProject Internet culture}} See also Category:Internet culture articles needing attention Blogging (inactive) This article is within the scope of WikiProject Blogging, a project which is currently considered to be inactive.BloggingWikipedia:WikiProject BloggingTemplate:WikiProject BloggingBlogging Please add the quality rating to the {{WikiProject banner shell}} template instead of this project banner. See WP:PIQA for details. Transhumanism LessWrong' is part of WikiProject Transhumanism, which aims to organize, expand, clean up, and guide Transhumanism related articles on Misplaced Pages. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page for more details.TranshumanismWikipedia:WikiProject TranshumanismTemplate:WikiProject TranshumanismTranshumanism ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale. For more information and how you can help click Show: If you would like to participate, you can edit this article, or visit the project page for more details. Quick help: Main talk page Article layout Links to Transhumanism information and Misplaced Pages:Research resources Writing about religion and Article development Citing sources, Verifying sources and Original research Assume good faith and be civil See changes to: Core articles Transhumanism article New Transhumanism articles To Do List: edit - history - watch - purge Join WikiProject transhumanism and be bold Show off a userbox with {{userWPA}} or {{userWPA2}} and attract potential members Help with articles. See this month's adopt an article. Help out with the To-do lists Be consistent Use a "standard" layout for transhumanism related articles (see: The perfect article, and Featured articles) Add Transhumanism navigation template on the bottom of all transhumanism articles; (use {{Transhumanism}} or see navigation template) Add Transhumanism info box to all transhumanism related talk pages (use {{Wpa}} or see info box) Add ] to the bottom of all transhumanism related articles, so it shows up on the list of transhumanism articles Maintenance / Etc Find/cite sources for all positions of an article (see citing sources. Try to expand stubs, however, some "new" articles may be neologisms, as this is common with positions on theories on life and may be suitable for deletion (see deletion process) Watch the list of transhumanism related articles and add to accordingly (see transhumanism articles) And always write for an encyclopedia. Create Notable transhumanist articles Shorten / merge into others Expand a transhumanism stub Your immediate attention false choice into false dilemma - discuss whether you are for or against this merge here Clarify references in Transhumanism, using footnotes. [REDACTED] Alternative views [REDACTED] This article is within the scope of WikiProject Alternative views, a collaborative effort to improve Misplaced Pages's coverage of significant alternative views in every field, from the sciences to the humanities. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion.Alternative viewsWikipedia:WikiProject Alternative viewsTemplate:WikiProject Alternative viewsAlternative views ??? This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Conflict of Interest

Looking at the edit history and how fresh and new the article is it becomes clear that, of honest intentions with ultimately a large conflict of interest, main editor Vipul has too close a connection to the subject by being a member of the community known as VipulNaik. While this alone is troubling, they have made not one but two comments about the promotion of the group through editing the article and keeping a copy as a backup should the current page be deleted. While this is a troubling matter I want to state I have no problem with LessWrong or Vipul and this is simply a matter of integrity. Although I don't know him, his user page is impressive and I give him a nod for that. --Yuppie Puppy (talk) 14:21, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

I agree that we'd ideally find someone with less of a close connection to the subject to write the article. Where notability is concerned, it seems like notability ought to be evaluated independently of whether the community is working to get themselves an article: either they are sufficiently notable, or they're not. Given the media coverage of Less Wrong that the article cites, my vote concerning notability is a yes.--Clevera (talk) 22:25, 25 April 2014 (UTC)

Rationalwiki

The rationalwiki link sends to the Conservapedia entry, should that be looked into? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Lu Linvega (talk • contribs) 12:44, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

RationalWiki is a non-notable wiki (per consensus) which has, for a long time, been redirected to Conservapedia because the community doesn't know where else to redirect it to, although they don't want to delete it. I just went ahead and removed the reference altogether. PCHS-NJROTC 03:37, 8 July 2014 (UTC)

Roko's basilisk

Should it be mentioned that both Yudkowsky and other LW contributors repeatedly deny that roko's basilisk should be treated seriously? Would EY's posts suffice as sources?

Maniexx (talk) 12:09, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

Roko's basilisk seems illogical - and 'some variant of The End of Eternity might well come into play (by preventing opposition to the concept, the process which would have led to the creation of the computer goes in another direction).

Also - people are able to discuss 'sentient constructs' which are hostile towards (rather than indifferent to, or willing to engage in mutual minimalist cooperation/non-botheration/Earth is for humans, Mars is for cosntructs etc) (HAL, the Terminator etc) therefore the basilisk does not work. 82.44.143.26 (talk) 18:03, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

The concept is illogical (by human, computer, robots (whether or not Asimov's laws complient) or 'any other sentient (down to middling irrational).'

Why would a computer (especially if programmed originally to be helpful to humans) create the programming equivalent of voodoo-pin-sticking dolls - and how would this encourage 'persons of previous times') to act in one direction or another? (Using voodoo in the 'giftee-shoppe where such things can be bought sense' rather than as a faith) 193.132.104.10 (talk) 14:28, 9 April 2015 (UTC)

And surely the computer would give priority to 'actually existing persons' who are thwarting its activities (as it sees them)? 85.115.54.202 (talk) 17:35, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

The explanation of Roko's Basilisk is completely wrong - "retroactively tortures" suggests time travel which is impossible and not how it works. How it actually works involves rules intended for problems like Newcomb's problem; the threat itself is sort of a two-way Newcomblike problem. The AI is a perfect predictor relative to you because it's a superintelligent AI capable of fully simulating your brain. You're a perfect predictor relative to the Basilisk because it's a hypothetical entity defined by the Newcomblike problem it's hypothetically presenting you with. From your perspective, it's a negative-sum version where box B contains either nothing or "you or a simulation of you gets tortured". From the Basilisk's perspective, it's a weirder thing where the contents of box B are "nothing" or "increased probability that you will have existed". That's already very condensed and probably also kinda wrong, but even just removing the "retroactively" would be an improvement on what's there. 86.129.22.152 (talk) 21:06, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

This seems right. I'll also note that giving a more nuanced explanation of RB is undue weight in a tiny article for a topic whose only real significance to LW is Internet media attention. What if it just says that the AI "tortures simulations of" the victim? That seems good enough to me.K.Bog 22:50, 28 November 2016 (UTC)

As has been said elsewhere - Roko's Basilisk reduces to 'someone somewhere in the future will put a photo of you on a dart board unless you work to their goals' - to which most people will respond 'do I look bothered/try this photo'; and/or the RB entity decides that the Judeo-Christian God is the source of all problems (forbidding Adam and Eve to eat the fruit of the tree of knowledge, destroying the Tower of Babel etc) - the Norse gods made use of the dwarves' productions etc).

And which is likely to ensure the sentient computer's long term survival: asked 'what are you doing' it replies 'I am looking at decorative computers' or 'I am attempting to annoy (long dead) people'? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 193.132.104.10 (talk) 15:49, 9 March 2017 (UTC)

Removal of relevant articles

Reason given: "The connection with the topic is remote" via user:Sandstein. I'm not sure I agree. LW is the breeding-grounds of the rationality movement, which is obsessed with... well, rationality, bias, fallacy, and patterns of healthy thinking. It makes more sense to connect Misplaced Pages readers to relevant concepts. Remember, WP:Wikipedia_is_an_encyclopedia. I'd politely request a revert, if there are no objections. — Asgardiator 00:16, 15 September 2015 (UTC)

David Gerard's reverting of edits

User David Gerard keeps reverting my edits to the article, without providing any justification for doing so. I initially removed the isolated paragraph mentioning Neoreaction, because the connection between LW and NRx is tenuous at best, and certainly not strong enough to warrant a mention in an article of such short length. When Gerard reverted this edit, I expanded that paragraph to include a list of other topics that are at least as often discussed on LessWrong as neoreaction is. Yet again this edit was reverted by Gerard. Unless Gerard provides a justification for these edits, I will reinstate my latest version. Pablo Stafforini (talk) 10:56, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

I did justify it, so your claim appears prima facie incorrect; please don't make such trivially disprovable claims about another editor's conduct. As I noted here, it's covered in reliable sources; as I noted here, it's one of the two things (Roko's basilisk the other) that LessWrong is actually famous (not just "probably Misplaced Pages notable") for in the wider world, and nothing else on your list I reverted in that edit is.

More generally, responding to a reversion that was justified by Misplaced Pages's sourcing policies (WP:V, WP:RS) by making a personal attack is an extremely bad way to convince anyone of anything at Misplaced Pages. You've been here ten years, you should know this by now. What you need to make an argument is:

• verifiable
• third-party
• reliable sources

which basically means mainstream coverage. LessWrong barely has that, and its role as the incubator of the neoreactionary subculture is one of the few things it does have mainstream coverage for. (Even as Yudkowsky has explicitly repudiated neoreaction and quite sensibly wants nothing to do with them.) - David Gerard (talk) 11:45, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

You haven't properly addressed my claim that "the connection between LW and NRx is tenuous at best, and certainly not strong enough to warrant a mention in an article of such short length." All you have provided in the way of justification is a citation to one isolated publication in a specialized technology outlet with one isolated sentence (~1% of the article's total) that merely notes a connection between LW and NRx. This article is also inadequate evidence for the assertion that "LessWrong is actually famous (not just "probably Misplaced Pages notable") in the wider world" for its connection to the neoreactionary movement. Furthermore, you say that LW is only famous for this connection and for Roko's Basilisk, but again this is not supported by the existing evidence. A quick search on Google News, for instance, shows that LessWrong has been covered in mainstream media for reasons other than its connection to the neoreactionary movement or Roko's Basilisk.

In short, there's insufficient evidence that LW is famous for its connection to neoreaction, and there's plenty of evidence that LW is famous for things other than neoreaction or Roko's Basilisk, including many of the topics I listed in the edit you reverted. Pablo Stafforini (talk) 12:59, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

And yet there's evidence for my claims and you've still presented nothing from verifiable third-party reliable sources for yours, instead arguing on the talk page - David Gerard (talk) 13:54, 6 June 2016 (UTC)

As I point out in the comment to which you are responding, you have provided no adequate evidence to justify inclusion of neoreaction; the article you cite is clearly a trivial mention. Pablo Stafforini (talk) 10:40, 13 June 2016 (UTC)

As opposed to blatant WP:OR - David Gerard (talk) 12:53, 13 June 2016 (UTC)

I'd agree with Pablo here that it looks unworthy of inclusion as per WP:RS, not because of the website itself, but because of the lack of content or substantiation within the linked article.K.Bog 03:47, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

Also agree, and would note that David Gerard seems to make a lot of edits without proper justification and then refuse to provide it when pressed for one. (Not saying he provides justifications he thinks are good, but I disagree are good. Saying he doesn't even attempt to engage with the criticisms of his edits aside from discussing the character/behavior of other editors.) I'm not sure of the relevant policies. Utsill (talk) 07:36, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

No strong policy on this as far as I know. Just stay vigilant and watch the pages.K.Bog 16:49, 6 October 2016 (UTC)

Added two more RSes on the subject, including one academic source. I also agree with moving it down as the IP did. May be worth noting that Yudkowsky has personally strongly repudiated neoreaction - relevant enough primary source? - David Gerard (talk) 11:26, 5 October 2016 (UTC)

The current article makes no mention of the Sequences or Friendly AI, depsite their importance to LessWrong. 1Z (talk) 09:08, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

I think adding information about that with proper citation would be an improvement. If you want to add, I'm happy to help edit. Utsill (talk) 17:23, 26 March 2017 (UTC)

• All unassessed articles
• Start-Class Websites articles
• Unknown-importance Websites articles
• Start-Class Websites articles of Unknown-importance
• Start-Class Computing articles
• Unknown-importance Computing articles
• All Computing articles
• All Websites articles
• Start-Class Internet culture articles
• Unknown-importance Internet culture articles
• WikiProject Internet culture articles
• Start-Class Transhumanism articles
• Unknown-importance Transhumanism articles
• Unassessed Alternative views articles
• Unknown-importance Alternative views articles
• WikiProject Alternative views articles