User talk:Rave92 - Misplaced Pages

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Template:Montenegrin Wiki

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Montenegrin language

Rave, Montenegrin is not ISO-recognized language, so Misplaced Pages agreed earlier in the consensus that until that occur, Serbian remain, as Montenegrin language is officially regarded as Serbian language version. Language is official in Montenegro, but until it is internationally recognized as new language (like Croatian did), it shouldn't be placed on wiki. That is the reason why Montenegrin language Misplaced Pages was denied! Please, don't place Montenegrin language tags in articles, as those edits will be reverted. If i can help you in any kind, or if i can answer some of your questions, ask me!! :) Also, if you want to change this, only possible way is to place long lasting request on the Montenegro talk page, and make another consensus. Što se mene tiče, ja bi najviše voleo da svako dobije svoje, tako da možeš od mene tražiti pomoć. Ja sam tu da ti pomognem. P.S. Pogledaj članak o Skadarskom jezeru, i ostavi komentar na stranici za razgovor. Predložio sam nešto...

Puno pozdrava, i Srećan Badnji Dan. :) --Tadija (talk) 12:48, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

But I want to see where Misplaced Pages agreed as it can't be agreed by one person. Why we can't put it as Cyrillic only like some articles had? A da, Srecan Bozic, Nova Godina .... :D. Rave92 22:35, 6 January 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, Rave, i didn't know you answered, next time leave me on talk page this note:

Hello, Rave92. You have new messages at Rave92's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

So i can respond on your talk page. It's a bit late now, i will find it for you, as i dont remember where i read that information, but don't worry, tomorrow, or day after that, i'll send you a link! We can even talk to some other admins, they will remember. Be good! --Tadija (talk) 23:46, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, because I suggest adding Cyrillic on pages about Montenegrin cities, and leave Montenegrin language on other Montenegrin related topic. We can't go against official language, and ISO code is just formality as language is learned and spoken in Montenegro. I mean, even the government is using it. Rave92 18:03, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

OK, but if you just place Cyrillic, that will lead to Cyrillic alphabet, and there is bunch of Unicode ranges, so i really think that the best thing to do is to write on Talk:Montenegrin_language with that question.

Misplaced Pages Language subcommittee is your best address. They say that ISO 639-1 that Montenegrin don't have is one of the main reasons that Montenegrin Wiki has been rejected. ISO code is by far more then just formality.

I would propose to you to read those.

And here you will see a lot of much older and internationally more recognized languages that are not accepted on en wiki. Be good --Tadija (talk) 18:31, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

No, you didn't understand me. I am not talking about Montenegrin Wiki. I am talking about Montenegrin language on Wiki articles. Admins didn't have anything against Montenegrin language, just some don't know anything about Balkans and want to interfere into those things. 90% Montenegrin articles have Montenegrin language only and Admins don't have anything against it. That's why your edits were reverted. You got confused with Montenegrin Wiki and Montenegrin language. It's not the same thing. Cheers! Rave92 18:37, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I know, by that things i told you, there should be no Montenegrin language in Misplaced Pages. In any articles. That's what am i telling you. Montenegrin wiki was rejected because of Montenegro language. Those two are the same. As i told you, talk to other admins, they will advice you. --Tadija (talk) 22:14, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Separate wiki isn't the same as having Montenegrin language on articles, and requests for Montenegrin Wiki was 2 years ago or more, when it wasn't even an official language. Rave92 11:11, 10 January 2010 (UTC)

I am trying to tell you that if language was rejected on wiki request, it shouldn't be used in articles at all. It is connected. Try for new request. I will agree with new language only if Misplaced Pages request is fulfilled. That will help! Be good... --Tadija (talk) 18:22, 10 January 2010 (UTC)

1RR

I saw your post on ANI and responded to it. I'm thinking that based on your recent behavior, the 1RR restriction that I imposed on you might not be necessary at this point. I'm hoping that I could remove it and your behavior wouldn't change. Do you think this would work? Toddst1 (talk) 06:45, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Not sure what do you think? To remove that I can revert more then once or...? Rave92 11:14, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Well, you would be able to revert more than once, but you really shouldn't - just like I'm not supposed to. Basically, what I'm seeing is constructive engagement on your part and willingness to seek dispute resolution instead of edit warring. You got to this point with the 1RR in place and you seem to be doing really well. My thoughts are if we removed the 1RR, I suspect you could continue operating like you do now and stay out of trouble.

If I removed the 1RR, you wouldn't have the cloud of a sanction over your head, but it's not a license to return to edit warring. You're dealing with some highly emotional topics but the maturity with which you seem to be dealing with them lead me to believe that the 1RR sanction isn't necessary (any longer). If I were in your shoes, I would accept the removal of the 1RR sanction, but I would still limit myself to 1RR - the difference is that you wouldn't be in fear of being blocked. It's an offer of trust. Toddst1 (talk) 16:32, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Ok, I accept it. Also, can you please help with dealing with language issue on noticeboard? Thanks once again! Cheers. Rave92 18:04, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

I have removed the 1RR on your account and recorded it in both your block log and in this section of ARBMAC. Please don't make this look like a foolish move on my part.

Unfortunately, I don't have a perspective on what should be done with the language issue. I don't have domain knowledge or even context. However, I suspect you'll have difficulty reaching consensus as this is a highly contested issue and I expect that will have to take it back to RFAR. I strongly support your efforts in resolving this in such a constructive manner, as I mentioned on ANI. Please be patient and work through the process. I'll be more than happy to help enforce whatever the consensus or ruling becomes. Best of luck and thanks for your cooperation. Toddst1 (talk) 18:28, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Ok, thank you. I hope if we reach the consensus, you will help us keeping it that way on Misplaced Pages, as some probably won't know about it and vandalize the articles once again. Best regards. Rave92 23:26, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Re:MNE Wiki Project

I don't see the need to delete less active members, since everyone's help is appreciated, but you are welcome to update the project page, since it's really outdated. I'll help you with that, but don't have time to get to it right away, maybe in a few days or so. Sideshow Bob 11:40, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

The same is for me. I am not sure what we could do to make it better? Maybe to add Task and those? Rave92 12:33, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Milan Roćen

Hi! It seems you recently created an unreferenced biography of a living person: Milan Roćen. Our verifiability policy requires that all content be cited to a reliable source. Please add references as soon as possible. Thanks! --LaraBot (talk) 00:11, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Done. Rave92 11:11, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Email

I was going to send you one, but you have email disabled. If you want to have the email functionality without giving away your personal email, consider getting a gmail account. I have one for purely[REDACTED] purposes which allows me communicate with other users while retaining my privacy.--Terrillja _talk 18:49, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, but I don't think I would check that E-mail so often :/. I can change it so you can send me E-mail? Rave92 18:55, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

More info is here, you can also just use your regular email, however people would then see your email when you reply or if you send them an email though the[REDACTED] interface (if they send you an email, your address is not known unless you reply). I have Apple Mail, so my email program can download from as many accounts as you have. If you choose not to, that's fine, it's just nice to have when discussing things which could further inflame tensions if discussed in the open.--Terrillja _talk 19:01, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

Ok, I turned it on so please just send me message to see your E-mail and then I will answer you. Rave92 19:07, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

File copyright problem with File:MNEZGembassy.jpg

Thank you for uploading File:MNEZGembassy.jpg. However, it currently is missing information on its copyright status. Misplaced Pages takes copyright very seriously. It may be deleted soon, unless we can determine the license and the source of the file. If you know this information, then you can add a copyright tag to the image description page.

If you have uploaded other files, consider checking that you have specified their license and tagged them, too. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them at the media copyright questions page. Thanks again for your cooperation. ww2censor (talk) 05:44, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

File source problem with File:Famous Montenegrins.png

Thanks for uploading File:Famous Montenegrins.png. I noticed that the file's description page currently doesn't specify who created the content, so the copyright status is unclear. If you did not create this file yourself, you will need to specify the owner of the copyright. If you obtained it from a website, please add a link to the website from which it was taken, together with a brief restatement of that website's terms of use of its content. However, if the copyright holder is a party unaffiliated from the website's publisher, that copyright should also be acknowledged.

If you have uploaded other files, consider verifying that you have specified sources for those files as well. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged per Misplaced Pages's criteria for speedy deletion, F4. If the image is copyrighted and non-free, the image will be deleted 48 hours after 09:26, 27 January 2010 (UTC) per speedy deletion criterion F7. If you have any questions or are in need of assistance please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Eusebius (talk) 09:26, 27 January 2010 (UTC)

What is your opinion? Share with us!

We are having problems to reach a stable consensus about removal of visa-free sections from the Passport articles. Please share your opinion with us here: Talk:Passport and here: a request for mediation Thanks. --Ozguroot (talk) 15:52, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Ellis Island passenger record

Hi. I think it should be PD-ineligible or something similar. I don't think it is copyrightable (this is only an opinion). Regards, --Eusebius (talk) 10:59, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

PD-text might be more specific. --Eusebius (talk) 11:01, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, Rave92. You have new messages at Toddst1's talk page.
Message added 21:16, 24 February 2010 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Toddst1 (talk) 21:16, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

File source problem with File:Famous Montenegrins.png

If you have uploaded other files, consider verifying that you have specified sources for those files as well. You can find a list of files you have uploaded by following this link. Unsourced and untagged images may be deleted one week after they have been tagged per Misplaced Pages's criteria for speedy deletion, F4. If the image is copyrighted and non-free, the image will be deleted 48 hours after 02:15, 25 February 2010 (UTC) per speedy deletion criterion F7. If you have any questions or are in need of assistance please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Vanjagenije (talk) 02:15, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Montenegrin Flags

I'm afraid I don't know. They were up,loaded to the Commons by User:Bugoslav, I just added them to the Misplaced Pages English section: http://en.wikipedia.org/List_of_flags_of_Montenegro It may be possible they exist and are not used commonly, or maybe they don't exist officially at all. You would have to ask him on his Commons Page. Hope that helps Fry1989 (talk) 20:45, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Gratitude

THANKYOU SO MUCH Mr. Rave92 for your Outstanding Translation effort!

I am overwhelmed with gratitude.

May God Bless you!

(In the future, if you wish to have your favourite article translated into the Chinese language, then I would certainly be glad to help you.)

Yours Sincerely, --Jose77 (talk) 01:21, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

I have helped translate the article about Montenegrin people into Minnan Misplaced Pages.

Could you help me fix the grammar and spelling of this article into proper Montenegrin?

The passages were originally based on the English version so if you want, you can also translate directly from the original English version. (this would help make the article sound as Montenegrin as possible)

Thanks in advance. --Jose77 (talk) 03:59, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

You are welcome my friend, and thanks, if I would need some translation in Chinese, I would sure contact you.

Also thanks for your effort on translation articles about Montenegrins!

I will try to translate that into proper grammar ;-).

Best regards! Rave92 14:04, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Constantine Bodin

You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war according to the reverts you have made on Constatine Bodin. Note that the three-revert rule prohibits making more than three reversions on a single page within a 24-hour period. Additionally, users who perform several reversions in content disputes may be blocked for edit warring even if they do not technically violate the three-revert rule. When in dispute with another editor you should first try to discuss controversial changes to work towards wording and content that gains a consensus among editors. Should that prove unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. Please stop the disruption, otherwise you may be blocked from editing. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 16:43, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Can you please stop edit warring and talk first, it doesn't matter which version is in the article for now. -- Eraserhead1 <talk> 16:43, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

It was discussed 1000 times before (not on Constantine, but Montenegrin generally). No matter what, vandals still keep it reverting back. Rave92 19:09, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Montenegro

I am aware that the Montenegro constitution recognizes the Montenegrin "language" and I am also aware that it did so before the language is even standardized. How does one recognize a language that is not even standardized? Although it has received a "new standard", it is still not internationally recognized, doesn't have an ISO code and is absolutely considered a variant of Serbian by every single serious international linguist - only the Montenegrin government sponsored linguists differ. On that note, this is not the Misplaced Pages of the Montenegrin government and it can not endorse the views of that government, while disregarding the views of those international factors that actually matter in the case of languages. What if Kosovars tomorrow declared that their language is Kosovian? It's a bit different than the language spoken in Albania, but it's still Albanian. Two or three different words don't make a new language and this is apparent to everyone in the world. Except nationalists who, of course, politicize language crazy agenda (as if Montenegrins can't preserve their culture if they speak Serbian --> do Amerians speak American? Austrians Austrian?). Until the language is internationally recognized, I request that you return the Serbian spelling of the towns in Montenegro, as Montenegrin is merely a dialect of Serbian and it is recognized as such in the world. --Cinéma C 18:12, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

Let me get some things straight. ISO doesn't mean international recognizing. ISO is bureaucracy thing, which will be granted soon. Also, your opinion doesn't share any embassy or organization accredited in Montenegro. You are saying that this is not Misplaced Pages of Montenegrin government? Articles which concern Montenegro should respect countries official language. You can't put "it doesn't have ISO" thing here. You can't really compare Kosovars to Montenegrins. Kosovars declare them selfs as Albanians and actually are mad when you refer to them as Kosovars. Also, you are saying you speak Serbo-Croatian? That language officially doesn't have ISO anymore ;-). Avoid "so called" and "made up language" in future discussion. Also I am not reverting to Serbian because in Montenegro we speak Montenegrin, and at least what we can do on Misplaced Pages is keep our own language on OUR articles. I don't add Montenegrin on Serbian articles, don't see why you should add Serbian on ours. Cheers. Rave92 19:51, 31 March 2010 (UTC)

Serbo-Croatian is also a made up language, the reason I have that box is merely practical (so I don't list all the next "languages" or whatever people want to call them). The fact of the matter is that when people understand each other and they can use the same words in all their "languages", they're all speaking the same language. Politics leads people to want to call it differently, not the differences in the languages themselves. Consider, for example, the Serbs living in Croatia. They speak exactly the same way the Croats do it that region, but they call their language Serbian, while Croats call it Croatian. So, who can tell me that they're speaking two different languages? You say in Montenegro you speak Montenegrin - how is that different from Serbian? You can force some changes into it, but it's still essentially the same. Take the Bunjevci ethnic group for example. They speak the ikavian dialect, and depending on whether they declare themselves closer to Croats or Serbs, they declare their language as Croatian or Serbian. Some even call it a Bunjevac language, when in fact, they're all speaking the same language, with minor differences (like they call a cookie in Britain - a biscuit.. or the way words are pronounced, written (favor, favour,..).. but it's still English). It's not YOUR article just because you're from Montenegro, and you should look at the bigger picture here, not just blindly follow what the government of Montenegro says. The government is frantically trying to distance Montenegro from Serbia in any way by promoting a new language, church, whatever. Anything so that the people don't think about the real issues, such as their living standard and how Milo is laundering money behind their back. But if you make up a new language, everything will be better, right? So long as you don't have to say that awful "Serbian" word and not speak that awful "Serbian" language you spoke before. --Cinéma C 23:36, 31 March 2010 (UTC)