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    Welcome to wikiquette assistance
    Wikiquette assistance is a forum where editors who feel they are being treated uncivilly can request assistance. The goal here is to help all parties in a situation come to a mutually agreeable solution. It is designed to function via persuasion, reason, and community support, rather than threats or blocks.
    • Your first resort should be a polite attempt to discuss the problem with the other editor(s).
    • No binding decisions are issued here. If you seek blocks or bans, see WP:ANI instead.
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    Please notify any users involved in a dispute. You may use {{subst:WQA-notice}} to do so.
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    Active discussions

    User:Arcandam & User:Dan56

    • I guess our respective talk pages, better explained below.

    User:Arcandam keeps harrassing my talk page with warnings misconstruing every edit I make. He's done it a couple of times before (history). I think it started with this warning template I used to him after he made unexplained, unconstructive changes to the article that we were discussing. We've been in discussion on Misplaced Pages:Articles for deletion/Hip pop, where he responded to the previous with "editsummaries suck", and he's been pretty hostile to me there. I've tried to make nice and be humble at his talk page and the discussion page, so the discussion is about the content and not our character, but he's responded with accusations, calling me ignorant about the topic of the articles I edit, and does not assume good faith because I disagree with him on certain content. I'm clearly on his bad side. One of his main accusations is that I canvassed, b/c I asked editors of music-related articles to comment on a music-related discussion, and I primarily edit those kind of articles. He uses this to undermine any logical argument I make. Both at his talk page and the discussion page, he's threatened to follow the edits I make, so isnt that sort of uncivil or wrong? He is not considering anything I say, so I'm done trying his talk page. Can you please help? He seems to respond better to others who havent debated him yet. Dan56 (talk) 20:07, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

    LOL. As I've told you before, there is a log of every edit we've made. And boomerang's hurt. But since I agree you are at the right page here, you do need some Wikiquette assistance, here we go:
    We've met because I dared to change the genre "hip hop" to the subgenre "hip pop" (which is also known as "pop rap") on Kanye West. If I would've known what a minefield full of WP:GENREWARRIORS the genre-line in infoboxes is I would've never bothered specifying the correct genre. You disagreed with my edit, and reverted with the editsummary: "Rv; dubious changes". So I added a reliable source as a reference and I posted a message on your talkpage. I am not a native speaker, so it takes more edits for me to post a message that is comprehensible and free of typo's than for some other editors. You deleted my message on your talkpage without even responding to it with the editsummary: "Rm, dubious post (took 5 edits?)". Then you stalked me to hip pop (a genre you previously weren't even aware existed), and nominated hip pop and Indie hip hop out of revenge because you think I prefer Indie hip hop.
    A couple of Dan56 quotes from our conversations:
    • Rv; this isn't the forum for that. Options are delete or keep. (editsummary used while deleting my comment from the AfD discussion)
    • Wait, but what would a foreigner know about American music anyway.
    • It is quite obvious you're losing your mind. Nota bene: When another editor said "there's no need for this" he responded with "Well he must be."
    • Let's agree to disagree on that article, but don't question my knowledge on any music, let alone hip hop.
    • You can learn something from me about hip hop.
    • Not only I am involved in my local scene in New York, I took a class on hip hop in college and know plenty from using GoogleBooks to research hip hop history and culture.
    • R U being a sore loser?
    • I've written and edited plenty of hip hop articles on WP, so please don't question my judgement here.
    • He has added the header "diversion" above my comments.
    • When deleting user warning templates he likes to use the phrase "takin(sic) out the trash" (Apparently this is what he considers to be "nice and be humble"...)
    This is not limited to me, some recent Dan56 quotes about other people:
    • Can you help knock some sense into him?
    • And who are you to call me a control freak?
    Dan56 may think he is an expert on hip hop but he wrote: "There's no name for it, like there's not "hip pop", or "pop rap". It's not a legit/accepted term.". I showed him some of the many sources. To make the Randy in Boise situation with Dan56 & Secret clear I even posted a list of some quotes from hip hop songs about pop rap/hip pop, e.g. this one. I showed the fact the terms are frequently in use 123456, 8000 potential sources on Google Books alone, if I search for "hippop" on Google (including quotes!) I get about half a million results. If I search for "hip pop" I get well over 4 million. If I search for "pop rap" I get 5 1/4th million and if I search for "poprap" I get 80k more.. AllMusic has an article about it. If he was an expert on hiphop he would've been aware of the existence of this subgenre.
    I asked him if he had read WP:CANVASS (at that point his latest edit was this request for support in an AfD) and he said he had on 20 May at 03:44. Since then he has made these edits (among others): 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
    A selection of his edits from between 19 May 2012 02:24 and 20 May at 03:42 12 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10
    Two editors agree his choice of audience was "questionable" because it consists of inactive users who may disagree and people he knows and likes. (because they have a similar interest)
    He even removed some of the requests for support because he felt they were not needed anymore (which prevented the risk that those editors disagreed with him). 1 2.
    Some more canvassing. He even canvassed for this very WQA.
    Dan56 is one of those intentionally annoying people who give you a nickname and use it even after you repeatedly ask him not to. In my case he tried to troll by using 'bro'. I told him I am not his 'bro' and asked him to stop a number of times but he continued. It backfired, because it gave me the right to call him 'sis'. Doing that just once has been effective so far; he hasn't called me 'bro' since. Arcandam (talk) 02:40, 23 May 2012 (UTC) p.s. To be continued...
    • The blind are leading the blind. This template runs counter to the suggestion that we don't template the regulars. Then things got worse, with barbs back and forth, and as far as I'm concerned this patronizing comment is all I need to see that dickishness comes from both sides here. Oh, if "bro" is trolling, then so is "dude." I think both of you need to take a break from each other. An interaction ban is a bit far-fetched, but it would be wise for the both of you to refrain from interacting. If you comment on the same AfD or article talk page, don't comment on each other's comments--that would be a good start. Drmies (talk) 14:35, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
    • I never claimed to be Ghandi (a great example of the blind leading the blind by the way). Templating the regulars is unimportant; that template runs counter to the suggestion that we use templates in cases where they are applicable. I hope Dan56 stops trying to follow me around. I do not understand that sentence about "dude" BTW. Arcandam (talk) 14:56, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
    • What's not to understand? You're complaining that he trolled you by calling you 'bro', and I don't see why that's trolling when "dude" isn't. But you also referred to their notification of this thread as "trolling", so I don't think you know what trolling is. What I do know is that this and this are not examples of canvassing. In the one, he leaves a note about reliable sources on an AfD, in another he updates a question he asked by saying that he started a thread about the problem. That's not canvassing. Whatever the merits or lack thereof of Dan56's edits, it takes two to tango. Drmies (talk) 16:54, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
    I think this may be a cultural difference or a generational gap or something similar, but calling a 20yr old male 'dude' once is not comparable to calling someone 'bro' after being repeatedly asked not to. Do you think Dude, Where's My Car? contains more swearing than the Southpark episode "It Hits The Fan" (S5E2)? Did I insult myself here? Arcandam (talk) 12:32, 26 May 2012 (UTC) p.s. I did not refer to the notification of this thread as trolling, I referred to the person who notified me as a troll.
    But it's quite consistent with the suggestion we do template the regulars. Beyond that, concur. Nobody Ent 14:41, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

    A provocation

    Not a Wikiquette issue, referred elsewhere – Refer to MfD discussion Nick Thorne 06:30, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

    An attempt to delete my userspace pages.

    Probably a personal issue - the ticket was filled on false grounds: 1) - I have edited Misplaced Pages outside of my userspace (as Tempac3, not as an IP) and 2) - both pages have been edited recently. Furthermore, I have left a message along an IP edit by me that I can confirm that is my account if requested .

    He must have been looking for an opportunity to get back at me because I called him an asshole a while back (I was a new member then and was supported by an admin and a long-standing member).

    I'd like to notify the board in case such incidents occur in the future with this admin, and also, if he vandalizes my userspace again - be blocked from my userspace altogether.

    PS: Another user has jumped in to support the false ticket - take a note of that as well. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tempac3 (talk • contribs)

    • Ahem. OK, "false ticket"? The account hadn't edited since 8 August 2011. The "message" is this, I suppose--well, I guess I don't understand why I should have requested the IP to sign in and confirm (which strictly speaking probably isn't "evidence"), or why the account didn't sign in in the first place. The "vandalism" accusation is of course ridiculous.

      As for the forum: this almost suggests that the user is filing this to report themselves for calling me an asshole; I'll have a look at the diff, but given my advanced age combined with the number of edits I make (and insults I receive) I think I should be excused for having forgotten that they insulted me. Hold on: ... Drmies (talk) 14:05, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

    • Ah yes: my congratulations to Tempac3 for his excellent memory! That was a silly discussion and you'll note that I didn't make anything of it. If I wanted to retaliate I wouldn't have waited seven months. BTW, I don't think I'm out of line with this edit. Well, I'm glad that's cleared up. As far as I am concerned, this being the etiquette board, I forgive the user for having called me an asshole; I'll put it down to their youthful exuberance and possibly the mistaken thought that WP is a webhost. I won't even press charges for being called "some asshole"; I like to think that I'm a more unique kind of asshole. I also think that the user should acquaint himself with various Misplaced Pages guidelines. Finally, I was then, and am now, not entirely happy with User:Ezhiki's handling of the affair, though I thought it was best to let the matter rest. Thank you, Drmies (talk) 14:19, 24 May 2012 (UTC)
    • Not on my account, no. I don't agree with what they said but I don't care that much--I disagree with the notion that good faith needs to be extended automatically to such edits in a registered user space, but that's just a difference in opinion and it wasn't much of an issue to begin with. I don't understand why Ezhiki told me to cool down or why they didn't comment on "some asshole" until I did, but soit. If someone who walks by decides that I did not act out of retaliation (which IMO is the most obvious thing in the world) they can close this spurious complaint. If someone decides that I did act out of retaliation they should prove, one way or another, that I carried a grudge for seven months and then acted on it. BTW, I have no recollection of interacting with Tempac3 or with Ezhiki outside of this odd spat. Also, feel free to weigh in on the MfD: it's clear now, I guess, that the IP is Tempac3 and that the draft is not stale, though I can't figure out what those drafts might be for. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 14:42, 24 May 2012 (UTC)

    Attempt to discredit using sexual orientation as a weapon

    This editor, Hypesmasher, has chosen to pick up userboxes from my user page and use them here as an attempt to discredit me. I have no idea whether the editor is homophobic, but it appears very much to be a homophobic attack. In such things the perception of the victim is of substantial importance. To pre-empt any criticism of my strong prior suggestion that he had had his fun, I accept that they perhaps should have been different in tone. Nonetheless that is no excuse for what I perceive as a homophobic attack.

    I have read WP:COAL and am adhering to it. I judged that any attempt by me to seek to solve this by civil talk page messages would be unproductive, so I have no intention of interacting with this editor again, save to post the alerting template in their talk page. I rarely edit the article in question, and then usually simply to patrol it to delete uncited new 'facts'. I have not contributed to further discussions or edits in either location since this incident, and have chosen to wait until the matter was archived at DRN in order to allow time for any passions to cool. Fiddle Faddle (talk) 07:26, 25 May 2012 (UTC)

    Wikiquette in an AfD

    In the discussion on this AfD one editor has invoked Wikquette, seemingly in an attempt to shut down someone who disagrees with his view . I've answered his comments but I don't want to go too far and be uncivil myself. Could someone else take a look. Thanks. Borock (talk) 16:00, 25 May 2012 (UTC)

    Accusations of meat puppetry and tendentious editing


    After removing much of the original research and undue material in the Becker article: , Olavn characterized my edits as: "dismantling and annihilation" to another editor: User_talk:Saedon#The_Body_Electric.

    After I reverted his addition of the undue material , I then posted on WP:FTN about the recent additions of undue material and OR: Misplaced Pages:Fringe_theories/Noticeboard#Robert_O._Becker. IRWolfie- (talk) 10:38, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

    Olavn also added an excessively large list of papers which he added: which i then cut in half due to the extreme size: .

    Olavn has now characterized my actions as meat puppetry and disruptive editing (note I had already explained on the Becker talk page that large lists of research papers do not help with establishing notability: Talk:Robert_O._Becker#Nobel_Prize_Nominations). IRWolfie- (talk) 10:38, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

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