User talk:In ictu oculi - Misplaced Pages

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Christophe Le Menu de Saint-Philbert

This is an automated message ..

No, it's okay. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:35, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

Question re Bible translations into Norwegian

Why is Thette higher density Careful testamenth on Danish guidelines effter Latin vdsatthe crossed? --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk to me} 15:11, 2 January 2012 (UTC)

Looks like someone started to correct the machine translation then gave up. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:34, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

Madrigals

Marius van Altena recorded madrigals of composers I had never heard of. I could identify most of them but could not tell from the works mentioned in the Gramophone review if Giovanni Maria Nanino or Giovanni Bernardino Nanino, and I could not read Mosc,aglia? I don't like such lists in general, but thought these people could take an additional link. One is red ... --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:25, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

Adding the question: is there a reason why Orlando di Lasso - the spelling version I know and find on a recording - is a redirect, but not in the article? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 14:58, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi Gerda, I expect it's because the original French name is more common in English sources, the Italianised name more common in German sources - on his Munich manuscripts for example. In ictu oculi (talk) 04:06, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Understand, but why is that not mentioned in the article? Would you be able to tell from the works mentioned which Nanino? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:38, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Looking further, I found this on es, Huelgas ensemble, looks like a list of members (over the years) to me, I linked a few:

Componentes

A lo largo de los años, el grupo ha contado con la presencia de numerosos intérpretes, entre los que podemos destacar:

Voces: Katelijne van Laethem (soprano), Carol Schlaikjer (soprano), Marie Claude Vallin (soprano), Nancy Long (soprano), Ingrid Smit Duyzentkunst (soprano), John Dudley (tenor), Otto Rastbichler (tenor), Angus Smith (tenor), Marius van Altena (tenor), Stephan Van Dyck (tenor), Ibo van Ingen (tenor), Eric Mentzel (tenor), Eitan Sorek (tenor), Harry van Berne (tenor), Matthew Vine (tenor), Josep Benet (tenor), Willem Ceuleers (bajo), Kees Jan de Koning (bajo), Lieven de Roo (bajo), Peter Dijkstra (bajo), Stephan MacLeod (bajo), Harry van der Kamp (bajo), Philippe Cantor (bajo), Peter Dijkstra (bajo), Jo Gulinck (bajo), Claudio Cavina (alto), Pascal Bertin (contratenor), Rannveig Sigurdardottir (contratenor), Lieven Termont (barítono), Marius van Altena (barítono)
Instrumentistas: Wim Becu (sacabuche), Cas Gevers (sacabuche), Harry Ries (sacabuche), Symen van Mechelen (sacabuche), Willem Bremer (bombarda, corneta), Nils Ferber (shawm, cromorno, bombarda), Christine Frantzen (laúd, vihuela), Marcel Onsia (órgano, sacabuche), Alain Sobczak (shawm, bombarda, cromorno), René Van Laken (rabel, viella, bombarda), Marion Verbruggen (corneta), Howard Weiner (sacabuche) y el propio director Paul Van Nevel (flautas, bombarda, échaquier, órgano)

What do you think? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:14, 4 January 2012 (UTC)

A few of those spellings on the fr/es.wiki need correcting. But probably only those who have solo recording/conducting careers are notable. In ictu oculi (talk) 04:06, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

One more question: the collection Tears of Lisboa has early Fado music, but if I link to Fado it takes a while until something before the 18th century is mentioned,and not precisely so. Is there help? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:34, 5 January 2012 (UTC)

I think the point of the album was to look for supposed 17th C baroque roots of Fado, but it's more of a contrast exercise by Van Nevel than real "early Fado" :) In ictu oculi (talk) 04:06, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Helps, thank you. Should I drop the many red links (several names would go to sports people ...) or is there more interest in these composers? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:38, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi, these componentes (Spanish for "members of the ensemble") probably don't require red links, except Claudio Cavina, who is now a notable conductor. In ictu oculi (talk) 20:59, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Let's distinguish: 1) componentes, I suggest to list those with an article and some you know are notable to the Huelgas article. 2) Portuguese composers, many red, I can't tell how notable they are. 3) Tears of Lisbon: I think what you said above about the character of the collection would also grace the Huelgas article. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:13, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Apologies, I didn't think you'd confuse componentes for composers. But where did you find a list of composers/redlinks for the Fado CD? In ictu oculi (talk) 21:33, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

here, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 21:39, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Already there: Maximiano de Sousa (Max), Fernando Tordo, Manuel Mendes (1547-1605)

Added: Joaquim Pimentel, José Fontes Rocha, Paulo Valentim (guitarist), Armando Machado, Francisco Viana, if you want to insert in Huelgas discography, go ahead :). No, sorry I don't know which Nanino above. In ictu oculi (talk) 22:56, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Thank you! Looks much more decent in blue. Seems a bit too much for Huelgas, compared to the other recordings, what do you think? I will turn now to Johan van der Meer, do you know sources not in Dutch? I couldn't believe it but he has not even a bio on bach-cantatas, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 08:22, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

I changed my mind and added the composers to Huelgas. You created them, they should be used, smile, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 10:31, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

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Defaultsort

fyi... please include the entire name for the DEFAULTSORT value and just not one part of a surname. For example, José Fontes Rocha should be DEFAULTSORT=Fontes Rocha, Jose and not just Fontes. Who knows how many people have Fontes as a surname. Bgwhite (talk) 09:57, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

No problem. I've never been in a hurry and I've never made a mistake.*

*Claims made are only for the previous 30 seconds before the claim was made. The mistake count before that is too high to be counted. If the count is unknown, it becomes irrelevant.

Bgwhite (talk) 21:09, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

Hoda Saad

I removed the following ref from the page:

Aufait Maroc - 15 Dec 2011 "Radio Plus souffle sa première bougie" "..en présence des stars de la chanson et du cinéma marocain: Hatim Idar, Houda Saad, Lamiaa Zaidi, Asmaa Lazrak, Siham Assif.."

I was unable to find it in the December 15 edition of Aufait Maroc. The only search results for "Radio Plus souffle sa première bougie" were to the[REDACTED] page and a facebook page for a media marketing company. Bgwhite (talk) 08:57, 10 January 2012 (UTC)

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James Chaloner

Do you have a source for this addition? -- PBS (talk) 04:57, 16 January 2012 (UTC)

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For real?

Is this Epistle to the Laodiceans for real of a fake page? Seems fake to me.... History2007 (talk) 18:24, 22 January 2012 (UTC)

Well it's a pseudepigraphic text yes. In ictu oculi (talk) 15:41, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Pedro Antonio Avondano

please see the articles Pedro Antonio Avondano and António Pedro Avondano. thanks --frinck (talk) 20:59, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, fixed In ictu oculi (talk) 15:41, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Saint Thomas Christian page bullying

Dear In ictu oculi,

There is again vandalism and bullying going on at the page Saint Thomas Christians. Editors are coming together with an agenda against Syriac traditions of the Malabar Nasrani people and questioning even the most mundane facts. This has gone to absurd extent of stating that the term for the Syriac community 'Mar Thoma Nasrani' may be a derivative of english term 'Saint Thomas Christian'. Besides being absurd and revealing their agenda, most references clearly and logically explains how 'Saint Thomas Christian' is a derivative or translation of the syriac term 'Mar Thoma (Saint Thomas) Nasrani'. Nasrani is an ancient Hebrew Syriac-Aramaic term coined much before Modern English evolved through the works of Chaucer and others. I have left other comments regarding this bullying on the talk page of the article Saint Thomas Christians. But there is nothing I can do when administrators abuse their power with an agenda. Please look into it. The article was renamed as 'Saint Thomas Christians' instead of 'Mar Thoma Nasrani' and now they state that the Syriac term could be a derivative of the english term. It is like saying the term 'Deutschland' is a derivative of 'Germany'. One does not need references to know this is nothing but BULLYING. This kind of bullying was anticipated when the agenda was clearly set for the renaming and merging of the page Syrian Malabar Nasrani. The editors are bullying others apparently working in concert though there is no way to ascertain it, though one may clearly feel so by the nature of their work in tandem. Your help is requested to stop this bullying. thanks Robin klein (talk) 14:44, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Hi Robin, I'll look, but actually I would expect WP:RS to support the change you oppose above. Cheers In ictu oculi (talk) 15:39, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Barnstar

Just noticed the barnstar you awarded to me earlier this evening for the Arius article situation. My word, I'd almost forgotten all about that! It was a long time ago, and an experience I've definitely tried to learn from, and to have someone come along after all this time and say what you did is something I really deeply appreciate. Major kudos to you, and my sincerest, deepest thanks!!! - Ecjmartin (talk) 03:36, 29 January 2012 (UTC)

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Input on Saint Thomas Christians

In ictu oculi, your input would be greatly appreciated here.--Cúchullain /c 17:18, 30 January 2012 (UTC)

Jacob Palaeologus

delighted to see someone work on this article. ‎In ictu oculi (talk) 04:34, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

there is a very useful biographical essay in the Introduction to the 1994 edition of the Disputatio Scholastica TomHennell (talk) 10:49, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

Proceeds in excellent fashion, I don't intend to fiddle around the edges while you are working on it. But just a small request - in the case of a sentence like e.g. "In effect they were retaining much of the form of trinitarian worship, while re-interpreting it in anti-trinitarian terms." - is that Palaeologus' view or is that George Huntston Williams' view? Important distinction with WP:PSTS. In ictu oculi (talk) 14:11, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

I think the reference is actually to comment on Socinianism from MacCulloch or Cameron, I will try to track it down and cite it. Any other such sentances that need citations, please alert me. Otherwise, I think it has gone as far as I can take it; futher improvement might be more a matter of subtraction rather than addtion, and others may be better at doing it. TomHennell (talk) 14:24, 3 February 2012 (UTC)

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Renaming templates

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If any of that is confusing, please let me know. It may be easier to simply show me an example if you need help and I can amend it for you and then explain what I did. —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 02:42, 10 February 2012 (UTC)

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Simulated cannibalism

I note your objection to the correct comparison of communion to a simulated cannibalism ritual, however, it is a quite accurate description of the custom. Some like to talk around this obvious point with meaningless semantical 'distinctions', such as this claim from the catholic.com web forum: "The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ are contained truly, really, and substantially in the Eucharist. They are not present materially..." However, the basic fact is that the ritual is symbolic of cannibalism, and the scriptures are quite clear about the ritual being an allegory for cannibalism. John 6:48-66; Mark 14:22-24; Matthew 26:26-28; Luke 22:19-20. In the Catholic doctrine of transubstantiation, the bread and wine are interpreted as literally becoming Jesus' flesh and blood. Don't shoot the messenger.--Jeffro77 (talk) 12:48, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

I remain of the view that that isn't an appropriate view/comment. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:03, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	I am simply amazed by your work. Thank you for helping Misplaced Pages on so many important projects. It is a great treasure to be working with you. Nasorean (talk) 11:57, 15 February 2012 (UTC)

Precious

	article creation
	Thank you for creating articles on so many red links everybody else seems to find too obscure, sometimes before I even ask, and for adding my personal memories to Huelgas Ensemble. For more memories see my user page, with new design, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 12:47, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

Now thank you for Simeon, I linked him a few times, also Anna, please check, --Gerda Arendt (talk) 11:47, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

Passion: He was despised --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:58, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

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Category deleted but came back under another name?

Hello. You have my talk page at Black Falcon's talk page. Cheers! -- Black Falcon 20:05, 21 February 2012 (UTC)

Talkback

Hello, In ictu oculi. You have new messages at Joe407's talk page.
Message added 06:02, 24 February 2012 (UTC). You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Joe407 (talk) 06:02, 24 February 2012 (UTC)

A challenge

Hey In ictu oculi, I have a query that you might be interested in as well: please see User_talk:John_Carter#Anglican_Church_of_the_Americas. Thanks! Drmies (talk) 03:43, 25 February 2012 (UTC)

Q Source Nonsense

Hello there, Just wanted to point out the similarities between book 7 of the Ginza Rba and the Sermon on the Mount, Beattitudes and Lord's Prayer. Might help make some sense of it. Nasorean (talk) 10:10, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Joseph Michel

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Talk:Dispute about Jesus' execution method

I note the likelihood that your inclusion of the 'cannibalism' thing at the section at the execution article is an oblique way of 'alerting' readers coming from WP:Christianity to an unrelated topic in order to elicit offense. If this is your intention, it is extremely inappropriate. If it is not your intention, there is no need to refer back to the history for the 'benefit' of those readers. Thanks.--Jeffro77 (talk) 05:24, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

That hadn't occured to me. I reminded you of that for the reason I said, to remind you where offence was elicited in my own case, and I'm sure the Project's editors are quite capable of drawing their own conclusions from your current edits. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:07, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

If it hadn't occurred to you, there was no reason at all to include the unrelated material at the article Talk page, and the comments have absolutely nothing to do with my comments about article titles suggested by others editors. Additionally, I am under no obligation not to comment at article Talk on the basis that you've arbitrarily decided who is pro- or anti- something, which had nothing to do with my comments either. Adding urelated comments about an editor constitutes a personal attack.

If you believe that my comment about communion as a simulated cannibalism ritual (which is by no means some novel concept I've come up with on my own) was inappropriate, there are appropriate ways to deal with the matter. Airing the matter on an unrelated article Talk page is not such an avenue.--Jeffro77 (talk) 12:23, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

As per previous. In ictu oculi (talk) 12:41, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

If you continue to try to focus article Talk on me rather than content, you will be reported.--Jeffro77 (talk) 12:42, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

As per previous. In ictu oculi (talk) 14:06, 9 March 2012 (UTC)

Wednesday Crucifixion

A number of scholars disagree with the Wednesday Crucifixion theory, but nonetheless find it pervasive and compelling enough to address and refute. The Mystery of the Last Supper: Reconstructing the Final Days of Jesus, written by Prof. Colin J. Humphreys of Cambridge University and the Royal Institution in London, recounts and refutes the arguments for Wednesday Crucifixion. Jimmy Aiken of the National Catholic Register also takes time to refute the Wednesday Crucifixion theory here, noting that "some Protestant churches, especially Fundamentalist ones" subscribe to the theory. Chronological Aspects of the Life of Christ by H. W. Hoehner also discusses this at length. Other sources from books which advance the theory include Wednesday Crucifixion by Rev. George L. Miller and this older doctoral dissertation by Jeremiah Knigh Aldrich, altough neither of these two authors are professors. Taken together, the Wednesday Crucifixion position is certainly a minority one but I included it because of its pervasiveness in the scholarly discussion of crucifixion dates.--YHoshua (talk) 05:41, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Hi, no problem, as I said all anyone asks for is sources, and I would say the above indicates some notability for the Chronology of Jesus article, but you might want to also drop a note on the Talk there at the same time as adding material. And distinguish Wednesday and Thursday material. All the best. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:46, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Roman timekeeping system

Nice article you've started. A couple of comments:

1) The Roman day began at midnight long before the Julian reform. See Censorinus XII and particularly note 109. Censorinus also gives information about the introduction of sundials to Rome in the same chapter.

2) Some of your quotes are truncated at some arbitrary point -- see notes 4, 5, 9.

--Chris Bennett (talk) 00:23, 12 March 2012 (UTC)

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Benefits of talk page templates

I assume you know of WP:ALERTS; have you seen this application? Fun stuff :) --_{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| talk to me} 22:26, 13 March 2012 (UTC)

Another User:Oculi

Hi I. I. Oculi!

Maybe both you and User:Oculi should have a note about one another on your user pages?

(The kitten is doing well! Thanks again!)

Cheers, Kiefer.Wolfowitz 12:53, 16 March 2012 (UTC)

Barnstar/Minako Hamano

Thanks for the Barnstar! I gather that Minako Hamano's problem is that she does work-for-hire. Her work is considered notable and she has numerous mentions within other Misplaced Pages articles. The general perception also seems to be that she is notable; the Spanish article appears to be the fourth start. Pkeets (talk) 12:48, 17 March 2012 (UTC)

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Sasa Tuksar/Saša Tuksar

Hi. Thanks for the barnstar, much appreciated. I'd have no objection to you adding that in the lede. Cheers. Jevansen (talk) 11:29, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Catholic Church of Catholicism

Their creed:

I BELIEVE IN ONE GOD, Creator of Heaven and earth, And of all things visible and invisible. And in his Spiritual Son, Jesus Christ, Whom was born of Mary and Joseph, Was not consubstantial nor co-eternal with God the Father almighty, Suffered under Pontius Pilate; was crucified, died, and was buried. On the third day His Spirit was resurrected. He ascended into Heaven, And sitteth at the right hand of God, the Father almighty. Whence he shall come again to judge the living and the dead, Of whose Kingdom there shall be no end.

And I believe in the Holy Spirit, The Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church, The communion of saints, The forgiveness of sins, The resurrection of the Spirit, And life everlasting. Amen.

Does that sound anything at all like Arianism? LOL. It sounds like a mix of Origenism, Adoptionism, Ebionitism, Watchtower doctrine, and the Jesus Seminar, leaning towards Deism. He says at the end, "I believe in the forgiveness of sins" - well, according to the rest of the creed, how is that to be accomplished? Moral Therapeutic Deism? Animal sacrifice? What is the point of Christianity if not that Jesus died for sins? (Paul says as much, that if he didn't die and be resurrected in the body, that the faith is a fool's belief and a waste of time, but they don't hold that high of an opinion of the good Apostle.) In that creed, he's just some crucified dude (yea, aren't we all spiritual sons of God by adoption?). Arius is rolling over in his grave (and yelling "wake up!" at Pelagius, while grabbing Charles Taze Russell in one hand and Paul Tillich in the other, with Origen telling them all to pipe down)! I feel like posting this on the Christianity or Theology board, as I have never seen something quite so theologically confused. St John Chrysostom _τω 13:15, 22 March 2012 (UTC)

Or grammatically incorrect.

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Guilherme Clezar

Hey, yeah thanks. I still think it should be moved but it's not worth it. ;) Kante4 (talk) 13:52, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

Full names in leads

In and identical edits to 6 other talk pages, you refer to a guideline saying "the subject's full name should be given in the lead paragraph, if known." But you never say what you think should be changed in the 7 articles. Is your concern that a common English form of the name is given first and in bold? "full name" in WP:Manual_of_Style/Biographies#First_mention means to include often omitted parts of the name like a middle name. "full name" does not mean the name in the native language of the subject. For that, see Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style/Lead section#Foreign language. The name of the native language should not be italicised but apart from that the leads look OK to me. PrimeHunter (talk) 23:22, 23 March 2012 (UTC)

Hi PrimeHunter. The example given is

Chernivtsi Oblast (Ukrainian: Чернівецька область, Chernivets’ka oblast’) is an oblast (province) in western Ukraine, bordering on Romania and Moldova. "

This uses a non-Latin script, wheras for a Latin script we have examples such as:

Valéry Marie René Georges Giscard d'Estaing is a French centre-right politician who was President of the French Republic from 1974 until 1981.

I think that's the concern. In ictu oculi (talk) 00:33, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

I think Fyunck made this change, but as it currently stands, it is incorrect:

Aldin Šetkić (born December 21, 1987 in Sarajevo) and known professionally as Aldin Setkic, Yugoslavia)

The correct syntax should be:

Aldin Setkic (Croatian: Aldin Šetkić; December 21, 1987 in Sarajevo, Yugoslavia)

The above doesn't take into account any WP Tennis guidelines, if there are any on this. The "full name" needs to be in the same format as the title. If the title doesn't use diacritics, the "full name" shouldn't either. Bgwhite (talk) 00:09, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Silly me. I managed to pick the one of seven examples which didn't fit my post. See the other six at . PrimeHunter (talk) 00:22, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Unfortunately, as with most things wiki, the guideline is not straightforward, probably on purpose as no one wants every article to be a cookie cutter of the next article. We need to have the full name in the lead paragraph is about all that's clear. Well that paragraph can be awfully big. I kinda like it in the first sentence myself (if possible) and I'm not opposed to it going first either. You're right in that a full name does not mean his native language name. I had forgotten about that foreign language section but I had been making sure anyway that in articles I create or edit that the common English name was first with the foreign name second in parentheses as is shown at your example at Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style/Lead section#Foreign language. I believe an administrator pointed that out to me awhile back, probably citing the same section, and I've used it ever since. It seemed appropriate for foreign readers to see that right after the English name so I incorporated it in my edits. I'm not happy about a foreign spelled name being thrust into the first words of an article... it just looks wrong for an English language entity such as this. But while I included both the English and foreign names in the opening sentence, IIO has moved the foreign version up front and eliminated the English used Pseudonym completely. So it went from good to poor to non-acceptable in a flash. Fyunck(click) (talk) 00:23, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

I have repeatedly linked to the relevant WP MOS guidelines, assuming that they will be opened and the actual examples used considered. I see no need to rehash for my own reading on my own talkpage. Thanks. In ictu oculi (talk) 01:50, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

It's not practical to have the same discussion on 7 different article talk pages where most people would probably make the same posts like you did when you started the 7 sections. It's better to discuss in one place and post links to the discussion on other pages. If you prefer then we can move it to 1 of the 7 pages or to Misplaced Pages talk:WikiProject Tennis. Let me merely say here that the bolded name in the lead should use the same characters as the article title (see WP:BOLDTITLE) for the parts of the name that are in the title. That also holds for your example Valéry Giscard d'Estaing, and François Mitterrand at Misplaced Pages:Manual of Style/Biographies#First mention. If you want the bolded characters changed to use (or not use) diacritics when they currently match the page title then the page should be moved at the same time. Such moves have shown to be controversial per WP:COMMONNAME so they should usually get a requested move discussion. PrimeHunter (talk) 03:14, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

I think I noted on those 6 or 7 particular pages for particular reasons which at the time appeared egregious (out of the dozens possible) in the context of the way BLPs of that particular nationality are normally handled, hence the note on the relevant page. WP:BOLDTITLE doesn't include any accented examples, but yes WP:OPENPARA does give an example, François Mitterrand where WP:TITLE and WP:OPENPARA match up. As you say RMs can be controversial, which is why I was going by another experienced editor (Kauffner)'s preference that sometimes Title Francois Mitterand and First Mention François Mitterrand is a suitable compromise. Beyond that the latent issue is really how odd

Francois Mitterand (French François Mitterand).... etc.

looks in an encyclopedia.In ictu oculi (talk) 03:43, 24 March 2012 (UTC)

Request for assistance

The Ebionites article has already been accepted for further review by the Arbitration Committee, although the beginning of the case was stalled in an attempt to try mediation. I regret to say that, given the complications from a serious head-injury a few years back and the generally slight chance of recurring seizures as a result of same, at this point it is not necessarily in my own interests to spend much concentrated time on subjects which cause significant emotional responses and accompanying elevated neuromuscular tension to me. I have elsewhere indicated my disgust with certain other regular editors regarding that content, and, unfortnately, at this time, view it as probably being the only discussion here which might be counterproductive to my own health. I was wondering what you might think of, perhaps, assisting me in reviewing the previous discussions, some of which you yourself seem to have been involved in previous discussion, and was wondering what you might think of perhaps assisting in the evidence-collection and preparation stage. John Carter (talk) 00:01, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

This is WP:canvassing. Since James Tabor is now an editor on Misplaced Pages, it should be interesting watching you two clowns tell him to his face that his life's work is WP:Fringe. Good luck with that. Ignocrates (talk) 00:08, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Ignocrates, in all honesty, both as Ovadyah and Ignocrates I think, you have displayed a remarkably weak grasp of policies and guidelines. It is not canvassing to request assistance in an arbitration. In the past, I myself represented another editor before the ArbCom when that editor for reasons of her own, requested such. And one book is not a man's "life's work," as you allege above. I believe it is completely appropriate to request assistance in preparing a case when there are reasonable health problems which could be exacerbated by doing so. And your own recent edit history reveals that your own prior notifications regarding WP:STALK have perhaps gone perhaps ignored. However, if you believe otherwise, please feel free to post to the appropriate page regarding your allegations of misconduct. This is not that page, however. You remember the one where you accused me of being a sockpuppet of User:John, right? John Carter (talk) 00:22, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Hi John, Ebionites and various others of these pages are on my watchlist. Probably you should let health take priority and let this kind of behaviour and "scholarship," multiply, the behaviour above pretty well showing how things are going to go. In ictu oculi (talk) 00:30, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

Like I said, the case has already been accepted by ArbCom. The question, at this point, seems to be preparing the case. And however much the behavior might "multiply", as you have said it, there may well have to come a time when some sort of action regarding that behavior is taken. John Carter (talk) 00:34, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

The only thing "multiplying" in this case is further evidence of your lack of WP:competence. Ignocrates (talk) 01:03, 27 March 2012 (UTC)

I'm sorry about that dust-up. Sorry that you had to be involved. I have asked for an administrative review of John Carter's fitness as a administrator. This has to end for the good of the encyclopedia. I hope we can get past this and edit together productively again. Ignocrates (talk) 23:54, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

You mean your "you two clowns" comment above? I wasn't that bothered. And I have no objection to John asking for help to keep fringe theories from overweight. In ictu oculi (talk) 08:18, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

In response to Iggy, that statement is ridiculous. It was not canvassing. Maybe if you made any sort of attempt to actually understand policies and guidelines, you might make more sense. Or is it simply that you do not care about them, if they don't help you to promote your beloved EJC? John Carter (talk) 01:38, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

I will repeat what I said above. "This has to end for the good of the encyclopedia." Please read this statement more slowly this time and reflect on its meaning. Ignocrates (talk) 02:16, 30 March 2012 (UTC)

Zombie articles

Hi - You recently participated in a move proposal discussion regarding articles about zombies and zombie pop culture archived at Talk:Zombie. That proposal was not approved, and a new discussion is taking place at Talk:Zombie (fictional) that is narrower in scope, and concerns only whether the older Voodoo and newer Romero zombie pop culture should be included in the same article or whether it should be separated. These are articles that receive a lot of hits, and should probably get more input than just the two editors having the current discussion. I'm flagging all old move discussion participants regarding the new discussion, and your input would be appreciated. LaTeeDa (talk) 21:51, 28 March 2012 (UTC)

Please see here

Deletion of REDIRECT Zhirinovsky's ass

Thanks! Mootros (talk) 08:08, 29 March 2012 (UTC)

Talkback

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Talkback

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Bible translation pages

I can see that you have created a large number of pages dealing with various translations of the Bible. However, these are mostly incomplete stubs, and would probably better be added to Translations of the Bible with your pages becoming redirects. Wer900 _{essay on the definition of consensus} 01:35, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

Bible translations into Manx

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Proposed deletion of Bible translations into Cambodian

The article Bible translations into Cambodian has been proposed for deletion because of the following concern:

unreferenced essay, original research

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Bible Translation into Malayalam

I am delayed to see your call on the page mentioned above. There are some useful infos in that ip edit. I think, We could find some sources. --AshLey 12:53, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

WikiThanks

In recognition of all the work you’ve done lately! 66.87.7.141 (talk) 23:18, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

RE:Dénes Lukács

Hello. Apparently he wasn't involved in any battle but was the organizer of artillery production, training of artilleryman and city defense. He was evacuated as the Austrians advanced and this continued until the Hungarian surrender. Lajbi 13:36, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Talkback

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He's mentioned you so I thought you should be aware. Dougweller (talk) 20:54, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Your recent edit

You just added: "Individual Bibles should be categorized under "Bible translations by language|Bulgarian" etc." I'm not sure what you mean by that, could you elaborate? Do you mean individual translations? Or capital I, like an Individual known/named Bible (i.e. the Alabama State Bible, George Washington Inaugural Bible)? Editor2020 (talk) 03:35, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Tireless Contributor Barnstar
	Thanks for all your hard work on List of Bible translations by language and all of the associated articles. Editor2020 (talk) 16:04, 8 April 2012 (UTC)

Interwiki

Just a quick note that interwikilinks used in articles have no starting colon. You only use the colon when you specificly want to refer to any page on another project like eg in a talkpage discussion where you might say "But the article at new:articlename says so and so" Agathoclea (talk) 14:07, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

talkback

Hiya speedy! (in reference to "in the blink of an eye" ),

I just wanted to drop a note to you that I left a rather lengthy reply on directed your way on my talk page. I think that I rambled on a little but, but I'm fairly sure that everything is on point so I hope that it's not too difficult to read through. I wasn't sure if if you intended to "sign off" with your last reply (you said "thanks for this answer.", which kinda closes off your reply), and my response is lengthy, so I just wanted to drop a note here.

Oh, by the way, you should check out User:MiszaBot//Archive HowTo (or User:ClueBot_III#How to archive your page) and set up some archiving on this page. It's getting a bit long, so the load time is sort of lengthy. (actually, Help:Archiving a talk page is more generally helpful) Regards,
— V = IR (Talk • Contribs) 19:23, 10 April 2012 (UTC)

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God the Father

There is some current discussion at the talk page of the above named article regarding the amount of weight and sources to give material in the article relating to Oneness Pentecostalism. History2007 indicated that he thinks that you might be somewhat knowledgeable about this subject, and I think your input would be welcome. John Carter (talk) 23:31, 12 April 2012 (UTC)

Counts of Louvain: new move request

Hi Witger, just a courtesy-message to inform you to I have submitted a move request of "Counts of Louvain" to "Counts of Leuven". You can find my reasoning here: Talk:Counts_of_Louvain. Kind regards, Morgengave (talk) 22:31, 14 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks to you as well for your BLP work. It's nice to see consensus among several editors slowly bear good results. Doremo (talk) 09:37, 15 April 2012 (UTC)

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Smaller balls of fire

Aargh. Too many tabs open.... TREKphiler 03:35, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

Diacritics in BLPs discussion

I saw your post at Casliber's talk, but when I followed the link, I found no discussion. Because I edit Spanish-lanugage articles, I'd like to be part of this discussion. Where is it? SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:01, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

(watching) This perhaps? --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:09, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

Thanks! (It would be helpful if the notice included a direct link, or if the sub-heading on that page mentioned diacritics :) I'm in! SandyGeorgia (Talk) 15:28, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

Agree :) --Gerda Arendt (talk) 15:30, 20 April 2012 (UTC)

Talk:Ana_Ivanovic#Survey

I'm really shocked to see this RM closed as it nearly passed the deadline of a recommended week of discussion. A Facebook page was named the reason for moving, which is the lowpoint of this diacritics debate. Noone was notified about the request (it was carefully omitted from the news section of the front page a WP:TENNIS). Late opposing comments were removed. Was even WT:WikiProject Serbia aware of this at all? Or you? Lajbi 16:09, 23 April 2012 (UTC)

I wasn't aware of/interested in this tennis names (or any other sports BLP) in Feb 2012. My attention was canvassed by extreme bad behaviour only recently. RMs can be closed before 7 days. The problem with that RM was not notifying Project Serbia for a "high importance" article. Plus the closer being a participant. Anyway, it's only been at odds with the 20 other Ivanović BLPs for a couple of months, and there is an issue with Serbian romanization which means Serbian names are probably best left separately. In ictu oculi (talk) 23:26, 23 April 2012 (UTC)

Isaiah 7:14

Would you like to have a look at what I've done with this article and tell me any changes you think are necessary? PiCo (talk) 05:48, 24 April 2012 (UTC)

Harrasment to consider adminship

As you know, I am persistent, possibly/probably obsessive-compulsive, editor with a habit of never letting go of an idea. ~~that somehow manages to work its way through my rather, uh,~~ One idea which has occurred to me is that you are not currently an administrator. Unless you want to receive regular, rather boring and monotonous, comments, meaningless insults, and craven pleadings to become an administrator, I think it might be in your own interests to respond regarding whether you would find the possibility acceptable. ;) John Carter (talk) 00:14, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

I don't think I would pass as an admin primarily because I bumped heads with Jayjg over my attempts to include the Oxford Hebrew and Reuben Alcalay dictionaries as sources at Yeshu in 2010. Not in a bad way but I would expect Jayjg to oppose. Also I would have wild squeals of diacritic-free objection from the WP:TENNISNAMES lobby for attempting to make French tennis players spellings consistent with French presidents. Besides, it's a lot of work and as you say, even more insults. In ictu oculi (talk) 00:20, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

I've butted heads with Jayjg myself more than once, and he hasn't objected to my continued adminship, even when I recently asked for his review of it to see if I should stay one. Regarding tennis names, I think that is probably a comparatively minor matter. You haven't been blocked even once yet, and that is a major point in your favor. I only became an admin to edit protected templates, and, actually, that's about all I do as an admin. So, if there are any aspects of adminship that might appeal to you, you certainly could indicate in an RfAdmin that at least initially those would be the only things you might involve yourself in. Regarding inclusion of dictionaries, I think that might relate to the extant Judaism MOS. There is now a rough draft of a Manual of Style for Religion in general, and I think it could certainly include many, if not most, of the points in the Judaism MOS, and the NRM MOS (I love abbreviations) in slightly revised form. Right now, I'm trying to finish the tagging for the Christianity articles in the Jones Encyclopedia, but I hope to work on the MOS shortly. In any event, if there are any aspects of adminship that appeal to you, I would be more than happy to sponsor you. I more or less promise the harassment ends here. John Carter (talk) 00:31, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Well, if nothing else it's a conscience prick that I owe Jayjg an olive branch that I thought to do two months ago but got distracted. Adminship doesn't really appeal to be honest, not sure what areas of it I would do something in. In ictu oculi (talk) 00:45, 25 April 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, do it! PiCo (talk) 13:24, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

You're welcome :). I've been having fun on Wiki tonight - I decided to llok uyp Love, since it's such a vexatious matter ("Tell me the truth about love!") Surely, I thought, Wiki must have words to say on this, words which will set my heart aflame with understanding. But I think I'l stick to the poets after al. But I did find that someone in all innocence had put a pic of Sacred and Profane Lovge up as an illustration of... what, I wonder? I doubt very much that the someone responsible had any idea of the background to that mawkish masterpiece - so I added a little background, just to set them straight. The Internet rots your brain, did you know that? PiCo (talk) 13:40, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

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Notice of Wikiquette Assistance discussion

Hello, In ictu oculi. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Wikiquette assistance regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.

Thanks Fyunck, but agree with the admin that it belongs on the relevant Talk page. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:04, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Proposed Religion Manual of style

We now have a proposed MOS for religious content at Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Religion/Manual of style. I have recently added some material which I basically copied from the extant Judaism and NRM manuals, but think that one of the big problems this MOS might have to face that others might not is how to deal with content, like John the Baptist and some other Biblical figures, which is important to multiple religions, although not necessarily for the same reasons or in the same way. John the Baptist, for instance, is considered the Messiah by the Mandaeans, who see Jesus in a negative light. If you would have any opinions on how to structure guidelines dealing with such content, I think we would all welcome it. John Carter (talk) 23:55, 26 April 2012 (UTC)

Diacritics debate

Hello In ictu oculi. There was no need to thank me at all, I just expressed what I considered appropriate at that point. I may have been a bit hard on causa sui, but he was hard on you as well, and I didn´t appreaciate after all his recomendation of you dropping the issue after all the efort you have done, and all of that because of no valid reason for you to drop it. He should either expressed a valid rationale that could be usefull for the discussion, or otherwise simply recomending someone to give up just because he prefers it that way is kind of a non-valid argument.

The throuth is that I appreciated your effort in getting this discussion finished once and for all, and your effort in trying to archive some consensus and guideline for everyone over this issue. Avoiding it, or dropping it as causa sui suggested, will inevitably just further delay the solving of this problem and create further unecesary discussions over this in future. I already participated in a number of this same discussions over the last couple of years, and it was painfull to see each time us going nowhere after great ammount of effort and time that has been dedicated in those discussions by numerous editors. So, at least this time I hoped some result would be archived at the end. Anyway, thank you for your kind words. Best regards, FkpCascais (talk) 00:35, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Messianic Sources

Since you asked, a number of your questions are answered in the Messianic Judaism history section. Specficially: Note 10 (Ariel) says the term 'resurfaced' in Israel in the 1940s and 1950s, leading the casual reader to assume it had existed prior to then. Note 52(also Ariel) explains that in the 1890s "immigrant Jews who had accepted the Christian faith yet contained to retain Jewish rites and customs ... (promoted) the idea that Jewish converts should not abandon their cultural and religious heritage." Note 58 (Cohen-Sherbok)says Rabinowitz was writing blended orders of service in 1865. With note 54, Rausch explains the the Messianic Jewish movement and the Hebrew Christian movement were both operating in 1915. The sources seem to indicate the Messianic movement grew quietly in the US after the 20s, seeking respectability, and continued to operate in other countries (including Russia and Israel); the Hebrew Christian viewpoints took precedence until the 1960s, when Jesus Movement and Jews for Jesus saw a growth of young people not content to sit in HC congregations, and in Note 57, Hocken explains these youth changed the purposes and the name of the HC congregations and started using the name Messianic Judaism.--DeknMike (talk) 04:19, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Yes I saw some of that in the article. I think the editors working on the page have produced a good an informative article (certainly to someone less informed like me). I was just suggesting other avenues for article development which would avoid banging heads. If John Carter has offered help with edits its an offer worth taking. Cheers. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:02, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

RE:Katalin É. Kiss

No, it's just something like George W. Bush. A middle name. I will dig into it and find out what kind of name is is. It must be Éva I guess, it's quite common in Hungary but I'll make it sure. Lajbi 11:07, 28 April 2012 (UTC)

Yes you are right, I came to the same conclusion recently I've just forgot to inform you. Her father was also a famous academian but there's no sign of what that É could stand for as initial. And that "É Kiss" is quite exclusively paired together and there's no result for "É Tóth" for example. Strange indeed. Lajbi 09:13, 15 May 2012 (UTC)

Consistency

As you will be aware I have just placed this onto the the talk page of

I object to creating WP:MATCHTITLE for the same reasons that Blueboar has given (We already have a linked called WP:NAMINGCRITERIA). I think that your argument about consistency is I think flawed. You give the example of Frédéric Vitoux (writer) and Frederic Vitoux (tennis), but what do those two people share in common other than a nationality and a first name? Arguing that both should have their name spelt "Frédéric" for consistency between articles (and not through usage in reliable sources) is pushing the envelope and a POV.

I was going to follow it up with a second paragraph, but that second paragraph is really an editor to editor message so I have decided to post it here instead:

That you want to create a short cut to overemphasise one criteria that you think will help you advance you point of view is a bad idea. There comes a point where passionate argument for a point of view becomes disruptive and I think that if you create this redirect without a clear consensus to do so, when other editors have expressed their opposition, you will have crossed the Rubicon into disruptive behaviour. My opinion of course is just that, but I suspect that others will agree with me. I dislike user RfCs because they are very time consuming and so I have never initiated one, but if you create this link when other have expressed clear objections I may. You have to ask yourself would two other editors second it? -- PBS (talk) 08:45, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

Hopefully some users who don't have a history in this area will comment. In ictu oculi (talk) 09:05, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

AuthorityTam

You've claimed that there is a "2 vs 1 situation" 'against' AuthorityTam. In fact, several editors (including pro-JW editors) indicated at the previous ANI that AuthorityTam's behaviour—particularly his frequent digs at BlackCab— are inappropriate. The main problem is regarding AuthorityTam's persistent irrelevant comments about other editors, and it's entirely unclear how requesting that he cease that behaviour would be at all detrimental to his making useful edits to JW articles.--Jeffro77 (talk) 08:46, 30 April 2012 (UTC)

Just a little uninvited input here. While I don't see every altercation between the three editors, my personal observations have been that there are no innocent victims in this circumstance. I personally have observed the 2 on 1 tag-team behavior that editor in ictu oculi has also noted. My personal advice would be to break up the tag team and see if that doesn't help to improve the situation. But that will require effort on the part of the two editors in question and I am not sure they will be willing to make such efforts...however, time will tell. Willietell (talk) 00:08, 3 May 2012 (UTC)

Article in your field

I have recently nominated Joses up for merger. A few other editors have objected. It is interesting to check the communications between some, by the way. Anyway, considering that article is more or less in your specialty field, if you could produce evidence that it is notable, or have an opinion on the merger, either would be more than welcome.

And, by the way, I have finished the article list for "Israelite religion" (the Hebrew Bible, basically). It can be found at User:John Carter/Religion articles#Israelite religion. I'm going to try to finish the rest of the lists, and then look for and assess all the related articles. John Carter (talk) 00:12, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi John

I've had a look and made some edits. I don't think it can be merged as it covers two Joses (even though that was somewhat submerged in the jumble). The actual Desposyni article and some other Cath Enc stubs which appear to have poor sourcing would also need work.

I'm having connectivity problems every time I try and reply on your page by the way. Maybe you need to archive it for length like I had to do. In ictu oculi (talk) 10:44, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Controversial moves

Please stop your disruptive editing. If you continue to move pages to bad titles contrary to naming conventions or consensus, you may be blocked from editing.

From your recent edit history it is impossible for you to be unaware that these moves would controversial and as you have participated in WP:RM discussions that you are aware of that process.

I have reverted the moves and put them up for a WP:RM. If you make such moves in future then use the WP:RM. If you come across any other editor making moves of articles with accent marks to without--or visa versa--without without discussing it on the talk page first, preferably with a WP:RM request, let me know and I will take the necessary administrative action to rectify the moves.

From you user history recent controversial moves:

02:43, 1 May 2012 m Ondřej Látal ‎ (In ictu oculi moved page Ondrej Latal to Ondřej Látal: , per BLP accuracy, sources in article, MOS consistency with other Ondřejs and other Látals)
02:53, 1 May 2012 m Ondřej Martinka ‎ (In ictu oculi moved page Ondrej Martinka to Ondřej Martinka: spelled Ondřej)
02:54, 1 May 2012 m Ondřej Malinský ‎ (In ictu oculi moved page Ondrej Malinsky to Ondřej Malinský: another Ondřej, clean history, sourced, per BLP accuracy)
03:00, 1 May 2012 m Ondřej Šedivý ‎ (In ictu oculi moved page Ondrej Sedivy to Ondřej Šedivý: Another Ondřej, per BLP accuracy, sources confirm family name Šedivý) (top)

-- PBS (talk) 08:28, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Philip

I clearly understand the strength of your personal feelings re "Is this an English Misplaced Pages or an international one?" etc. but I wasn't expecting this. To me this is simple good housekeeping, as I potter around WP and see things that will improve sourcing and articles I source and improve - particularly where BLPs are concerned. I don't share your view that a move based on sourced information constitutes "bad titles" nor "contrary to naming conventions." You could have simply reverted, or discussed if you disagreed. You have never contributed to these articles, or anything related. If you want to take a gauge of the barometre try searching you will find 211 articles, mainly BLPs, mainly depending on Chicago-MOS sources or "German for German politicians" MOS guidance where English sources are lacking. But I don't intend to oppose you on this. You can have your way. In ictu oculi (talk) 10:16, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

This has nothing to do with your perception of my POV (the fact that over the last week you have totally ignored my emphasis on sourced based article titles shows a lack of good faith). This has everything to do with controversial moving of articles. It does not matter which way they are moved from names without accent marks to names with accent marks or vice versa, such moves are controversial and should be made using WP:RM. You wrote "this is simple good housekeeping, as I potter around WP and see things that will improve sourcing and articles I source and improve - particularly where BLPs are concerned", then by all means improve the sources and if you think that that justifies moving the article title to either strip or add accent marks then put in a WP:RM for that article. If you do not then after this warning it is likely to be seen as disruptive. -- PBS (talk) 13:31, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Philip, you're hardly uninvolved. Anyway, I won't be doing anything in this area for a time. You take care. In ictu oculi (talk) 13:39, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Meaning inviting your good self to another RfC on BLPs at least, when I see a badly sourced BLP I will continue to source and improve. But in the present environment it's probably best to leave a badly sourced BLP at an incorrect name. In ictu oculi (talk) 23:52, 3 May 2012 (UTC)

Not to mention it is completely standard to make these sorts of moves without a request for move. It only goes to request for move if someone objects. The fact that you (PBS) forced all the moves to RfM is far more disruptive than their initial move especially when its fairly clear it will end up being moved anyways. Essentially you just wasted a lot of peoples time. -DJSasso (talk) 18:44, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

I'd agree that it's timewasting. Now, in what way are accurate titles automatically "bad titles", according to the warning template above? bobrayner (talk) 14:56, 2 May 2012 (UTC)

As DJSasso predicted they were all moved anyway, virtually unanimously and with PBS himself concluding that the rationale for the move was "a perfectly respectable argument that follows guidance" which I take as meaning what it said. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:37, 11 May 2012 (UTC)

Draeske?

? --Shirt58 (talk) 13:17, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Felix Draeseke, obviously. My mistake. Please apply WP:PISCINEPUGILISM as appropriate.--Shirt58 (talk) 13:37, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

No problem, you sure you wouldn't prefer to share the trout together grilled with parsley? :) Cheers In ictu oculi (talk) 13:41, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks

Hehe, not at all. ;-) I'm here to help. :) I'm admin on BS Wiki, so I usually keep an eye on the recent changes. ;) If you have some questions about Bosnian (or ex-Yugoslav) spellings, just hit me. :) -- Kukac (talk) 15:52, 1 May 2012 (UTC)

Turning Đ into Dj

Hi In ictu oculi, I just wanted to tell you that I was planning in some near future to open a debate about the fact that all languages using Gaj's Latin alphabet letter Đ should have their letter transliterated in English into Dj. To back this proposal, which will affect 4 languages and numerous articles, I was counting on WP:COMMONNAME and the fact that most (if not all) English language sources use the letter Dj instead. Novak Djokovic is already an exemple of it. However, that proposal should be announced in all related projects and a consensus about it should be reached. As I haven´t had the necessary time for it, for time being I was delaying it, but I just thought that it would be nice to let you know about it, and to hear your thoughts perhaps. FkpCascais (talk) 09:19, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

I honestly don't know. I'm guessing that if Chicago MOS 11.18 says anything it may well say Đ, which is what english.Blic.rs mainly uses. But in Google Scholar scientists with Đ for soft dž are frequently Dj particularly if Serbian. This is something you'd need to discuss on the WikiProject Serbia page. And on WikiProjects Bosnia and Croatia. In ictu oculi (talk) 09:56, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Hope you don't mind me butting in; but we already have problems with fragmented/contradictory typographical rules (and practices), with different projects doing their own thing, and this often causes a lot of drama further down the line. Although WikiProjects focussed on particular countries certainly have interested editors, I think it would be better to try to "centralise" discussions like this. (Disclaimer: I favour neither Đ nor Dj but am very keen to avoid more move-wars). bobrayner (talk) 10:56, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Yes Bob I agree, and in this case the Projects using the Đ would do well to have some discussion consensus among themselves first before it goes anywhere. In ictu oculi (talk) 11:02, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Any of you doesn´t need to warry, I was just thinking about this and gathering thouths from other users. The thing is that the letter Đ has been often cited by the editors opposing diacritics, and it is basically used unecessarily, as even local alphabets equaly use it along the Dj variant, so it would have been a way to replace one diacritical letter with a "normal" one, and to put the words closer of their English language usage (as in Đokovic → Djokovic case already happends), and also more easily phoneticaly perceved. I don´t mind at all you Bobrayner coming here, right the opposite, I even appreciate a lot to hear more opinions on this. Just to let you know that my idea was indeed to have one centralised discussion, I was just refering to the fact that all related projects should be aware and notified when the discussion happends. FkpCascais (talk) 11:39, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi FkpCascais, sure. It's always good to discuss first. I look forward to seeing Joy/Shallot's input, she seems very well informed. Cheers :) In ictu oculi (talk) 11:52, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Two points about early Christianity

Please see the new section at Talk:Messianic Judaism. Also, I note that User:Ignocrates has apparently retired, as per his comments on his user and user talk page. That leaves only one active editor of the James Tabor/Robert Eisenman/Ebionites POV cabal active, and that fact might make it easier to improve that article. John Carter (talk) 18:40, 4 May 2012 (UTC)

Ta

Hello, In ictu oculi. You have new messages at Hazara-Birar's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Talkback

Hello, In ictu oculi. You have new messages at Hazara-Birar's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

Richard Barrington

Many thanks. I see my mistake. Robert Notafly (talk) 08:59, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Not a problem, as I said, nice bio. I added a WikiProject Ireland tag. In ictu oculi (talk) 09:11, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Estimate

Just out of curiosity, how did you come by this estimate of the proportion of articles with diacritics cf potential population? Cheers, --Ohconfucius 03:51, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

It may not be very accurate. I asked a regular BLP editor how many BLPs, he said 898,000. Of those I estimate about 400,000 are in the possible Latin-alphabet diacritic space, but half would be naturally non-diacritic. It may be more or less, but it should be 150-250,000 given some rule of thumb checks. In ictu oculi (talk) 08:24, 8 May 2012 (UTC)

New project

FYI Misplaced Pages:WikiProject Christian History seems like your field, so may want to just add a signature. History2007 (talk) 15:15, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Eric Grauffel and other Erics

Hi, please make sure you give a source when you change someone's name; even Eric Grauffel's own webpage does not use the spelling "Éric". Cheers. Hairhorn (talk) 01:15, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

English websites rarely use É majuscule, even French websites find it difficult. In ictu oculi (talk) 05:30, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

May 2012

Please do not remove content or templates from pages on Misplaced Pages, as you did to Filip Horanský, without giving a valid reason for the removal in the edit summary. Your content removal does not appear constructive and has been reverted. Please make use of the sandbox if you'd like to experiment with test edits. Thank you. Fyunck(click) (talk) 17:50, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Please do not remove content or templates from pages on Misplaced Pages, as you did to Tomislav Brkić, without giving a valid reason for the removal in the edit summary. Your content removal does not appear constructive and has been reverted. Please make use of the sandbox if you'd like to experiment with test edits. Thank you. This was also done on Andrej Kračman, Filip Horanský, Germán López‎,, Aldin Šetkić and dozens and dozens of others. You have been asked before to stop and appear to ignore the request. please stop. Fyunck(click) (talk) 17:57, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

Fyunck

There is guidance on these templates' pages on not using them in the way you have done, however I'll leave these templates here as a record.

I take this as indication that you're going to persist in edit warring "Filip Horanský known professionally/in tennis as Filip Horansky" into articles. As far as I know the situation remains that a dozen editors have asked you to stop doing that, and not one supported it. In ictu oculi (talk) 21:45, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

If you persist in censoring English names from tennis articles then I will keep putting them back. There have been several others who agree. I see from your 100s of edits that you are on a crusade to rid all wikipedias of English sourced names especially this English Misplaced Pages, good for you, but please stop your edit warring and censoring on established English sourced tennis names. It's one thing to switch around the order of multiple name spellings in an article, it's quite another to censor them completely as though they don't exist. Fyunck(click) (talk) 06:42, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

Maybe because they are not "English names" Agathoclea (talk) 06:49, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

We disagree there. If almost all English sources use the name in a particular way it "is" the common English version, like it or not. Some players even have personal websites spelled this way in English... yet are ignored by editors. These players actually chose the English spelling of their names for tennis purposes. If IIO continues to censor these spellings I will continue to put them back. there are many things I let slide as an editor but it isn't worth editing on[REDACTED] if I allow IIOs censorship to stand. I answer you here because I don't believe anything IIO writes from prior experience. As I see below he's at it again. Unbelievable. Fyunck(click) (talk) 07:08, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks Agathoclea

Fyunck, hello. Yes I know, you have put them back. I just changed only 3 of the 15 following the Gérard Solvès move to agree with the consensus, and you restored them immediately against the consensus as if the consensus and move hadn't happened. Doesn't WP:OPENPARA or that fact that a dozen editors, even those who agree with you on use of sports sources such as Kauffner, have asked you to please not to add this line in bother you at all? My only "crusade" was to weigh in with the majority against your WP:TENNISNAMES bullying of other tennis editors, otherwise I simply getting on with life editing articles in accordance with what everyone else on en.wp does and what the guidelines, and erring on the side of leaving articles with badly sourced sports websites where necessary. However the English-sports-sources problems shouldn't affect scholars, scientists, composers and politicians. You need to get on with life and find something more useful to do than putting these silly WP:TENNISNAMES arguments into BLP ledes. In ictu oculi (talk) 06:57, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

French National Assembly, Thélus Léro etc.

I too, have a growing concern with these unilatteral page moves to diarticial titles - which haven't ceased. These moves come across as quite arrogant in nature & don't make for a good atmosphere around the topic. GoodDay (talk) 17:22, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

In ictu oculi, I wouldn't worry too much over this squabble with GoodDay. He's a well-known diacritic-o-phobic (one of the ever fewer), and it's doubtful that he's aware that there are English words with diacritics. This is just his way of trying to intimidate people with other views. Despite his alleged care for the English language – and his perceived need to "protect" it from diacritics – he doesn't bother to write the word "English" capitalized (at least not always), and has an odd habit of inserting a comma between the subject and the predicate – neither of which can be described as standard English language or punctuation.

By describing some moves as "controversial" and "arrogant", and claiming that there's a "dispute" going on – which he does his best to keep alive – he seems to think that he can exercise his veto at WP:RM. He has tried that several times, but mostly failed. Don't be intimidated. Keep up your good work. Remember: the dogs may bark, but the caravan moves on. HandsomeFella (talk) 22:28, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

So you're advising ictu to avoid RMs & make unilateral page moves? GoodDay (talk) 23:52, 12 May 2012 (UTC)

I'm not giving any advice in that matter either way, I'm just saying that he should not worry too much over what can be perceived as threats from you (on your talkpage) if he doesn't comply with your demands. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you're an admin. And, oh, what you call "unilateral page moves" is just being bold. There is a move tab on articles for a reason. HandsomeFella (talk) 10:36, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

I haven't made any demands, though. GoodDay (talk) 14:05, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

This: "Remember, no more unilateral moves from 'no dios' to 'dios'." sure sounds like a demand to me, and this: "If you don't start going about the RM route, more editors will complain & some of them aren't as nice as me." could easily be perceived as a disguised threat (or else a gang of anti-dio thugs will come IIO's way). It's good that you have now retracted that. HandsomeFella (talk) 15:06, 13 May 2012 (UTC)

It would be a first for me that anyone has objected to a French non-sportsperson being given a French name given that François Mitterrand is actually used as an example in WP:OPENPARA. Since GoodDay cannot make/revert on diacritics I have no objection to bundling Hegesippe Legitimus and a few other guadeloupean/martiniquais bios through RM, if it helps reassure GoodDay that French names are uncontroversial on en.wp. In ictu oculi (talk) 01:09, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

It's pretty apparent that GoodDay isn't acting on logic and reason, but on feelings. Look at this change to his talkpage. I seen a good deal of silliness here at wp, but this sure makes it into the top 10. HandsomeFella (talk) 07:15, 15 May 2012 (UTC)

Edouard de Laurot

Thank you for your improvements to this article! I'm curious where you found the info about his date and place of birth. Also, there is some template on the talk page implying the article itself is not sufficiently sourced. Does this need to be addressed somehow, or do you have any other good sources you would recommend to use in expanding the article? Voila-pourquoi (talk) 03:22, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Hi, this was phenomenally difficult to source, I hope I have included the date and place of birth in the footnotes, oh.. looks not, rats. The place Łódź was from a Polish source, not Warsaw. There's confusion about the name too, "Lada Laudański" is sourced but unbelievable, Lawdański ..a być może herbem Laudański (inna nazwa Lawdański). I may have to go back to it but I was almost at wits end, little or nothing in Polish or French. Are there any more recent French sources you know? In ictu oculi (talk) 03:49, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Do you speak Polish? I'm fluent in French. If you're available to help out I think we could improve this article substantially. I'll be able to dig through some sources in English and French later this week. I'm curious: how did you first come across mention of Laurot? Voila-pourquoi (talk) 14:49, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

French and Polish. I was just browsing and something clicked a bell from years back. In ictu oculi (talk) 15:37, 14 May 2012 (UTC)

Thanks for the Rosetta Barnstar

Hey, thanks for the barnstar!

Is there any place that I can look for requests for translation questions or language questions on biblical Greek? I have limited time, but I'd be happy to look over some of these requests, and could probably find others who could do the same (perhaps by recruiting on the B-Greek forum). Jonathan.robie (talk) 21:09, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

An editor's talkpage

I'm allowed to 'delete' anything from my talkpage, just like you're allowed on yours. GoodDay (talk) 02:35, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

You are indeed, as I said, I'll try to take your explanation on good faith. Happy editing. In ictu oculi (talk) 03:06, 22 May 2012 (UTC)

Technical move?

I saw your reply at Misplaced Pages talk:Inverin suggesting a technical move. What is that in contrast to a move request, as I have done, and where can I read about how to request a technical move? I have searched Help and did not find it listed under "technical moves". Thank you. — O'Dea (talk) 04:58, 23 May 2012 (UTC)

In ictu oculi, you are invited!

You're invited to be a part of Misplaced Pages:WikiProject University of Belgrade, an attempt to better organize information in articles related to the University of Belgrade. To accept this invitation, click here! Articles related to other universities in Belgrade, Serbia and Southeast Europe may be discussed as well. This helps share information and foster knowledge about higher education in the region.

Wow! I see you have done a lot of valuable work on Misplaced Pages! I strongly encourage you to open the new section within the WikiProject, as I wrote on the talk page. We can always expand our goals and scope ;) As this is the only Serbian universities WikiProject, it might occure that people interested in other universities in Serbia (or even the region) might want to join and in my opinion the WikiProect should eccept them :) --Comparativist1 (talk) 10:28, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

I have just created a section entitled "Other universities" special just for you. Please let me know if it is in the right place. Feel free to change anything. I have also changed the "Scope".--Comparativist1 (talk) 11:16, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

WP:INDENT

It would be helpful, if you read WP:INDENT. GoodDay (talk) 15:31, 27 May 2012 (UTC)

RfA

I hesitate to appear to be canvassing by bringing this to your attention, but an arbitrator specifically stated "I would like to hear from other community members who have had recent experiences with GoodDay's editing", and GoodDay has mentioned you (though not by name). The RfA is here. — P.T. Aufrette (talk) 10:47, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

I see where I'm mentioned. I suppose that is sufficient reason to come in. I feel a bit sorry actually, although he's a bit random he's probably hurting himself more than anyone, and he's really just a chorus follower in the tennis names saga, which started without him back in mid January among tennis editors and GoodDay didn't even know about the Ivanovic move. I guess if my name is mentioned by actual name I can take that as invitation. Thanks for pointing it out, as I clearly have been mentioned your message isn't canvassing. In ictu oculi (talk) 11:14, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

Stop adding personal comments on article and guideline talk pages

Iio you have repeatedly been asked to stop creating new inappropriate sections and to stop with placing personal comments onto inappropriate talk pages. Your latest section Misplaced Pages talk:Manual of Style/Proper names#Sandbox edits in diacritics section continue is both. It can in no way be justified as a consensus building exercise. If you persist then we will have to have a RfC to see if such behaviour is to be tolerated. -- PBS (talk) 12:22, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Believe me I'm doing my very best not to be "personal" regarding your deletion and edits of MOSPN. It does not give me any please to make comments such as "an exceptionally high degree of WP:DIDNTHEARTHAT." 21 May, and I withdraw that now, 29 May, you have agreed to discuss a real example article to support your deletions/edits to MOSPN, now we may see some progress. In ictu oculi (talk) 22:54, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Instead of stopping and using user talk pages for personal comments, I see that you have instead Misplaced Pages talk:Manual of Style/Proper names#Sandbox edits in diacritics section continue persisted in adding more personal comments to the same section, starting a new comment with "Philip, you respond to this as 'personal'..." which to a third party would be baffling unless they have read your talk page.

Not only that but having stated on the same guideline talk page that "It suddenly occurs to me this morning that PBS and MakeSense64 are not refusing to do this out of stubborness or game-playing but simply because they can't. They don't know any language with diacritics, so I might as well be demanding they give an opinion on cuneiform or heiroglyphics." (before I posted this warning) you have now compounded it by asking "Please, don't take this question 'personal', you deleted the diacritics section here, but do you speak/read any language which has diacritics? Which one(s)?" I have had enough I am going to post a ANI on you behaviour. -- PBS (talk) 08:06, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

Arbitration case opened

An arbitration case in which you commented has been opened, and is located at Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GoodDay. Evidence that you wish the Arbitrators to consider should be added to the evidence sub-page, at Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GoodDay/Evidence. Please add your evidence by February 6, 2012, which is when the evidence phase closes. You can contribute to the case workshop sub-page, Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Requests/Case/GoodDay/Workshop. For a guide to the arbitration process, see Misplaced Pages:Arbitration/Guide to arbitration. For the Arbitration Committee, Alexandr Dmitri (talk) 22:04, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Question re Bible translations into Norwegian

Madrigals

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Defaultsort

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For real?

Pedro Antonio Avondano

Saint Thomas Christian page bullying

Barnstar

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Input on Saint Thomas Christians

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Renaming templates

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Simulated cannibalism

A barnstar for you!

Precious

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Category deleted but came back under another name?

Talkback

A challenge

Q Source Nonsense

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Speedy deletion nomination of Joseph Michel

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Wednesday Crucifixion

Roman timekeeping system

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Counts of Louvain: new move request

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Smaller balls of fire

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