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    Seraphim System

    Seraphim System is reminded not to respond to 1RR violations with violations of their own. GoldenRing (talk) 10:17, 14 December 2017 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning Seraphim System

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    Icewhiz (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 07:49, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    Seraphim System (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced

    Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/Palestine-Israel articles 3#Motion: ARBPIA "consensus" provision modified (1RR)

    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 02:33, 12 December 2017+ 02:14, 12 December 2017+03:08, 12 December 2017+03:15 12 December 2017+03:40, 12 December 2017: series of reverts (one has a claimed copyvio exception), I'm clumping the whole series here despite an intervening edit by Murchison-Eye as that edit was relatively minor (bolding of text).
    2. 06:16, 12 December 2017 - revert. User is aware this is 3rd revert per edit summary - "this is the third revert on a 1RR article, I asked for an exemption but for now its still a 1RR article Undid revision 815012980".
    3. 07:00, 12 December 2017 + 07:08, 12 December 2017 - attempted to correct edit conflict, but still removed several POV-tags and undue tags and some information. (may be a competence issue/mistake - wouldn't have reported JUST for this).


    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. 03:59, 14 October 2017 block for edit warring on Armenian Genocide.
    2. 01:44, 2 November 2017 block for edit warring on Greek War of Independence.
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)

    07:16, 26 March 2017 ARBPIA alert

    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    User is aware of the 1RR violation per edit summary of "this is the third revert on a 1RR article, I asked for an exemption but for now its still a 1RR article Undid revision 815012980". and has furthermore engaged in a long user talk page discussion with a user:Wiking 03:50, 12 December 2017 (first diff of a thread on Wiking's talk page regarding 1RR on this very article prior to reverting. Revert clump #3 may or may not have been intentional - however it removed several tags and some information, so am posting this for completeness.

    re I restored the information that was removed during the edit conflict, and since the pov section was combined with other sections per the undue tag Icewhiz placed while tagbombing the article, I didn't think it could feasibly be restored - Seraphim System has also removed an undue tag from the "In December 2017, more than 130 Jewish studies" paragraphed which I allegedly "tagbombed" after a discussion, by several editors, in the article talk page. Moving the Jewish reactions paragraph to American reactions (which should similarly be pov-sectioned now as unbalanced - however I cannot per 1RR) - does not alleviate the POV tag concern - and the stmt below makes clear removal of the tag was not by mistake.Icewhiz (talk) 08:18, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    re claiming the 02:14 diff was a self revert - even if true, the rest of the reverts in the edit chain between 02:14 and 03:53 were not, and Seraphim System was aware of this given the edit summary at 06:16.Icewhiz (talk) 08:18, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    @Dennis Brown:@GoldenRing: Please note that this - 00:35, 13 December 2017 is a further 1RR violation (bringing this to 4RR - and this when the initial revert clump (with a minor (non-marked) intervening edit is counted as 1 revert, 5RR otherwise) in relation to the diffs above. Not that I disagree with the edit (though it left in user:Rupert loup's characterization of just about every Jewish organization in America as "right wing" - ) - but it did undo a big block of text (which was duplicated by mistake) - including connecting text (that was not duplicated, Rupert added The statement comes in contrast to the declaration of the... to connect the two paragraphs - that was removed) - and this while on notice here for 1RR breach on this article.Icewhiz (talk) 07:39, 13 December 2017 (UTC) Note awareness to 1RR here - post to Rupert loup's talk page at 00:23, 13 December 2017.Icewhiz (talk) 07:48, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
    re boomerang - In revert#1 I clumped all edits from 02:14 to 03:40, ignoring claimed self-reverts and a copyvio claim, these three: are clearly reverts. revert #2 06:16, 12 December 2017 is unquestionably a revert. This followed by revert #3 07:00, 12 December 2017 + 07:08, 12 December 2017 - which removed tags and some contents (and was not fully self-reverted - though I'm not pressing this point). This was all prior to this complaint and discussion. Then some 16 hours later (and within the 24 hour window of the initial clump) - revert#4 00:35, 13 December 2017. It is constructive? yes - and I said so (note this didn't just remove duplicated text, but also connecting text, but still constructive). Does WP:IAR (correcting a mistake is not an exception listed in WP:3RRNO) trump 1RR and WP:OWNish issues?Icewhiz (talk) 09:53, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested

    notified


    Discussion concerning Seraphim System

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by Seraphim System

    That edit was me reverting Wiking's third revert, which I think is exempt from 1RR restrictions in ARBPIA. I've made only one revert on the article today, and that was a series of edits with no intervening edits. I've asked User:GoldenRing if this new article can be exempted from 1RR while it is in development because I can't work on the LEDE or cleaning up the close paraphrasing tag while it is under 1RR. I restored the information that was removed during the edit conflict, I didn't remove anything - since the pov section was combined with other sections per the undue tag Icewhiz placed while tagbombing the article, I didn't think it could feasibly be restored. It's an absurd thing to bring to AE before even attempting a discussion. After repeated disruptive editing on the article including the COPYVIO I removed, and editors citing opinion pieces, and not following MOS:LEDE, close paraphrasing, tagbombing, and making multiple reverts, I am finally trying to get work done, and now this.Seraphim System 08:00, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

    For example this is a self-revert that I made to address issues Icewhiz raised on talk, which I assume he is aware of since he was complaining the section was UNDUE. My counterproposal here would be a WP:BOOMERANG. The only thing here that might be a second revert, is my reverting the 3rd revert of another editor, but from other proceedings I think I remembers admins saying that reverting 1RR violations is exempted.Seraphim System 08:10, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    Icewhiz, I may have unintentionally removed a tag - it said "should not be in separate section" so should I have added that after combining the sections? I don't know, maybe add a new tag? I can restore it, but I don't think it is necessary while there is an open discussion on talk, do you? Other editors recommended you open an RfC about it, which I think is better then tagging something as undue after it has been discussed by multiple editors. As for POV section, I'm not a mind reader and you didn't discuss it with me, so I didn't really know if it should be added to the new combined section. If you still think the entire section as it is needs to be tagged for POV you can add a new tag. I really don't think this needed to be brought to AE. Seraphim System 09:04, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    Kingsindian I remember it from a past discussion, but it may have been a comment from an editor and not the admins. I will self-revert and remember in the future.Seraphim System 09:04, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    And Rupert thanked me for the edit, so if it was agreed upon between two editors and third editor should not be bringing it to AE. Fundamentally, the purpose of AE is to stop disruption. An edit that removes duplicated text is not a revert by even the broadest definition of revert. What would be the reason to block me? To prevent non-controversial cleanup of the article? I think at this point this should be a BOOMERANG or at least a warning for Icewhiz about making disruptive and frivolous complaint. Seraphim System 08:26, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
    So breaking down the alleged 5RR:
    • One is a COPYVIO. For my benefit I would appreciate clarification on this, one sentence that is a copy and paste of creative language or another persons writing is a COPYVIO and should be removed on sight. That is my working understanding. (It doesn't make a difference in this case because I think it is one of the continuous edits anyway)
    • One is the cluster of edits, that is my one intended revert. There is no intervening edit minor or otherwise. 2:14 and 2:33 were self-reverts of my work after a talk discussion that Icewhiz participated in, and there should be a BOOMERANG for this.
    • There was my second revert, which was a good faith mistake revert of a 1RR violation. This was self-reverted.
    • There was the removal of accidentally duplicated content on what is a reasonably high-traffic article right now. When Rupert got my messages on his talk page, he thanked me for the edit. Not a single word was removed or altered. Icewhiz is saying that I removed This statement comes in contrast to the declaration... - I did not, which you can see here . what Rupert changed it to was The statement was criticized by the. I did not revert Rupert's work, he altered the connecting text because he moved the paragraph, and the suggestion that I should have left what was obviously and non-controversially an error in an article that has gotten over 2,000 page views in 48 hours is not a serious one. There should be a WP:BOOMERANG for this also. Seraphim System 09:32, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

    It's not OWN, a lot of editors have added content and there haven't been any disputes or problems, aside from this. When last night's complaint didn't convince anyone, you brought something that wasn't even a revert. I don't know why you would do that, when two editors were working together to improve an article. It's not even a IAR issue, there is nothing to prevent here beyond Icewhiz continuing his usual disruptive behavior. Seraphim System 10:13, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by Kingsindian

    I read Seraphim System's edit summary the same way: they were reverting what they think is a violation of 1RR. I have a couple of comments:

    • 1RR doesn't work that way: you can't break 1RR to revert somebody else's violation. That's edit-warring.
    • People should first talk to the person involved before bringing them here. It is easy to break 1RR by mistake, and most people self-revert when asked.

    The article was only started recently and received a lot of quick-fire edits. Nothing really bad has happened. I suggest that people be warned to be more careful and no further action be taken. Kingsindian ♝ ♚ 08:18, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

    Question from Beyond My Ken

    Taking no sides here, but a serious question: if an article is under a 1RR restriction, and an editor violates that, what do you do if reverting the 1RR-violating edit would itself violate 1RR for you? Does it first go to the editor's talk page to see if they will self-revert (which I believe wouldn't be considered a violation of 1RR, is that right?), then come here if they refuse or don't respond? I've never been in the situation and I'd like to know what to do if I ever am. Beyond My Ken (talk) 21:30, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

    Sorry, I wasn't diligent enough in reading, I guess that's what Kingsindian is saying just above me -- is that the proper procedure? Beyond My Ken (talk) 21:31, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by (username)

    Result concerning Seraphim System

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • I largely concur with KingsIndian here. To answer Seraphim System's question at my user talk, no admin has authority to release this article from 1RR since it is imposed by the committee as a remedy in a case. The only possibility would be to request it at WP:ARCA, but I don't think the committee would want to encourage this sort of piecemeal exception-seeking. No action required here, but don't do it again. GoldenRing (talk) 09:50, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
    • Completely agree with GoldenRing on all points. And the remedy for someone violating 1RR is to take them here and let admin deal with it, assuming you've templated them for the proper ARB restriction prior. Any further action would be warring. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 01:35, 13 December 2017 (UTC)
    • Icewhiz, I'm not going to sanction someone for correcting an obvious mistake, particularly when they identify it clearly in their summary. Just looking at the diff itself, it is easy to see the information was a dupe of other info, so the edit had nothing to do with removing content or reverting content, it was a technical edit to make the article consistent. The actual information contained in the article was not changed by that edit, so it can't be considered a revert for the purpose of WP:AE. This is like correcting spelling or grammar. Dennis Brown - 2¢ 14:44, 13 December 2017 (UTC)

    KA$HMIR

    This request may be declined without further action if insufficient or unclear information is provided in the "Request" section below.
    Requests may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs (not counting required information), except by permission of a reviewing administrator.

    Request concerning KA$HMIR

    User who is submitting this request for enforcement
    MBlaze Lightning (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log) 02:54, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
    User against whom enforcement is requested
    KA$HMIR (talk · contribs · deleted contribs · logs · filter log · block user · block log)

    Search CT alerts: in user talk history • in system log

    Sanction or remedy to be enforced
    Misplaced Pages:Arbitration enforcement log#India-Pakistan_2: A second revert without discussion restriction. A second revert of any edit, however minor, that is done without an explanation on the talk page will lead to an immediate block.
    Diffs of edits that violate this sanction or remedy, and an explanation how these edits violate it
    1. 17:11, 19 December 2017 1st revert
    2. 17:19, 19 December 2017 2nd revert
    3. 17:26, 19 December 2017 3rd revert
    Diffs of previous relevant sanctions, if any
    1. Blocked indefinitely on 19 October 2017 by Alex Shih (talk · contribs) for not disclosing his "old account". Still hasn't declared it publicly presumably to avoid scrutiny.
    If discretionary sanctions are requested, supply evidence that the user is aware of them (see WP:AC/DS#Awareness and alerts)
    Additional comments by editor filing complaint

    This is a clear violation of the editing sanctions placed on this page by this WP:SPA. And I'd add that this is not the first time that this guy has violated those sanctions. —MBL 02:54, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Notification of the user against whom enforcement is requested


    Discussion concerning USERNAME

    Statements must be made in separate sections. They may not exceed 500 words and 20 diffs, except by permission of a reviewing administrator.
    Administrators may remove or shorten noncompliant statements. Disruptive contributions may result in blocks.

    Statement by (KA$HMIR)

    Well I will make my simple case here but will abide by whatever is the board's final decision, whatever it will be, though this looks like a bad faith report. As far as I know regentspark the 1RR restriction from all Kashmir Conflict articles, if this is indeed one of them. Besides, there is an exemption from 3RR to remove content which is copyright and or added by blocked users, as anyone can see, I consistently removed the page's content on the basis that it has clear copyright violations which other users Josephus and Danish agree with me on. There is also a talkpage discussion ongoing and I am still compiling the evidence for those users who had requested it. Also a lot, if not most, of the article's content was written by a blocked sockmaster TylerDurden, who was recently caught socking again.

    Statement by WBG

    His being a SPA and Alex's block are not much of a problem at their respective individual merits. Functionary Yunshui knows his alt-accs and AFAIK, the use of such accounts are permitted by our legit-socks criterion.Obviously, cases of 3RR and/or violation of ArbCom decisions needs to be looked at, though! Winged Blades 04:09, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by power~enwiki

    A link to the copyvio tool: . The top two matches are caused by properly-cited blockquotes. I don't see anything that justifies blanking the entire article. power~enwiki (π, ν) 04:21, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by Capitals00

    But problem remains that KA$HMIR is edit warring against consensus on multiple articles and often engaged in WP:BLUDGEONING. At least 3 articles (Violence against women during the partition of India, 1947 Poonch Rebellion, Kashmir conflict) have been provided extended protection because of his edit warring. Capitals00 (talk) 16:15, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by Kautilya3

    The edit warring that occurred at the 1947 Poonch Rebellion is the most shocking I have seen in my three years of editing, not only for the spuriousness of the rationale but also the bombast with which it was carried out. Note the edit summaries:

    • There were massive copyright violations in the article's old version. Admins please suppress
    • stop restoring copyvio else it could lead to you getting a block
    • whole article is copied from the sources used

    Yet, when I quizzed it on the talk page, no evidence was forthcoming. KA$HMIR was certainly aware of the edit restrictions placed on Kashmir conflict articles because RegentsPark recently reminded every one of their existence. This is the apex of all the tendentiousness that the user has been displaying ever since he came on board. -- Kautilya3 (talk) 17:28, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Let us also note the obvious Tag teaming that has occurred in this edit war. These are the first ever edits by any of these editors on this page. Pure coincidence? But such coincidences are now occurring with increasing frequency all over the India-Pakistan space: Talk:Violence against women during the Partition of India, Talk:Annexation of Junagadh etc. At Talk:Kashmir conflict, a group of editors have repeated each other's RfC comments . -- Kautilya3 (talk) 01:02, 22 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by User:EdJohnston

    For clarity, the current restrictions in effect for this article (from WP:DSLOG) appear to be:

    Kashmir conflict and all articles related to the India-Pakistan conflict over Kashmir (initially posted here. Modified Sept 2016: 1RR restriction removed and a first revert does not need to be explained on the talk page.):

    • A 1 RR restriction. Any attempt, even if made in good faith, to do more than one revert in a 24 hour period will lead to an immediate block.
    • A second revert without discussion restriction. A second revert of any edit, however minor, that is done without an explanation on the talk page will lead to an immediate block.
    • A civility restriction. Any suggestion that any editor is not editing in good faith will lead to an immediate block.
    • An ethnicity claim restriction Any attempt to bring the purported or deduced or imagined ethnic or nationality identities of any users will lead to an immediate block. This includes an editor's own stated ethnic identity or nationality. Misplaced Pages uses reliable sources and the weighting of those sources to decide what to include, what not to include, and how the content should be stated in an article. Please stick to arguments based on those factors.
      --regentspark (comment) 13:10, 9 May 2016 (UTC)

    Quoted from DSLOG by EdJohnston (talk) 18:20, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by Dilpa kaur

    Looks like a bad faith report by a user who has been obsessed with maligning this user through hook or crook. I guess this request is another frustrated attempt after previous failures to rid the encyclopedia of this constructive editor. Previously MBlaze Lightning joyously joined in a ridiculous SPI against KA$HMIR, only to be confronted with the establishment of KA$HMIR's innocence. He also brought him up in a spurious ANI case which was based on such weak evidence (such as MBlaze' Lightnings mixup of my IP address and Danish Mehraj's) that even MBlaze Lightning had to withdraw it. The encyclopedia has also been recently hit by malicious IPs , located in different Indian cities, looking to malign this user as a sockpuppet (the different locations of these obvious IP socks suggest collaboration and their knowledge of old SPIs indicate that these are older users IP socking to harass without getting their accounts sanctioned). I suspect a link between these reports and the malicious IPs who are obviously not new strays but old Indian editors who have a beef with KA$HMIR and Owais Khursheed and are IP socking to harass the Kashmiri editors.

    Overall this request is nothing more than the latest attempt to get rid of another good user who is a headache for the POV pushers. 223.225.246.200 (talk) 20:28, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Result concerning USERNAME

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • Looking over the evidence provided by MBlaze Lightning, I see that KA$HMIR was repeatedly asked for evidence of the copyvio but failed to provide it. I suggest they provide specific evidence above otherwise these will be viewed as bad faith deletions of sourced material and a violation of the 2RR without a talk page post sanction placed on these articles. If there is evidence forthcoming, then a warning to be more careful in the future is probably all that is required.--regentspark (comment) 16:35, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Block appeal from 68.132.68.52

    User unblocked. Sandstein 16:39, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
    The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.

    I didn't do anything wrong. With regards to the edit to Dismissal of James Comey, I stated Comey's dismissal is alleged to have constituted obstruction of justice in the lead, which is already stated in the article. In pertinent part, the article already reads as follows: "In light of the dismissal, the memo, and Comey's testimony to the Senate Intelligence Committee in June 2017, several media figures, political opponents and legal scholars said that Trump's acts could be construed as obstruction of justice, while others disagreed." Hence, my edit adding material already in the article to another part of it is not a blockable offense. I will also note that "obstruction of justice' is in the article 46 times; it was certainly not inappropriate to add it to the lead, given how heavily it figures in the article. The accusation that my edit was "tendentious" is wrong; I was summarizing article content, which is what a lead does. With regards to my edit to Trump-Russia investigations stating that members of Trump's campaign were convicted due to their meetings with Russians, (even though this was not cited as the reason for the block, for the sake of completeness I'll discuss it) please note that this, too, is already repeatedly stated in the article: "On October 5, 2017, Papadopoulos pleaded guilty in the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia to making false statements to FBI agents relating to contacts he had with agents of the Russian government while working for the Trump campaign" Also, see Michael Flynn for further information.

    I don't think the admin who reviewed my edits actually took the time to look at them, and made a knee-jerk block without making the effort to see if what I said was A) True, B) already in the article. What I stated were items already in the relevant article that I merely added to the lead. Neither of these edits were worthy of a block. The blocking administrator does not appear to have reviewed the article prior to blocking. Had he done so, he would have noticed that this is not undue, but accurately summarizes what the article is about. Blocking administrators have gotten insanely trigger happy and are blocking without taking any time to understand the edits or the article itself. How can you block without even knowing what's in an article first?

    Posted per the user's request, via the unblock template. SQL 04:28, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Statement by Drmies

    • I care much less about procedure than about trying to foster an editing environment in which we can produce an encyclopedia whose point of view is neutral. If you don't know by not that I am always amenable to community overview of my blocks, you should come over for cocktails and we'll talk. Given the history of that editor, the blocks that were issued and the reason for it, I figured that an escalation to one week was more than appropriate but, Sandstein, you may well be right about the paperwork. It's not a big deal to me anyway--if the user gets unblocked, they'll either tone it down, which is fine, or they'll continue in the same vein, in which case they'll get blocked again. Drmies (talk) 16:27, 21 December 2017 (UTC)

    Result concerning 68.132.68.52

    This section is to be edited only by uninvolved administrators. Comments by others will be moved to the sections above.
    • Waiting for a comment by Drmies (talk · contribs). It appears the reason for the block is tendentious editing in the form of this edit. This is clearly not the best BLP edit ever in the history of Misplaced Pages, but I'd not have issued a one-week AE block solely because of it. It is also not clear to me based on which arbitration decision or remedy this block was made, and it does not seem to have been logged as an enforcement action. If this is not promptly explained, I'd be in favor of lifting the block as a procedurally flawed AE block. Sandstein 08:13, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
    • I agree with Sandstein that the block was not procedurally correct. I'm wondering whether User:Drmies just got the wrong template? The user has never received any arbitration alert and so an AE block is out of process - and an arbitration enforcement block ought also to have been logged. This edit appears to imply that Drmies expects any admin to be able to overturn the block - so I'm wondering if this was intended to be a normal block for TE rather than an AE block? GoldenRing (talk) 10:57, 21 December 2017 (UTC)
    Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Enforcement Add topic