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Facto Post – Issue 2 – 13 July 2017

Welcome to The Misplaced Pages Adventure!

Hi RexxS! We're so happy you wanted to play to learn, as a friendly and fun way to get into our community and mission. I think these links might be helpful to you as you get started.

• The Misplaced Pages Adventure Start Page
• The Misplaced Pages Adventure Lounge
• The Teahouse new editor help space
• Misplaced Pages Help pages

-- 23:52, Wednesday, January 17, 2018 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:BSAC logo 2012.png

Thanks for uploading File:BSAC logo 2012.png. The image description page currently specifies that the image is non-free and may only be used on Misplaced Pages under a claim of fair use. However, the image is currently not used in any articles on Misplaced Pages. If the image was previously in an article, please go to the article and see why it was removed. You may add it back if you think that that will be useful. However, please note that images for which a replacement could be created are not acceptable for use on Misplaced Pages (see our policy for non-free media).

Note that any non-free images not used in any articles will be deleted after seven days, as described in section F5 of the criteria for speedy deletion. Thank you. --B-bot (talk) 18:30, 5 March 2018 (UTC)

Facto Post – Issue 10 – 12 March 2018

Facto Post – Issue 10 – 12 March 2018 [REDACTED] Milestone for mix'n'match Around the time in February when Wikidata clicked past item Q50000000, another milestone was reached: the mix'n'match tool uploaded its 1000th dataset. Concisely defined by its author, Magnus Manske, it works "to match entries in external catalogs to Wikidata". The total number of entries is now well into eight figures, and more are constantly being added: a couple of new catalogs each day is normal. Since the end of 2013, mix'n'match has gradually come to play a significant part in adding statements to Wikidata. Particularly in areas with the flavour of digital humanities, but datasets can of course be about practically anything. There is a catalog on skyscrapers, and two on spiders. These days mix'n'match can be used in numerous modes, from the relaxed gamified click through a catalog looking for matches, with prompts, to the fantastically useful and often demanding search across all catalogs. I'll type that again: you can search 1000+ datasets from the simple box at the top right. The drop-down menu top left offers "creation candidates", Magnus's personal favourite. m:Mix'n'match/Manual for more. For the Wikidatan, a key point is that these matches, however carried out, add statements to Wikidata if, and naturally only if, there is a Wikidata property associated with the catalog. For everyone, however, the hands-on experience of deciding of what is a good match is an education, in a scholarly area, biographical catalogs being particularly fraught. Underpinning recent rapid progress is an open infrastructure for scraping and uploading. Congratulations to Magnus, our data Stakhanovite! Links Misplaced Pages goes 3D allowing users to upload .STLs for digital reference, Beau Jackson for 3dprintingindustry.com, February 22 2018 WikiCite report (video) Formal publication and announcement of ISBN citation dataset, see Twitter post, February 23 2018 Plotting the Course Through Charted Waters, workshop on data visualization literacy from Mikhail Popov, Wikimedia Foundation Using Wikidata to build an authority list of Holocaust-era ghettos, Nancy Cooey, United States Holocaust Memorial Museum, February 12 2018 Why Should You Learn SPARQL? Wikidata! Mark Longair, blogpost November 29 2017 Back to the future: Does graph database success hang on query language?, George Anadiotis for Big on Data, March 5 2018 To subscribe to Facto Post go to Misplaced Pages:Facto Post mailing list. For the ways to unsubscribe, see below. Editor Charles Matthews, for ContentMine. Please leave feedback for him. Back numbers are here. Reminder: WikiFactMine pages on Wikidata are at WD:WFM. If you wish to receive no further issues of Facto Post, please remove your name from our mailing list. Alternatively, to opt out of all massmessage mailings, you may add Category:Wikipedians who opt out of message delivery to your user talk page. Newsletter delivered by MediaWiki message delivery

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 12:26, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

WikidataIB

Hi, RexxS! I noticed that you've contributed significantly to the WikidataIB module. I was wondering if you'd be willing to help me adjust it a bit for another wiki? – Srdjan m (talk) 12:19, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Hi, Srdjan m, I'd be happy to help if I can. Please let me know what you want. Cheers --RexxS (talk) 20:12, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Awesome! I'd like to make it work on bs.wiki. The exact copy of the English module is in the sandbox. On bs.wiki, there's just one way of writing BCE / BC – "p. n. e." and there are two date formats – "D. month-name YYYY." (default) and "D. M. YYYY." (for example, "March 4, 2018" would be either "4. mart 2018." or "4. 3. 2018."). Also, all ordinal numbers are followed by a dot – "3rd" would be "3." for instance. Are those things doable? – Srdjan m (talk) 20:24, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: It should be, but it will probably need your ability to translate. If you could replace the list of names of English months in line 27 with the translated names (it's Bosnian, right?), we could try out a number of cases on the talk page of the module sandbox at bs:Razgovor o modulu:WikidataIB/igralište. Let me know if you have any problems. --RexxS (talk) 20:44, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Alright, I translated that and a few other things. – Srdjan m (talk) 20:56, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: Excellent. I'm just removing the switch for "mdy"-style dates. I'll now add the . after the day-of-the-month and we can see how the tests look. --RexxS (talk) 21:05, 23 March 2018 (UTC)

Great, it's starting to look pretty good. :-) Now we just need the dot after the year and the option to use "D. M. YYYY." – Srdjan m (talk) 11:59, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: I've rewritten the date handling completely. Take a look at the tests on the talk page. I used |df=dMy for month names and |df=dmy for month numbers (and |df=y for just the year), but I can change that switch to whatever you would like. I've made an attempt to use translations into Bosnian on the talk page in case others want to see it. You will probably need to fix those . Cheers --RexxS (talk) 23:16, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

That looks great. I reckon there's no need to change the switch given that the functions are in English. Thanks a lot for taking the time to help out! :-) – Srdjan m (talk) 23:34, 24 March 2018 (UTC)

Hm, I've just noticed something a bit odd while testing this out. I wanted to get Andre Agassi's height from Wikidata (Q7407), so on bs.wiki I tried putting {{#invoke:WikidataIB/igralište |getValue |P2048 |name=height |fetchwikidata=ALL |onlysourced=false}} in the appropriate parameter of that article's infobox, but the output wasn't the best. I got "180 centimetar", which isn't grammatically correct (it should be "180 cm"). However, I do get "180 cm" here when I do the same (without the "/igralište" bit, obviously). Any idea why that is? Also, when I try to get his weight, I get "74 ±0 kilogram" both here and on bs.wiki. I wonder if there's a way to round that up or to get rid of the suffix? – Srdjan m (talk) 00:33, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

Also, is there a way to force the pen icon to show when list=ubl is used? – Srdjan m (talk) 16:36, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: Andre Agassi's weight on Wikidata had been set to literally "74 ±0", so I changed it to "74". However, I get "74 kilogram" / "180 centimetre" here (which are acceptable), and "180 centimetar" / "74 kilogram" on bs-wiki - I assume that the singular versions of the unit name are not idiomatically correct in Bosnian? I can see it would probably be preferable to use unit abbreviations, so I'll raise that point at Module talk:WikidataIB to see if there's consensus to change to abbreviated units here. Would you like me to write the code in bs:Modul:WikidataIB/igralište anyway so you can test it out?

I've now added the pen icon to list entries. --RexxS (talk) 18:25, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

Yeah, feel free to write the code on bs.wiki. Since my last message I ran into other types of data that use ±, though. For example, the number of matches played / points / goals and stuff for footballers (see this). I don't know what the best way to handle those numbers would be. Perhaps {{#invoke:String|match|s=348±1|^%d*|ignore_errors=true}} (with the WikidataIB call replacing the content of s, of course)? That would get rid of the pen, though. Maybe if the module could get rid of these things? Or if it could get rid of suffixes that follow numbers in general and let you add your own? – Srdjan m (talk) 18:44, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: I've amended the code so that it doesn't display ±0 when the range is zero. It will still give "±1" or "+2 -1" when ranges are significant. Hopefully, that should solve the problem, but let me know if there are cases where it doesn't. --RexxS (talk) 20:26, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m: About the unit abbreviations. On English Wiki, we always use the {{convert}} template when displaying lengths, weights, etc. because both SI and Imperial units are common throughout the English-speaking world, so in Template:Infobox telescope, Mike Peel has written the altitude value as:

• {{{altitude|{{#if:{{#property:P2044|from={{{qid|}}}}}|{{If first display both|{{#ifeq:{{#invoke:Wikidata|getUnits|P2044|qid={{{qid|}}}|FETCH_WIKIDATA}}|foot|{{convert|input=P2044|qid={{{qid|}}}|m|abbr=on}}|{{convert|input=P2044|qid={{{qid|}}}|ft|abbr=on}} }}|{{#ifeq:{{{refs|no}}}|yes|{{wikidata|references|normal+|{{{qid|}}}|P2044}} }}{{EditAtWikidata|pid=P2044|qid={{{qid|}}} }} }} }} }}}

That is complex and relies on the older Module:Wikidata. I think I'll try something a bit simpler for bs:Modul:WikidataIB/igralište. Rather than rely on other templates or an expensive call to read the unit abbreviation, I'm going to simply create a list of common units that have easily recognisable abbreviations and do a substitution for those cases. Let's see how that works out. --RexxS (talk) 20:40, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

I'd be happy to see that code swapped out with something simpler. ;-) Also, I added units to the infobox on Commons today, and that's a bit rough around the edges (convert is rather out-of-date there at the moment), so anything you can do to improve things would also be appreciated there. (BTW, @Johnuniq: might be interested here too.) Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 20:54, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

A semi-related question… check out this testcase. I've set "Žanr" to use hlist because I can't figure out how to capitalize every item in an unbulleted list. Is that even possible? I've tried using String2 with sentence, but that obviously only capitalizes the first word, and I don't think if it handles non-ASCII characters well. – Srdjan m (talk) 21:20, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

@Srdjan m and Mike Peel: - On bs-wiki, I've made the unit abbreviations default, so that the weight of Andre Agassi (Q7407) is 74 kg. On the en-wiki, I've added a boolean parameter (undocumented) |unitabbr= that defaults to false, but will enable the code to replace some unit names with km/m/cm/mm/kg/g/mg/ml (i.e. commonly recognised abbreviations). Please let me know if you want more – or just insert them in the module after line 53. Format is:

• (the Wikidata Qid for the unit) = "rx" (the unit abbreviation)

So here we get:

• {{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |qid=Q7407 |P2048 |name=height |fetchwikidata=ALL |onlysourced=false}} → 180 centimetre 
• {{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |qid=Q7407 |P2067 |name=height |fetchwikidata=ALL |onlysourced=false}} → 74 kilogram 
• {{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |qid=Q7407 |P2048 |name=height |fetchwikidata=ALL |onlysourced=false |unitabbr=true}} → 180 cm 
• {{#invoke:WikidataIB |getValue |qid=Q7407 |P2067 |name=height |fetchwikidata=ALL |onlysourced=false |unitabbr=true}} → 74 kg 

As usual the code recognises common variants: the values are case-insensitive; "0", "", "no" and "false" are all false; anything else is true.

I'll look at the other issues later. --RexxS (talk) 22:09, 26 March 2018 (UTC)

Reflist

The reflist parameter "em" is outdated, the template now creates columns on it's own when they're needed.★Trekker (talk) 05:17, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

@*Treker: Rubbish. There is no parameter called "em", and I know what the template does because I wrote most of the current implementation. Please don't come here spouting nonsense about stuff that you don't understand. See the conversation at Template talk:Reflist #Columns and try to get some clue about why there's a difference between leaving the default and deliberately specifying |colwidth=30em. And don't fucking edit-war on a Featured Article: your change was reverted; you go to the talk page. --RexxS (talk) 11:57, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

Wow, needlessly rude. I undid your edit once, that's not an edit war. Get some anger management maybe, I did nothing to be uncivil towards you.★Trekker (talk) 15:53, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

Be so nice and never ping me again, I don't want conversations with people like you.★Trekker (talk) 15:55, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

@*Treker: You have the nerve to come here with absolutely no understanding and give me a cock-and-bull story about non-existent parameters, then get upset when I put you straight? You needlessly altered a Featured Article, then repeated the same edit when you were reverted. Read WP:BRD and try to work out where you went wrong your edit-warring. When you've made some real contributions to Misplaced Pages, and have got some clue, you'll have some standing to comment. In the meantime keep your inane ramblings clear of me. --RexxS (talk) 17:45, 25 March 2018 (UTC)

Please help

Hi, I have noticed from looking at Module:WikidataIB that you are very knowledgeable about Wikidata. I raised a very serious editing issue involving it over at Template talk:Infobox medical condition (new)#Very confusing "edit on Wikidata", but nothing has been done about it. I have offered a solution on the page. I would be very grateful if you could implement it on the template, and also on Template:Infobox medical condition, which has the same problem. Thank you! 101.174.207.212 (talk) 09:24, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

It's not really a Lua/Wikidata problem; it's just the way the infobox has been constructed. I've made an amended version at Template:Infobox medical condition (new)/sandbox, which might provide a solution, and commented in the discussion thread. Cheers --RexxS (talk) 12:04, 27 March 2018 (UTC)

Short descriptions on disambiguation pages

Hi RexxS, I have added the {{Short description}} to the main {{Disambiguation/sandbox}}, and it seems to display the short description in the disambiguation message text in the {{Disambiguation/testcases}} page, but I don't know if the short description displayed is accessible through the magic word. Could you check this? If it works we have a lot of pages that can be done this way. Cheers, · · · Peter (Southwood) : 10:03, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

@Peter: I've tested it by using Template:Disambiguation/sandbox in two articles: Alien and Aberdeen (disambiguation). The first has no extra parameters and the second has three. The sandbox version appears to behave as expected in both cases. The API calls now show the local value for the short description:

• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&prop=description&titles=Alien
• https://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?action=query&prop=description&titles=Aberdeen_(disambiguation)

Unless you can think of any more test cases, perhaps you would like to explain the proposed change at Template talk:Disambiguation (i.e. make an edit request). As soon as we have something that resembles consensus (or silence), I'll be happy to update the main template with the contents of the sandbox. But I'd give it a couple of days, anyway. P.S. making these kind of edit requests counts towards justifying asking for the template editor flag, which you would find useful. --RexxS (talk) 16:50, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Thanks RexxS, I will do that. Since it was the disambiguation crew that suggested it in the first place, I am hopeful that it will be supported by enough to make it uncontroversial. Cheers, · · · Peter (Southwood) : 19:41, 30 March 2018 (UTC)

Parity

"That means I believe we need to create another 1,000,000 biographies of women to reach parity (unless somebody can convince me that women are inherently less notable than men" - Seriously??? If "parity" were compatible with WP:NPV that would mean that "patriarchy" was just a myth. But it isn't, and a global, all history, encyclopedia should always have more men than women. I'm amazed to hear you expressing such views. None of the research attempts to work out what the appropriate ratio should be that I have seen can get above the low 20%s. The gender imbalance project does WP serious damage by perpetuating this myth. Johnbod (talk) 12:48, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Yes, seriously!!!, John. I have a daughter and I don't want her to live in a world where women are regarded as inferior and less accomplished. The earliest Greek society was profoundly matriarchal, so what? It's not a question of myth or fact; it's just a question of what sources we can find. If you want to believe that a truly comprehensive encyclopedia ought to have 20% women's biographies and 80% men's, that's up to you. I simply disagree. --RexxS (talk) 15:59, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

So patriarchy has never had any effect. Well, that's good news! Johnbod (talk) 16:03, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Strawman, John. It's obvious male-centred history and politics had an effect on what we can now read. Most medieval history was written by monks and not many of them were female. But just because in earlier times women had fewer sources that describe them, doesn't meant that no sources exist. Virtually the only near-contemporary source that tells us much about Boudica is Tacitus' Annals, but that's provided enough for an article and many later works. Of course if you contrast that with the multiple contemporary sources that paint a picture of Nero, there's a massive disparity. But Nero only has one Misplaced Pages biography, the same as Boudica. --RexxS (talk) 16:26, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

"male-centred history and politics", and indeed society as a whole, didn't just have "an effect on what we can now read", it had a huge effect on what happened. For example considerable efforts have been made by academics to expand knowledge of female artists from before 1800, but numerically there just aren't that many who we can hope to have any record of (as opposed to women in manuscript or embroidery workshops etc). Then there's formerly all-male categories such as soldiers (ok a handful of exceptions), MPs, FRSs, doctors and academics generally, sportspeople until pretty recently, and so on. It might be true that the "earliest Greek society was profoundly matriarchal" (although I think that's more than we actually know), but we just don't have the names, let alone any other details. Meanwhile women's health articles with high views (ask User:WhatamIdoing) and other non-biographical women-related topics continue to be neglected, and new editors continue to be funnelled to write bios of borderline notability and minimal views. There's no strawman: parity or neutrality - pick one. Johnbod (talk) 16:44, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

• Talk page stalker feeling feisty

Neutrality does not refer to the encyclopedia but to articles themselves. Reliable sources on a topic are considered reliable per the content and context not per comparisons to any other topic. So if I, for example, have an interest in the judicial system in Ireland which included women and one in particular and I find one good source on that topic, and that woman, that is enough to be considered reliable for that particular topic. We can as a 21st century document choose to begin to correct the imbalances of the past or to continue them. Our guides on sourcing are just that, guides; we as editors have it within our remit to adjust those guides to make sure we enter the next years of the century with an enlightened encyclopedia. Editors edit as they like on topics that interest them. No need to channel anyone anywhere. Often the women that young girls could emulate are hidden both in history and by the men they either served or worked in the same time as as for example, Camille Claudel, Rodin's mistress and model who for many years was hidden by obscurity and overshadowed by Rodin. I won't prolong that kind off injustice.(Littleolive oil (talk) 17:33, 3 April 2018 (UTC))

Nobody's asking you to - but she has had an article since 2002 and gets over 330 views a day. You won't get anywhere near parity with people that notable, though I certainly agree they should be the priority, if people must do bios. If NPOV doesn't stop the parity plan, WP:N will. Johnbod (talk) 19:01, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

• another TPS, but what started this conversation? Curious what got it started...Ealdgyth - Talk 21:03, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

@Ealdgyth: It was a sort of throw-away comment I made at Misplaced Pages:Autoconfirmed article creation trial/Request for comment on permanent implementation:

If I'm running an event for the Theoretical Roman Archaeological Conference, chances are that most participants will be working on existing articles. On the other hand, if I'm running an event related to Women in Red, I know that Misplaced Pages has about 1,250,000 biographies of men and only 250,000 biographies of women. That means I believe we need to create another 1,000,000 biographies of women to reach parity (unless somebody can convince me that women are inherently less notable than men). So those events will have a greater proportion of new article creation.

John's right of course that sources on notable women are far fewer than for notable men; but I still want us to work on reducing the effect of that disparity on our encyclopedia. Cheers --RexxS (talk) 21:22, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

It was this edit, though I hadn't realized it was quite so old. Johnbod (talk) 21:25, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

need help with Lua

Dear "RexxS"

I wanna make a module or template for Arabic Misplaced Pages, that serves the Arabic language.

The script I made is in Python.

Is it possible to transfer it to Lua, and most importantly is it gonna work on the wiki?!!

Nice regards. -- سامر (talk) 21:40, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Hi, سامر, Lua and Python share a lot of similarities in their data and control structures, so anyone experienced in Python should be able to pick up Lua quite quickly. They are sufficiently different, however, to mean that you can't just drop Python code into a Lua module and expect it to work. Unfortunately I neither speak nor read Arabic, so I can't be much direct help to you on that Misplaced Pages. Nevertheless, there are several good tutorials available on the web. Also the entire Lua documentation itself is at https://www.lua.org/manual/5.3/manual.html and the Scribunto (Lua extension for Misplaced Pages) documentation is at https://www.mediawiki.org/Extension:Scribunto/Lua_reference_manual - you'll need to study the sections on standard libraries as well as those on Scribunto libraries as much of the functionality of working in Lua on Misplaced Pages derives from those. Finally, you are always welcome to adapt code that you find in anything in Module: space as it's under a CC-BY-SA licence. Let me know how you get on. --RexxS (talk) 22:02, 3 April 2018 (UTC)

Arbcom case

I am sorry it's come to this, but Swarm forced my hand before even letting me post on the existing arbcom case so... --Tarage (talk) 06:42, 6 April 2018 (UTC)

@Tarage: You probably need to copy your statement onto a subpage of your user space, then summarise it and link to it from the ArbCom request page. You could break it up into logical blocks using paragraphs and list-markup to make it more readable. HTH --RexxS (talk) 13:49, 6 April 2018 (UTC)

I'll work on it later. --Tarage (talk) 00:21, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

RfC notice at Project Medicine

If you don't want to participate, you don't have to. I think you should strike your aggressive, and irrelevant, remarks. Ping not necessary, I am watching this page. Geogene (talk) 22:00, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

And I think that if you don't want to hear aggressive, highly relevant comments, you should stop edit-warring your unwelcome notifications back onto other editors' WikiProject. --RexxS (talk) 22:38, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

You are in no position to unilaterally determine what is "welcome" on any board or not. Geogene (talk) 22:54, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

And yet I didn't remove your unwanted post; another member of WPMED did. I won't be taking advice from somebody who doesn't even understand the meaning of the word "unilateral". Now stop trolling here, and get back under your bridge. --RexxS (talk) 23:09, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

Catalogue

Regarding this comment: what would be the most useful way of compiling such a catalogue of problems such that it would meet the standard of solid research to inform decision-making? Nikkimaria (talk) 23:58, 7 April 2018 (UTC)

Documenting what has as well, as has not, worked - which is what RexxS suggested -would be a good start. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 00:08, 8 April 2018 (UTC)

AN/I notice

There is currently a discussion at Misplaced Pages:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Geogene (talk) 03:48, 8 April 2018 (UTC)